Soop
Active Member
Yeah, he's been quite vocal that he's not interested. He left Your Morning to start producing. Since the bullying story with his wife has died down, I don't think he wants that dredged up again.
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- Thread starter King of Kensington
- Start date
lenaitch
Senior Member
And Trudeau does (ummm, ahhhh)? Churchill mumbled and had a slight lisp. Then there is Chertien . . .
We need to focus on on more substantive matters.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
No, that’s the thinking that’ll get the LPC scuppered. It’s not fair, it’s not right, but it’s fact, women are held to a different standard. If Freeland‘s oration can’t rally the masses she’ll go down like Mr. Dithers himself. Taking the high ground and pretending manner of speech doesn’t matter is a road to ruin.
And perhaps we should stop accepting that as fact and work towards changing that.
Bayer
Senior Member
Indeed. I haven't had cable in 12 years and I haven't seen any of those vacuous tv debates since then; I don't even know what Freeland sounds like and I couldn't care less. All I know is she more than deserves a shot at the leadership.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
Ignorance shouldn’t be celebrated. Forget about the quality of her speech, we can agree that shouldn’t matter a fig, but you haven’t heard Freeland present on any topic; but she deserves a shot at the leadership? I’d suggest that needs to be an informed decision.
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syn
Senior Member
I've been very impressed with Freeland.
She's probably the front-runner if they had a leadership convention.
She's probably the front-runner if they had a leadership convention.
Bayer
Senior Member
It's a superficial aspect. I have no time for low-information TV news, speeches, and sound bites. Of course, I know it has an impact. I know what Trudeau sounds like and he gets on my last nerve, but this has no bearing on what he does, so I concentrate on what his government has and has not accomplished. I am interested in what Freeland can do; she could not possibly have negotiated free trade deals successfully while sounding like an idiot. That being said, if voters want a tall daddy with a booming voice to lead them by the hand, that's their prerogative.
lenaitch
Senior Member
Well, you may be right, but it doesn't make it right. Quite frankly, I don't hear anything in her speech that jumps out at me or rubs me the wrong way. There must be more to it than the polishing and packaging of the handlers. South of us, they elected a leader who struggled to form complete thoughts (Ford's not far off). I'm not aware of the machinations of German politics, but it seems Angela Merkel doesn't fit the typical mould but managed to hold power for 15 years.
Oratory hasn't been a prominent feature of western politics for a long time. I quite liked listening to the timing, patterns and cadence of Obama. I suppose it's in the ear of the beholder.
Northern Light
Superstar
She does have a distinct speech pattern. As well as a couple of noticeable body language tics (notably, she nods her head frequently when listening to someone talk).
Neither of these, of course, relate to her competency to hold the office of PM.
Would they affect her electability? I don't know.
Its important to say, successful candidates for office, both male and female have run the gambit of traits.
Our current PM certainly rode his looks and smoothness of speech in both official languages, rather than offering a substantive CV, intellectual heft/gravitas
Jean Chretien has little of the former; but did exude a folksy/self-deprecating charm.
But Stephen Harper was neither anyone's idea of a playboy, so to speak, nor particularly warm.
Its possible to get elected without relatability per se; if you're with the right party, in the right moment, and against the right opposition.
As example, Harper faced Dion, and Ignatieff from the Liberals, both of whom were university professors; but both came off as even more aloof than Harper.
Dion was further challenged by his limitations in English (which frankly was decent and far better than most anglo leader's French).....but he didn't
come off as funny, or warm or smooth....etc.. While Ignatieff has a slightly affected speech too, that combined with his having lived out of the country for much of his adult life, and appearing to have returned only to be anointed PM
was vulnerable to attack ads. In that case, Harper works as a candidate; but he didn't against Trudeau (Admittedly after a couple of terms of gov't that may have seen him exit anyway)....
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All of which is to say, substance should trump style, or at least be a pre-requisite for holding office.
But the right kind of style, from a candidate, male or female certainly helps with getting/holding office.
However, it isn't necessarily the outcome definer on its own.
tiffer24
Senior Member
C
christiesplits
Guest
Are you talking about GW Bush, Trump or Biden? All three could apply here.
Admiral Beez
Superstar
lenaitch
Senior Member
You're right. Of course, we all have our own distinctive speech patterns. I believe she grew up in a household with an eastern European born mother so maybe she picked up some speech patterns from her (we all draw at least part of our speech patterns from the environment we grow up in). The nodding 'tic' really isn't a speech pattern per se but ya, it does appear in debate environments. It is a tad distracting to me. I have a friend who doesn't that couple with repeated 'uh-huh' and in one-on-one conversation is really annoying.
What type of personality, style, speech that is ultimately successful is at least partially a product of the time. In pre-sound bite days, the likes of Pearson - who was an accomplished orator, and Diefenbaker - who came off as self-conscious grump, obviously worked, but would likely have much difficulty today. Unfortunately, today, the average voter is relying on the sound-bites. Back in the day, there was less emphasis on 'image management'.
Videodrome
Senior Member
O’Toole says Conservatives will respect ruling requiring MPs entering the Commons to be vaccinated
While Conservative Leader Erin O’Toole said he respects a new ruling requiring all MPs who enter the House of Commons precinct to be fully vaccinated, it remains unclear whether all of his caucus members will comply
www.theglobeandmail.com
Finally....