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Is the spacing between stops on surface section of Eglington longer than the Spadina/St.Clair Streetcar? My gripe with Toronto streetcar is just how slow it is with so many stops like the King, Richmond, Queen stops on Spadina or the two stops on King by Lamport Stadium that is literally less than 30m. I think the TTC doesn’t put enough emphasis on the speed of the service by removing stops and increasing speed when safe (I think Steve Munro did an analysis on St.Clair that found the TTC saved almost no journey time even though they separated the streetcar).

Link: https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/13/travel-times-on-512-st-clair/ and for Spadina https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/11/how-slow-is-the-510-spadina-car/
 
Is the spacing between stops on surface section of Eglington longer than the Spadina/St.Clair Streetcar? My gripe with Toronto streetcar is just how slow it is with so many stops like the King, Richmond, Queen stops on Spadina or the two stops on King by Lamport Stadium that is literally less than 30m. I think the TTC doesn’t put enough emphasis on the speed of the service by removing stops and increasing speed when safe (I think Steve Munro did an analysis on St.Clair that found the TTC saved almost no journey time even though they separated the streetcar).

Link: https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/13/travel-times-on-512-st-clair/ and for Spadina https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/11/how-slow-is-the-510-spadina-car/

TTC wanted to space out the stops on the 512 ST. CLAIR, but the NIMBYs wouldn't have it. Ditto with the 510 SPADINA, the NIMBYs again. The TTC has been removing closely spaced bus and streetcar stops, but the opposition from the NIMBYs can be a battle.
 
I agree. A grade separated LRT line is like a metro and at grade line in the middle of the road is no better than streetcar.
There are plenty of cities out there where this is flat out untrue.

Toronto's implementation of LRT may leave a lot to be desired, but that says more about us than it does about LRT.

(That said I still think Eglinton east and west should have been elevated)
 
The original plans for the Crosstown did NOT include the Leslie Station/stop. Then the NIMBYs made it a battle to include it. The bad part was that instead of a south side stop, they put the (renamed) Sunnybrook Park stop in the middle of the road and intersection.

From link, dated February 12, 2013...

Eglinton-Crosstown LRT: Leasiders fight to put Leslie stop back on the map

cieglinton5.jpg

Condo dweller Maureen Dunn has a message for her Don Valley West MPP, Premier Kathleen Wynne: Put Leslie back on the Eglinton-Scarborough Crosstown LRT.

The stop is being eliminated as part of a change to the LRT construction plan. Disappointed condo-dwellers at Leslie and Eglinton and, nearby Leaside are vowing to fight the decision by Metrolinx.

Theirs is among the first major community complaints to surface as Metrolinx proceeds over the next eight years with construction of the $6.7 billion provincially funded LRT.

The provincial transportation agency has a team dedicated to community information and feedback. But some city officials say the dispute is exactly what they feared when Toronto and the TTC signed a master agreement giving Metrolinx the final say on the project.

In Dunn’s 400-unit building, 300 residents have signed a petition, asking to have the Leslie stop reinstated. So far, it’s made no difference.

Under the new construction plan Metrolinx wants to lengthen the LRT tunnel. Stopping at Leslie would mean building another underground station — at a cost of $80 to $100 million — in a location expected to attract relatively few riders.

The change, which has to be approved by the province, is a disappointment to residents like Dunn. Some bought their homes believing they would be steps from a transit stop.

“I’d have been really happy to jump on that LRT that avoids the traffic,” said Dunn, who drives but would prefer to take transit when she goes downtown to the opera. The bus trip takes too long because it gets snarled in traffic, she said.

Originally the Crosstown was supposed to run mostly underground from Black Creek Dr. in the west to about Laird Dr. in the east. Leslie would have been a relatively inexpensive surface stop, costing about $3 million.

But in December, Metrolinx announced it was looking at a new route to avoid issues with traffic, contaminated soil and the construction of a residential development near Brentcliffe Rd.

Metrolinx’s alternative — tunneling farther east to Don Mills Rd. — meant eliminating the stops at Leslie and Ferrand Dr.

Last month, to the relief of residents of Flemingdon and Thorncliffe Park, it announced it had restored the Ferrand surface stop.

But not Leslie.

“It would be the lowest ridership and most expensive station on the line,” said Jamie Robinson of community relations and communications for the Toronto Transit Project at Metrolinx.

Apart from the condos and a car dealership, the Leslie intersection is dominated by parkland. “When you look at the city’s official plan, there really is no substantial increase in residential development or ridership,” said Robinson.

Geoff Kettel, of the Leaside Property Owners’ Association, says the station could enhance park access. “(It) would actually serve the Don Valley Trail. The city wants to increase access to its trails for walking, biking and commuting. It would have been ideally situated to provide access to the Serena Gundy Park. To say there’s nobody living there might discount some potential usage,” he said.

