rbt
Senior Member
Not only that, but they would also demand service equivalent to TTC. Buses in Barrie would run every 20 minutes instead of every hour and to pay for it buses in Toronto would run every 20 minutes instead of every 10 or 15.
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- Thread starter drum118
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Not only that, but they would also demand service equivalent to TTC. Buses in Barrie would run every 20 minutes instead of every hour and to pay for it buses in Toronto would run every 20 minutes instead of every 10 or 15.
If City of Toronto handed over TTC, I expect the other cities would probably be keen to unburden themselves.
But how would they ever convince City of Toronto to give up control of TTC?
But the TTC is a pretty big and complex entity. Yes, the rationale could be made that if they can do it with the TTC, they can do it with anybody. However, I think that starting with a smaller, less complicated transit agency, working out the kinks on a smaller scale, and then applying the lessons learned to some larger agencies I think would be the better approach.
If Burlington saw a surge in transit ridership, a drop in operating cost, and reduced pressure on the City's budget, I'm sure that it would convince many other cities/regions (Oakville, Mississauga, Brampton, York Region, and Durham) to make the same switch. The TTC would be by far the biggest piece to chew, and you don't want to start with that much, unless you know for sure that you can chew it.
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Interesting point. I think that cities with smaller transit ridership would need to go into this with moderated expectations. I think a good PR campaign, coupled with slight increases in frequency (say from 20 minutes to 15), would be enough to placate most people. I think people would realize that a bus through low-density car-oriented suburbia isn't going to have the same demand and frequency as the Dufferin bus.
As long as they don't see a decrease in service as a result, I think most people would be satisfied. If anything, you could make a few capital expenses in lieu of bumping up frequencies (next bus signs, better shelters, etc). There are many ways to enhance the user experience, and not all of them have to be related to the frequency of routes.
doady
Senior Member
First of all, current TTC service is typically not 10-15 minute frequency.
Second of all, buses in Barrie don't currently operate at an hourly frequency except on Sunday or in the evenings.
Even if this new system actually wanted to, it would not require half of TTC service to be taken away just to give Barrie 20 minute service, as you suggest.
I'm not even sure Barrie would be part of this new system considering it doesn't connect to any other system than GO and there is no potential for integration with the rest of the local transit in the GTA.
Transit systems allocate service according to demand, even in the suburbs, and I don't see how that would change with a regional transit system.
Do buses in White Rock have the same frequencies as in Downtown Vancouver? Probably not...
DSC
Superstar
But how would they ever convince City of Toronto to give up control of TTC?
And why would anyone want to take it over? It is a huge expense (totally justified in my opinion but still TONS of $$$)
doady
Senior Member
nfitz
Superstar
It would be the better approach. But it isn't a politically likely approach. Only way it would work is if TTC was in. And that would be a unique political opportunity. There's a unique window to pull that off sometime after the provincial election, and before mid-2012 when people will start thinking about the next Toronto election.
drum118
Superstar
Start Saving all GO timetable, trip cards, maps and anything with maps and timetables on them as they will be history this fall. I am sticking my neck out for a fall release, but could be early 2012 at this time.
A total new look and feel of these items is on the move. Seen some of them with some likes as well dislikes, but still in the testing stage.
A total new look and feel of these items is on the move. Seen some of them with some likes as well dislikes, but still in the testing stage.
rbt
Senior Member
Ahh, so they improved service since I left. Good for them. There are many bus routes in Toronto that run with a 15 minute or better frequencies.
A Metrolinx takeover would be in name only. 90% of the staff total staff will have been former TTC employees and will bring current TTC culture with them. That culture would be spread to all Metrolinx operations as former TTC staff redistribute through the system. I.e. Centralize all train operations into existing TTC control centres.
Politics will remain essentially the same. Operating subsidies, presumably paid directly by the province, will be 1) competing against health care and education funding, and 2) be directed toward vote buying likely distributed based on population of a region rather than ridership or road congestion level.
The actual cost to provide service would increase dramatically. Toronto's amalgamation has shown us that all transit workers would be awarded the best contract out of the group. Bargaining also becomes more interesting as a strike takes out everything across the region OR the entire thing is an essential service.
All of that to get an integrated fare system? We can implement fare zones or fare by distance without integrating operations under a single umbrella.
FutureMayor
Active Member
Cooksville, Square One and Meadowvale gets some respect!
I'm excited about the new changes to the GO timetables and trip cards.
They will have a radical new look and feel, however will be a lot easier to read and understand.
One of the biggest change is the split of the Milton Route. Cooksville, Square One and Meadowvale will each have their very own dedicated timetables recognizing the fact they are all major transit nodes for a large majority of commuters.
I understand that the printed timetables will be ready for the fall 2011, however GO wants to launch the new online timetable at the same time. There may be a delay with the new website, which may push the relaunch to the winter/spring 2012.
Louroz
I'm excited about the new changes to the GO timetables and trip cards.
They will have a radical new look and feel, however will be a lot easier to read and understand.
One of the biggest change is the split of the Milton Route. Cooksville, Square One and Meadowvale will each have their very own dedicated timetables recognizing the fact they are all major transit nodes for a large majority of commuters.
I understand that the printed timetables will be ready for the fall 2011, however GO wants to launch the new online timetable at the same time. There may be a delay with the new website, which may push the relaunch to the winter/spring 2012.
Louroz
Dan416
Senior Member
Hmm I'm not sure how I feel about this split of the Milton route, even if it is just for the printed versions.
FutureMayor
Active Member
It makes less sense for Cooksville, Square One and Meadowvale GO Buses to be listed under “Milton” when a majority of GO Buses don’t even stop there anymore.
There are so many trip variations and express routes that having it all listed under the current Milton Timetable makes it ever increasingly complex and confusing to read.
There will also be a time in the very near future that GO Trains will also begin to run to Cooksville Station on the off peak in both directions like the Lakeshore Line.
That being said I strongly advocated that GO/Metrolinx keep the same colour codes already assigned to each line: i.e. Milton Line is always orange on the map and in the timetables.
Louroz
There are so many trip variations and express routes that having it all listed under the current Milton Timetable makes it ever increasingly complex and confusing to read.
There will also be a time in the very near future that GO Trains will also begin to run to Cooksville Station on the off peak in both directions like the Lakeshore Line.
That being said I strongly advocated that GO/Metrolinx keep the same colour codes already assigned to each line: i.e. Milton Line is always orange on the map and in the timetables.
Louroz
APTA-2048
Senior Member
Multiple routes actually serve the GO station. The whole Pickering network is practically based around the GO operation. All routes except the 109 service the station at rush hour, and all routes except the 107B eventually service the station off peak while serving the Town Centre too.
Dan416
Senior Member
But the name of the line is Milton. ALL trains go to Milton. ALL trains start at Milton. Cooksville isn't a line. It's a stop. It's no more important than Erindale or Streetsville or Meadowvale or Milton. Does every station need its own schedule? Of course not, that'd be insane. The only one that's not like the others is Square One, due to it not being on the Milton train line.
I don't really see anything "confusing" about how the schedules are now. But maybe it's because I've been riding the GO for so long.
GO already has the QuickTables for all GO train stations. If they expand on those, that's fine. But there's no reason to get rid of the traditional GO schedules. Cooksville and Square One are not their own line. They always have and always will be part of the Milton line service.
TOareaFan
Superstar
+1. Well said!