Torontovibe

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Thanks. Old satellite images confirm that all accesses were gated.

I get some here seem to want it to be a park, but I just think that's a massive waste of land. The area is relatively isolated and very, very large. A park would likely be lightly used given the lack of local population, and would do nothing to add to the city's entertainment options which was the original intent of Ontario Place.
Ontario Place already has a new park, Trillium Park, just east of the main park and it is never very crowded. In fact, it has always been empty when I went there. Ontario Place is surrounded by parks on all sides, so there is no lack of public parkland here. We don't need more empty, passive parkland. We need fun things for adults and children to do year round. We need to increase tourism and provide good paying jobs. If done properly, we can accomplish more than one objective here. Why not have a bit of everything and make Ontario Place appeal to a broad spectrum of the population. Keep parts of it free or affordable but also offer some upscale, paid attractions so it is accessible to as many people as possible. Making this park a year round attraction is important too.

Listen, I'm as cynical as the next guy and I am no fan of the Ford government but I think this might be a good start to turning around Ontario Place and we can always add to it or change things around after a change of government. Improvements can always be made, while respecting contracts. We've got to start somewhere and this plan seems decent to me but we need to keep pressure on Ford to do something with the parking lots, integrating OP with Exhibition Place and also public transit access. Those huge parking lots could provide valuable space for new attractions or some better use than parking.
 

W. K. Lis

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Beautiful examples.

Can't help but feel like Toronto's version would have random chunks of asphalt and the trees replaced with crooked hydro poles.

Let's hope we've learned something.
With Toronto's suburban Councillors, they'll demand no benches (to keep the homeless off them).

Sculpture of Jesus the Homeless​

jesus_statue.jpg
From link.
 

Torontovibe

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Correct, you had to pay to enter.

From the Wikipedia entry:

The Ontario Place theme park operated annually during the summer months from 1971 until 2011. Designed originally to promote the Province of Ontario through exhibits and entertainment,[1] its focus changed over time to be that of a theme park for families with a water park, a children's play area, and amusement rides. Exhibits in the pods were discontinued and the pods became a venue for private events. The Forum concert stage had long been a primary draw to Ontario Place in its early years as it offered free concerts by a wide variety of prominent artists, for free with the price of admission to the park.
There were periods where it was free too. I remember if you collected 3 milk carton tops you got in FREE! The price for admission had 2 options, admission with rides/attractions or just general grounds admission, which was low priced. Ontario Place was always very accessible. There was always some company giving away free general admission passes.
 

interchange42

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Well, this took most of the day… front page story. Hopefully you'll find some new info in their, maybe not, but I've tried to put all the major points of what has been announced into one article.

I'll have some detail renderings to post in here later… after dinner sometime.

42
 

Northern Light

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Well, this took most of the day… front page story. Hopefully you'll find some new info in their, maybe not, but I've tried to put all the major points of what has been announced into one article.

I'll have some detail renderings to post in here later… after dinner sometime.

42

Excellent work! Very much appreciated.

I'm not going to copy/paste the Front Page article linked above, it's very much worth a read!

That said........I will highlight this bit:

The government is also talking with the Ontario Science Centre about creating "science-related tourism and educational programming at the Cinesphere and pod complex,"

That bit intrigues and pleases me.
 

Bluffers416

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I can see expanding the Budwisers venue for years round us being successful long term. The outdoor playground will have to reinvent itself every few years to stay profitable. I don't see this kind of spa complex working here. My guess it would fail to turn a profit and go under within a decade of opening.

Great to see that the Cineshpere and Pods are being refurbished. Hopefully they'll be put to good use. I always thought the Pods would be perfect gallery spaces that featured the works of artists from around Ontario.
 

interchange42

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Okay, dinnered. Some slightly closer-up pics and their wider shots:

45847-136002.jpg

45847-136003.jpg


I see why @Johnny Au thought we were getting two venues here; that's quite the two lower sections, seems like more space than necessary for back-of-house. I have crawled around the BOH at the Budweiser stage, and yes, there is lots of dressing room space, management offices, equipment staging area, etc. Whatever they are planning here would be far in excess of what they have now if those other areas at ground level (and you can see it in back as well) are not public spaces.

Meanwhile, the bigger deal in these two pics is that the East Entrance to Ontario Place is simply gone, the channel filled in, and the East Island turned into a peninsula. However, as no architect has been announced for this facility yet, and as they don't plan to have this up and running until (close to) 2030, I'd say that everything you see here is likely notional at this point, and not to be taken too seriously as an example of a ready-for-submission proposal.

45847-136006.jpg

45847-136007.jpg


Yes, everything here looks very cool, mostly because it cannot possibly be supported with the impossibly slender mullions on view… or is it that far off? What Therme have built so far actually does look somewhat like what is depicted here at their Schwarzwald location in Deutschland:

3580_8_Basisseiten_Palmen_Header_2880x1500px.jpg


That part of Europe definitely deals with snowy winters so, what you're seeing above is not out-of-the-realm-of-the-possible here. (And here's more of the plans for here…)

45847-136018.jpg

45847-136019.jpg


Okay, okay, so they are fudging it somewhat... but still, the pic above shows that the framing doesn't have to be super heavy.