The issue is precisely what Councillor Gord Perks (Ward 14, Parkdale-High Park) said he feared when the city signed over control of the new line to Metrolinx, an unelected body.

“The city can raise the issue, but at the end of the day they just provide advice. The province is required to hear our objection. They’re simply not required to implement it,” he said.

“The purpose of transit isn’t just to generate ridership. It’s to create a transit lifestyle in more neighbourhoods,” said Perks.

Residents haven’t given up. “There may be some time for sober second thoughts. Why couldn’t there be a viaduct across the valley so the LRT would pop out at the original place and go underground at Don Mills? It would allow the opportunity for a Leslie station either now or at some time in the future,” said Kettel.

Metrolinx doesn’t expect all the residents will change their mind, despite Metrolinx’s reinstatement of Ferrand and its extension of community consultations in the east end, said Robinson.

There is still time, he said, for people to speak with their city councillors and participate in the provincial environmental assessment process, he said, adding that Metrolinx doesn’t anticipate that any more stops will be eliminated.
 
Is the spacing between stops on surface section of Eglington longer than the Spadina/St.Clair Streetcar? My gripe with Toronto streetcar is just how slow it is with so many stops like the King, Richmond, Queen stops on Spadina or the two stops on King by Lamport Stadium that is literally less than 30m. I think the TTC doesn’t put enough emphasis on the speed of the service by removing stops and increasing speed when safe (I think Steve Munro did an analysis on St.Clair that found the TTC saved almost no journey time even though they separated the streetcar).

Link: https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/13/travel-times-on-512-st-clair/ and for Spadina https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/11/how-slow-is-the-510-spadina-car/
The TTC has been working to remove stops across the network. This work has been done over the past few years (you can find it on Steve Munro's site)
You are right about the lack of time saving with the St Clair and Spadina ROW. Too many stops +those left turns!
 
Is the spacing between stops on surface section of Eglington longer than the Spadina/St.Clair Streetcar? My gripe with Toronto streetcar is just how slow it is with so many stops like the King, Richmond, Queen stops on Spadina or the two stops on King by Lamport Stadium that is literally less than 30m. I think the TTC doesn’t put enough emphasis on the speed of the service by removing stops and increasing speed when safe (I think Steve Munro did an analysis on St.Clair that found the TTC saved almost no journey time even though they separated the streetcar).

Link: https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/13/travel-times-on-512-st-clair/ and for Spadina https://stevemunro.ca/2021/08/11/how-slow-is-the-510-spadina-car/
Its... better?

However that mostly comes down to them running in areas where there isn't much to begin with, and as such there aren't that many streets that you can have stops. When you look at the existence of stations like Stevenson, Ionview, and Driftwood, the TTC would have had 512 level stop spacing had the street density matched St. Clair.
 
The original plans for the Crosstown did NOT include the Leslie Station/stop. Then the NIMBYs made it a battle to include it.
The original plans did include it - it was the various later plans that removed it.

Surely asking for more stops in your neighbourhood is the opposite of a Nimby. Perhaps it's an Imby.

Though that the Leslie stop wasn't on the south side was a very bizarre choice - hopefully something that will be fixed one day in the distant future.
 
I guess that’s when it’d be helpful if there’s some integrated planning between transit and the city’s other transportation departments. If the stops are further apart, and they made modifications to the street to allow for safe biking from the surrounding neighbourhoods, would be good for the local residents and people that just want to get to their destination faster.
 
The original plans did include it - it was the various later plans that removed it.

Surely asking for more stops in your neighbourhood is the opposite of a Nimby. Perhaps it's an Imby.

Though that the Leslie stop wasn't on the south side was a very bizarre choice - hopefully something that will be fixed one day in the distant future.
The NIMBYs did not want to be bypassed, but failed to recognize that a south side stop was preferable. They just wanted a stop, period. They didn't include where to place the stop.
 
It's not really NIMBY in that they want the stop in their backyards, but it's still the NIMBY impulse - that your hyperlocal self-interest should take precedence over good planning and the interests of the community at large.
The term for that is YIMBY
 
If only it were so easy to be a YIMBY when you're talking about a 6 storey apartment building on an empty parking lot that will have negligible impact on your own property value, rather than a hundred million dollar train station that will immediately double the value of your apartment.
 
Took a quick photo of Yonge just north of Eglinton yesterday morning, facing southeast. Looks like there’s some concrete work being done in the centre median, with what looks like a staircase ramp in the middle of the street. I’m wondering if these are just temporary structures or part of the permanent conditions. Looking forward to this intersection open back up!


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