[SubHuman]

While briefly listening to radio after a newscast this morning, subway lines being repeatedly shut down by "trespassers at track level" was mentioned.
It can't be a new mentally unsound person doing this for the first time every time this happens, and I assume most likely involves a small number of them doing this time after time. As I've said in earlier posts in this thread, there's something very wrong somewhere in the system when people who are this dangerous to themselves (not to mention the disruptions to the TTC, which I think is a legitimate thing for the rest of to be complaining about) are repeatedly released to do this again and again, instead of being confined to some kind of institution.

 

[gabe]

I went to board a streetcar the other week, and was told by the driver it was out of service because a homeless guy urinated on the floor.

 

[turbanplanner]

I don't get why the subway police don't get the ability to have red/blue lights and run reds so that thousands don't have to wait longer during subway delays.

 

[picard102]

My father was in the city and rode the subway for the first time.
He got the full experience of people screaming at shadows and clearing out a car with the odor.

 

[crs1026]

I don't get why the subway police don't get the ability to have red/blue lights and run reds so that thousands don't have to wait longer during subway delays.

Well for starters, they are special constables, not police constables, and their authorities and powers are defined by law, not by TV producers.

My vague recollection is that the TTC security was delegated some authority for having emergency lights on vehicles a couple years back - but I am unable to find the source just at the moment. It might be in City Council or TTC Board minutes. My recollection was that this was done mostly to empower them to better handle traffic control, and enforce the Highway Traffic Act in relation to TTC loops and stations........and not to respond to emergencies.

And, really, TTC security are not first responders in the most narrow use of the term. Their attendance at incidents is not required so urgently that lights and sirens are justified. Metro Police, Fire, and EMS are the people who respond to do that. Transit security may take over the matter when they arrive, but any life saving or personal security issues will have been dealt with by then. The rest is just investigation and recovery.

The things that make subway delays so long are not related to the response time of TTC security. They get there soon enough for their role.

I would compare to why tow trucks aren't given lights and authority to race to traffic accidents, so they can be cleared faster. The answer is, tow trucks aren't needed until after any rescue or medical assistance is over and police have completed their tasks. Even there, the police investigation may not commence until a traffic officer arrives - the officers who show up first have one role (which makes the lights and sirens desirable) but the traffic officer is a different function and in no way "life and death".

We don't want transit security roaring all over town any more than we want tow trucks racing to the scene (we have some of that, and it's not a good thing).

- Paul

 

[picard102]

We don't want transit security roaring all over town any more than we want tow trucks racing to the scene (we have some of that, and it's not a good thing).

Agreed, so long as we have sufficient transit security roaming the system.

 

[turbanplanner]

Well for starters, they are special constables, not police constables, and their authorities and powers are defined by law, not by TV producers.

My vague recollection is that the TTC security was delegated some authority for having emergency lights on vehicles a couple years back - but I am unable to find the source just at the moment. It might be in City Council or TTC Board minutes. My recollection was that this was done mostly to empower them to better handle traffic control, and enforce the Highway Traffic Act in relation to TTC loops and stations........and not to respond to emergencies.

And, really, TTC security are not first responders in the most narrow use of the term. Their attendance at incidents is not required so urgently that lights and sirens are justified. Metro Police, Fire, and EMS are the people who respond to do that. Transit security may take over the matter when they arrive, but any life saving or personal security issues will have been dealt with by then. The rest is just investigation and recovery.

The things that make subway delays so long are not related to the response time of TTC security. They get there soon enough for their role.

I would compare to why tow trucks aren't given lights and authority to race to traffic accidents, so they can be cleared faster. The answer is, tow trucks aren't needed until after any rescue or medical assistance is over and police have completed their tasks. Even there, the police investigation may not commence until a traffic officer arrives - the officers who show up first have one role (which makes the lights and sirens desirable) but the traffic officer is a different function and in no way "life and death".

We don't want transit security roaring all over town any more than we want tow trucks racing to the scene (we have some of that, and it's not a good thing).

- Paul

I don't totally agree, I remember trains being stopped for 20+ mins at bay once and I had to wait until the constables came and arrested the person who caused the incident. OTOH I do also remember seeing police come on other occasions.
Tow trucks are motivated by profit and a lot of the guys have criminal convictions and mafia ties.

*edit* forgot to mention there are only 8-12 people per shift roaming the system and they travel in pairs so effectively 4-6 units, but I might be wrong/out of date.

