jmi22
Active Member
Do we make buses go through intersections at 10km an hour? Is general traffic crawling through intersections? Genuinely what is your argument?
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jmi22
Active Member
Exactly, if this really is true then every lrt project in the country should be scrapped ASAP. Any form of on street transportation that supposedly necessitates a near full stop at every intersection regardless of the signal is not a viable form of urban transit. I'd also like to note that our massive existing streetcar network that runs though the most pedestrian dense streets in the country move through intersections at speed (except for where switches lay) and yet we do not see a half dozen pedestrians bouncing of the front of streetcars daily, and this is in mixed traffic where sight lines of the streetcars are obscured by parking and other vehicles on the road.
Jonny5
Senior Member
I would be shocked if even one single streetcar in Toronto has ever passed 60 kp/h this entire year, and I might push that out to the past ten years if not for that one late night in an ALRV on the 301 at 2:00 a.m. which cleared Long Branch to Humber so fast I seriously was concerned the back section was going to derail several times.
T3G
Senior Member
I will disagree with one thing - we do slow down on the streetcar network. I don't remember what they do on mixed traffic lines, it's been an age since I rode one, but the Harbourfront car slows at EVERY intersection. I mean good grief, it's one thing to be cautious during poor visibility or even at night, but if you try to tell me that in broad daylight, a professional transit driver can't see a car approaching the track from a decent distance away, I would advise you to shake your head.
The car crawls up the slope out of the tunnel, goes barely faster than walking speed towards York Street, slows even more right before the crossing with York Streey in case our well paid professional driver somehow doesn't see a car approach, then goes barely faster at walking speed onward. Rinse and repeat.
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Parkdalian
Senior Member
I imagine that the drivers don't want to go fast. Having your streetcar involved in an accident likely means you'll get told off by your superiors, you''ll have to do paperwork, and you might get screwed over in scheduling. You might get transferred to buses. (The horror!) Why risk all of that just so that you can finish your route a few minutes faster?
From a commuter's perspective, I'd MUCH rather prefer that a streetcar/LRV is NOT involved in an accident, and if that means drivers drive more slowly, so be it. We don't want the whole line messed up because of a moron trying to beat an LRV through an intersection!
Transit priority makes sense, but city planners seem very stuck on not making it happen. If any adult human can fix this, we should probably build very large statues of them.
From a commuter's perspective, I'd MUCH rather prefer that a streetcar/LRV is NOT involved in an accident, and if that means drivers drive more slowly, so be it. We don't want the whole line messed up because of a moron trying to beat an LRV through an intersection!
Transit priority makes sense, but city planners seem very stuck on not making it happen. If any adult human can fix this, we should probably build very large statues of them.
Bojaxs
Senior Member
From a commuters perspective, I want these trains to go as fast as they possibly can. Time is money.
If these LRVs don't move noticeably quicker than the downtown streetcars, than this entire project was an abject failure on every metric and we'd have been better off building a subway instead.
Edit: Thought you were talking about the Eglinton line. Didn't realise you were talking about the streetcars in general.
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drum118
Superstar
The problem coming out of the Bay tunnel to York St that it's a short distance with a probability of hitting a red light. Even if green, too short of a distance to get the speed up to only slow now for the stop west of York.
Speed been reduced for the ROW with the fear of Jaywalkers as well clueless pedestrians trying to cross at intersections against red lights and not stopping on the south side of the ROW on a red.
Have been on the Queen and King cars where drivers have exceeded the speed limits even in the days of the old fleet as well.
There is no reason CT cars can't reach the speed limit between stops in the ROW like they do in Europe. Don't expect to see it today until the summer once some track issues are dealt with if there are any there now.
T3G
Senior Member
And this is different from any other form of transit how...?
T3G
Senior Member
I find this to be a false dichotomy. Again, in broad daylight, you can see things around you. If there is heavy pedestrian activity, or you can see a car approaching, by all means slow down. But if there's nothing there, why have the vehicle slow down anyway? Makes about as much sense as having a bus run at a slower speed even when there is no roadworks, in case there might be roadworks. I'm just waiting for my next ride on the Harbourfront car, where a driver misses their light because they slowed down for a ghost car.
reinventingthewheel
Active Member
I say put a big ol’ plow on the front of these LRVs. If they go speeding through an intersection with straight tracks and no switches then they can safely bash through small motor vehicles without LRV damage or shearing on the rails. A little whiplash will be fine for passengers, builds character!
ssiguy2
Senior Member
One would thinks so but nothing would surprise me, or Torontonians for that matter, when it comes to Eglinton.
micheal_can
Senior Member
We aren't in communist Soviet countries.... but there may be some merit to the idea.
Johnny Au
Superstar
jmi22
Active Member
Yes this is an oddity of the network i've never seen an explanation for, but on row lines the TTC feels the need to slow at intersections, but on mixed traffic lines with much tighter lines of sight and tighter streets no such regulation is in place. If anything this really just shows the fundamentally broken and illogical the state of streetcar operations.
Amare
Senior Member
Streetcars usually slow at all signalized intersections now, regardless of whether they operate in an ROW or now. It's part of the TTC's idiotic SOP for streetcars.
The effect likely feels more pronounced on routes which operate in an ROW since streetcars operate at a marginally higher rate of speed.