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wild goose chase

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I understand that the high cost of living means that Torontonian young adults likely stay at home longer to save money before being able to have a place of their own. Also, a diverse city like Toronto has many people growing up in cultures where it's more common to live with parents longer into adulthood.

However, what explains why Southern Ontario in particular has a slightly greater stats in young adults living in parents than most of Canada or other Canadian regions?

If it were cost of living only why do other Southern Ontario metro areas like Windsor, Barrie etc. still have higher shares than Vancouver, an expensive city? And apparently, on a finer scale, suburban and even exurban parts of Toronto's census metro area actually have more young people living with parents than the city, though those should be cheaper in terms of young adults affording a place to live.

Also, if it is a cultural thing (especially with ethnic minorities who prefer living in extended families), why would Southern Ontario (even more Anglo-Canadian areas by culture like Barrie or Oshawa) as a region rank higher than other urban regions like metro Vancouver, Montreal etc. more consistently?

It seems like the area where young adults live with parents is higher around the suburbs/exurbs of Toronto than suburbs/exurbs of other Canadian metro areas.

canada-living-with-parents-1.png


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I think it's a combination of price and population density. In terms of prices, Vancouver is really the only comparable to Toronto as real estate in large cities like Montreal and Calgary isn't as expensive. I think what separates Toronto and Vancouver is the fact that the Golden Horseshoe is so densely populated. Last I heard the average 1 bedroom in downtown Toronto is around $2k a month, which is a high price for someone in their 20s, not to mention that renting is very competitive now as well. If you cannot qualify for a mortgage and rent is too high, you're likely to stay at home longer.
 
It could also be a function of the demographics. Many of the people in Vancouver might be 'from away', meaning they don't have parents to live with.
 
Less than 10 Percent of Canadians Could Buy a House in Toronto

Posted on May 28, 2019

Income Requirements and Benchmark Home Prices by City:

  • Vancouver: House price: $1,441,000. Household Income needed: $240,000
  • Toronto: House price: $873,100. Household Income needed: $160,000
  • Victoria: House price: $741,000. Household Income needed: $140,000
  • Hamilton: House price: $630,000. Household Income needed: $120,000
  • Kitchener-Waterloo: House price: $523,720. Household Income needed: $110,000
  • Calgary: House price: $467,600. Household Income needed: $100,000.
  • Ottawa-Gatineau: House price: $444,500. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • London: House price: $426,236. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • Montreal: House price: $375,000. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Edmonton: House price: $372,100. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Saskatoon: House price: $301,900. Household Income needed: $70,000
  • Regina: House price: $275,900. Household Income needed: $70,000

 
Less than 10 Percent of Canadians Could Buy a House in Toronto

Posted on May 28, 2019

Income Requirements and Benchmark Home Prices by City:

  • Vancouver: House price: $1,441,000. Household Income needed: $240,000
  • Toronto: House price: $873,100. Household Income needed: $160,000
  • Victoria: House price: $741,000. Household Income needed: $140,000
  • Hamilton: House price: $630,000. Household Income needed: $120,000
  • Kitchener-Waterloo: House price: $523,720. Household Income needed: $110,000
  • Calgary: House price: $467,600. Household Income needed: $100,000.
  • Ottawa-Gatineau: House price: $444,500. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • London: House price: $426,236. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • Montreal: House price: $375,000. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Edmonton: House price: $372,100. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Saskatoon: House price: $301,900. Household Income needed: $70,000
  • Regina: House price: $275,900. Household Income needed: $70,000

It would be interesting to see stats for Windsor.
 
It would be interesting to see stats for Windsor.

According to reports, Windsor-Essex and London had the largest increases percentage-wise in house prices in Ontario between April 2017 and April 2019.

The average house price in Windsor-Essex jumped 25 per cent when sales from April were compared to April 2017. The average house price — which includes all types of housing including condos and attached homes — was $343,956 in April compared to $276,239 in April 2017, she said.

It was the highest increase in the 28 Ontario housing markets ranked in the report and is “quite considerable,” Graham said.

 
According to reports, Windsor-Essex and London had the largest increases percentage-wise in house prices in Ontario between April 2017 and April 2019.



It's really interesting that house prices in Windsor are skyrocketing. It could even end up being a more lively city than Detroit across the river (and Detroit is recovering).
 
It's really interesting that house prices in Windsor are skyrocketing. It could even end up being a more lively city than Detroit across the river (and Detroit is recovering).

Windsor's rising house prices also correlates with their population growth rate. Which percentage-wise is tied for third in all of Canada with Ottawa, and only behind Peterborough and Kitchener-Cambridge-Waterloo.


 
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Don't forget the high number of South Asian, Italian and Portuguese families, where living with parents until early adulthood is quite normal.
 
At this rate, most children of first generation immigrants. ;)
Not us Brits. My dad left home at 18, was married with three kids before he was 25, and moved to Canada on a corporate transfer. I arrived at 5 years old in 1976, by 18 my parents were suggesting I get a job in Ottawa between years at Carleton U., and by the time I graduated in 1996 there was definite pressure to leave the nest. First job in 1996, bought semi in Cabbagetown in 1998. Smartest move I ever made was departing my immigrant parents’ place ASAP. Prolonging childhood was not in the cards.