The union acknowledges the TTC has indeed made efforts to increase the number of special constables patrolling the system. Currently, it says eight to 12 officers are on patrol on any given day.

Union representing TTC special constables calls for 'real solutions' after rash of violent transit incidents

The union representing special constables, fare inspectors, and security personnel at the Toronto Transit Commission (TTC) says it's been left out of ongoing safety discussions and is calling on the agency to “find real solutions” after a rash of violent incidents on transit this year.

toronto.ctvnews.ca

 

[SubHuman]

How often are the subway lines being shut down by "track trespassers"? The last mention I can find of any statistic goes back to 2018, and it seems to have become more common since then, along with the urinating causing streetcars to be temporarily removed from service.
How often is this the same small number of mentally unsound individuals doing this again and again?
I assume they are apprehended. I wish someone in local media would look into this subject to determine when and how, whether it's through negligence or a very misguided decision, these obviously mentally unsound people are released to wander around and do this repeatedly.

The P.A. announcements will sometimes specify "unauthorized person at track level", yet be followed a few minutes later by another saying only "security incident".
There seems to be a strange attitude from some who want to avoid acknowledging the situation -- even to the point of not wanting to acknowledge it's possible that there are people who are so mentally unsound and dangerous to themselves that they should be confined to some kind of institution -- and therefore avoid doing anything to improve the situation.

 

[evandyk]

With the colder weather, the increase in panhandling and other disruptive behaviour on the TTC has increased rapidly. I guess we are looking forward to another winter of the TTC acting as the shelter of last resort because the city refuses to make more effective arrangements.

 

[Jonny5]

With the colder weather, the increase in panhandling and other disruptive behaviour on the TTC has increased rapidly. I guess we are looking forward to another winter of the TTC acting as the shelter of last resort because the city refuses to make more effective arrangements.

The problem is it's not a shelter of last resort, the TTC is the five-star hotel of the shelter scene. Do whatever you want with no consequences; take drugs, drink, meth out, and there's only a 1% chance anyone will say anything to stop you.
Even if that 1% chance happens the response is "We have asked you politely a dozen times to stop doing this on the TTC. You leave us with no choice but to ask you politely once again."

 

[turbanplanner]

With the colder weather, the increase in panhandling and other disruptive behaviour on the TTC has increased rapidly. I guess we are looking forward to another winter of the TTC acting as the shelter of last resort because the city refuses to make more effective arrangements.

The city is spending almost $800 MILLION on the homeless, I can't imagine the cost to do things properly.

 

[Bojaxs]

With the colder weather, the increase in panhandling and other disruptive behaviour on the TTC has increased rapidly. I guess we are looking forward to another winter of the TTC acting as the shelter of last resort because the city refuses to make more effective arrangements.

So many people out on the streets don't like staying in shelters. Claim they're too noisy, too much harassment, can't get their fix cause they're not allowed to "light up" within the shelters.

Some homeless will stay at a shelter over night, but then go back out onto the streets during the day to panhandle. Including harassing riders on transit.

 

[gabe]

I've notice an uptick in homeless folks on the GO train as well. This afternoon a guy was begging for money on the Kitchener line while drinking a Laker Ice beer. I have seen homeless people camped out in the shelters in Brampton, Guelph and Kitchener is really bad. The entire downtown is full of drugged up zombies hunched over sleeping. I was in Ottawa a few weeks ago, it was just as bad as Toronto for homeless tent cities. Just terrible what's going on.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I've notice an uptick in homeless folks on the GO train as well. This afternoon a guy was begging for money on the Kitchener line while drinking a Laker Ice beer. I have seen homeless people camped out in the shelters in Brampton, Guelph and Kitchener is really bad. The entire downtown is full of drugged up zombies hunched over sleeping. I was in Ottawa a few weeks ago, it was just as bad as Toronto for homeless tent cities. Just terrible what's going on.

Yep, the issue is definitely percolating to the GO (and the suburbs). Substance users are one thing; I wonder how many of them were homeless due to the increasing rent of the past 5 years coupled with the now moribund job market.

AoD

 

[evandyk]

Despite what you read around here and elsewhere from certain posters, it's pretty well-established that the rate of homelessness in a city is closely linked with rent prices. Unless you think that more expensive cities just happen to have much higher rates of mental health and addiction issues than cheaper cities.