Meanwhile, things;

Is that an glass-sided rooftop pool, upper left below? Looks to be.

45847-136017.jpg


Is that a total replacement and widening of the bridge from the CNE over the Lake Shore? I'm saying yes. Looks like there's also a new accessible entry cut into the hill that the West Entrance rest on now.

45847-136014.jpg


If you're a Therme customer, once you've gone through the entrance pavilion, you cross to the West Island inside that second level of the bridge, below left. If you're enjoying the free public grounds, no climate controlled crossing for you, you're on the bridge's exterior deck (and why would you want to be inside on beautiful day anyway?).

45847-136012.jpg

45847-136013.jpg


That is a crazy big sailboat. Anyway, below, that's the view from the world's tallest pennyfarthing on the Martin Goodman trail, or maybe your drone.

45847-136009.jpg

45847-136010.jpg


And finally…

nope, I'm done.

42
 

UtakataNoAnnex

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The government is also talking with the Ontario Science Centre about creating "science-related tourism and educational programming at the Cinesphere and pod complex,"

That bit intrigues and pleases me.
Or scares me...depending how this will pan out.
 

interchange42

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I can see expanding the Budwisers venue for years round us being successful long term. The outdoor playground will have to reinvent itself every few years to stay profitable. I don't see this kind of spa complex working here. My guess it would fail to turn a profit and go under within a decade of opening.
Their location in Bucharest has become Romania's biggest tourist attraction, so, lots of Romanians and other visitors say "not so fast, mister".

42
 

SubHuman

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... Accessible if you use a car. Not so much if you use public transit. They have to fix that, without transferring from the streetcars.
Don't like safariing across the parking lots to and Ontario Place, from and to the streetcars.
camelparking.jpg
From link.
And the proposed rebuilt amphitheatre would have up to 20,000 people (instead of 15,000 at present) making the trek, or 9,000 in the winter. As I said before, rebuilding a new indoor/outdoor venue at the same location seems like an unrealistic concept. They didn't even bother to produce another rendering to show the winter version of the rebuilt amphitheatre with the supposed mechanized walls closed. It all might be just a bluff for the next year or so, until the other Exhibition Place entertainment venue proposal goes away, and Live Nation could then decide a new venue closer to the Exhibition GO/TTC station would make more sense.
 
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UtakataNoAnnex

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Those renderings are very pretty, Mr. 42. Like those fancy ones for that Orbit thingy in Innisfil...

...but I can't help think this would have been a more visionary and inclusive revitalization under a better government. It all feels gimmicky and missed opportunities that will leave Ontario Place boarded up and bankrupt again, IMO.
 

kotsy

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Not to mention that given how secluded the area is. One can only imagine was seediness would take place in a park that close to the lake with no supervision. I (and I imagine many others) would not go there past sunset if it was a park and only a park.
Actually, recently they started closing access to OP & Trillium Park from 11pm-6am. It's actually been a thorn in my side as I try to get into there to take sunrise photos :mad:
 

Irishmonk

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I've thought for years that the western island would make a great location for a First Nations history museum--and some kind of memorial/monument as well. It could incorporate some of those pretty glass domes posted upthread but they would be used to house recreations of local old growth forests, indigenous communities and what have you. The overall theme or spirit of the place would be In keeping with the original mission of 1970s Ontario educationment, but switched out with what existed beforehand. Kind of a Pre-Ontario Place, if you will.

Frankly, It's high time we properly acknowledged the people whose land we currently occupy.
 

Northern Light

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Their location in Bucharest has become Romania's biggest tourist attraction, so, lots of Romanians and other visitors say "not so fast, mister".

42

Hmmm.

At first blush, the most recent stats I can are from 2018.

They put Toronto at the #53 most visited City by international visitors in the world.

Bucharest was #81; 2 full years after the Therme facility opened.

It's only been open since 2016.

That list is from here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_cities_by_international_visitors

*****

I will note, lists vary widely, as you can see in the above linked page comparing Euromonitor vs Mastercard

So I wouldn't take these as absolute truths, but as a guide.

It would be interesting to see what this list looked like before Therme opened...........hmmm

***

I used 'The Way Back Machine'.........and the first catalogued version of this page is from 2018 with 2017 data.

Bucharest was actually #81 that year, and Toronto was #50, so both fell.
 

officedweller

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Yeah, there's no mention of what occupies the level under the amphitheatre.
The "indoor/outdoor" aspect of the venue is provided by retractable walls, not 2 facilities.

... my guess is a casino.

And I'm not sure how many people will pay to visit the spa side of the complex, even in winter.

Okay, dinnered. Some slightly closer-up pics and their wider shots:

45847-136003.jpg


I see why @Johnny Au thought we were getting two venues here; that's quite the two lower sections, seems like more space than necessary for back-of-house. I have crawled around the BOH at the Budweiser stage, and yes, there is lots of dressing room space, management offices, equipment staging area, etc. Whatever they are planning here would be far in excess of what they have now if those other areas at ground level (and you can see it in back as well) are not public spaces.
 

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