Now I appreciate that times has changed, and my teenage kids are under no pressure from my wife and I to get out. They can live here into their 30s and beyond if they want. But I can see it in eyes, their British blood pushing them to want to spread their wings. One is still in grade 11 and is already talking about moving out. Of course we’ll help them buy condos or whatever, so at least their launch won’t be a solo affair.

Things are changing in the UK though, with adult kippers ( Kids In Parents' Pockets Eroding Retirement Savings) taking hold https://www.theguardian.com/society/2009/dec/08/young-adults-living-parental-home-ons
 
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Less than 10 Percent of Canadians Could Buy a House in Toronto

Posted on May 28, 2019

Income Requirements and Benchmark Home Prices by City:

  • Vancouver: House price: $1,441,000. Household Income needed: $240,000
  • Toronto: House price: $873,100. Household Income needed: $160,000
  • Victoria: House price: $741,000. Household Income needed: $140,000
  • Hamilton: House price: $630,000. Household Income needed: $120,000
  • Kitchener-Waterloo: House price: $523,720. Household Income needed: $110,000
  • Calgary: House price: $467,600. Household Income needed: $100,000.
  • Ottawa-Gatineau: House price: $444,500. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • London: House price: $426,236. Household Income needed: $90,000
  • Montreal: House price: $375,000. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Edmonton: House price: $372,100. Household Income needed: $80,000
  • Saskatoon: House price: $301,900. Household Income needed: $70,000
  • Regina: House price: $275,900. Household Income needed: $70,000

Less than 10% of Canadians could buy an *average* house in Toronto. It's not like there are no properties listed for less than $873,000, actually, about half of listings are. Thus, Average.

As someone in their mid 20's - most people my age live at home because it's cheaper and they just don't see it as worth it to leave. I've lived away from home since I was 18 (other than summers when I was in University), but I'd say that's fairly uncommon. A lot of my friends live apart from their parents but it's because their parents don't live in the GTA. Almost all of them that have parents in the GTA still live at home, even as far as Milton, commuting downtown every day. I don't get it personally, my parents live in Whitby and I couldn't do that every day at all.

I think it's a bit of a cost thing, but also a cultural thing of the generation. People hear constantly how expensive rents are, have life pretty easy at home with free meals cooked for them, no rent, etc., and just don't care to leave. They'd rather spend their money on a car, clothes, going out, etc.
 
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Less than 10% of Canadians could buy an *average* house in Toronto. It's not like there are no properties listed for less than $873,000, actually, about half of listings are. Thus, Average.

As someone in their mid 20's - most people my age live at home because it's cheaper and they just don't see it as worth it to leave. I've lived away from home since I was 18 (other than summers when I was in University), but I'd say that's fairly uncommon. A lot of my friends live apart from their parents but it's because their parents don't live in the GTA. Almost all of them that have parents in the GTA still live at home, even as far as Milton, commuting downtown every day. I don't get it personally, my parents live in Whitby and I couldn't do that every day at all.

I think it's a bit of a cost thing, but also a cultural thing of the generation. People hear constantly how expensive rents are, have life pretty easy at home with free meals cooked for them, no rent, etc., and just don't care to leave. They'd rather spend their money on a car, clothes, going out, etc.

I'm 29 now and got my own place last year. I did live away from home for the first time when I was 19 and going to school briefly in Waterloo. But returned and finished my studies in Toronto. For myself, it was a combination of different factors.

Being able to save up enough and contributing towards being able to sustain my own place was huge. I didn't want to deal with worrying about rising rents and the pains of potentially having to move every so often. I also grew up in the West End of Toronto so everything was already super convenient. Getting downtown was easy. The areas that I lived around were also improving steadily, such as Bloordale, Junction, Geary. And I would hang out in areas like Dundas West and Parkdale more than downtown anyways.

I agree that many people that moved out early were because their family is from somewhere outside the GTA though. Within the past decade or so, the amount of young people from smaller towns in Ontario and out of province who've moved here has sharply risen.
 
Don't forget the high number of South Asian, Italian and Portuguese families, where living with parents until early adulthood is quite normal.

I had thought of this initially, but then I'm wondering why somewhere like Oshawa (which has less of these groups and is less expensive to boot) is nearly just as high. In the linked bar graph in my OP, the more diverse and more expensive Toronto CMA has 47.4% and the less diverse and less expensive Oshawa CMA has 47.2% young adults living with parents. Such a big difference in the city demographics but only a 0.2% difference between Oshawa and Toronto.

Yet the west coast in terms of the lower mainland, like Abbotsford-Mission, Vancouver, should be expensive, has lots of family oriented Asians, but is just under 40%. A lot of the non-southern Ontario places have lower shares of people living with parents in young adulthood. The difference isn't huge but noticeable.

Clearly there's something about Golden Horseshoe/southern Ontario that shows across-the-board higher shares than in other parts of Canada that's going on in terms of young adults living with parents.
 

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