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hkric88

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I was at yd-square today and I noticed that pedestrian signals for the upcoming scramble at yonge and dundas are installed. Sorry I don't have any pictures, but go check it out of you can! They are at all four corners, and are aimed at the opposite corner (or more specifically, at the centre of the intersection). Currently they are covered. Looks like this scramble could be up and running any day now... I can't wait!!
 
i also forgot to mention, at all four approaches, there are new signs disallowing any turns (both left and right) at all times.
 
and i misspelled 'scramble' in the thread title! awesome. :p
 
I've noticed it too. For the past couple weeks there's been construction workers at the intersections working on it. Redesigning traffic signal phases involves a surprising amount of work!

i also forgot to mention, at all four approaches, there are new signs disallowing any turns (both left and right) at all times.

Are these new signs? All turns at Y&D have been disallowed for as long as I know.
 
Are these new signs? All turns at Y&D have been disallowed for as long as I know.

I see, well I have not noticed them before, and because they seemed to be a logical complement to a scramble intersection, I assumed they were new. Apparently I was wrong.. :p
 
So Dundas Square will no longer be Toronto's Times Square, but Toronto's Shibuya. Cool!

NRT%20Shibuya%20Tokyo%20-%20youth-oriented%20shopping%20district%20by%20night%20with%20colourful%20advertisement%20lights%2001%203008x2000.jpg
 
Exactly! I have actually always called it 'our shibuya', and as you can see in that beautiful picture you posted there, y-d much more closely resembles shibuya than it does times square.
 
The no turns signs were pre-existing to the intersection. This will change once the scramble is in - right turns will be allowed on a favourable signal, since there won't be any pedestrians crossing to block the path. Left turn bans will probably remain, at least on Dundas, so streetcars are not delayed.
 
Oh, so pedestrians will have to wait up to two light phases to cross even one direction. I thought they would have allowed pedestrians to continue to cross with traffic. Not that the build-up of pedestrians would be a problem, of course.
 
All the more reason to treat it more as a de facto woonerf than a de jure scramble crossing...
 
Background:
City Council, at its meeting on October 22 and 23, 2007, adopted the staff report, “Sustainable Transportation Initiatives: Short-term Proposals†with amendments. The report contained several proposals for short-term initiatives to improve sustainable transportation in Toronto including pedestrian-focused initiatives. Staff recommended the installation of a pedestrian scramble phase at the Bloor Street/Bay Street and Bloor Street/Yonge Street intersections, and Council amended the report by including the installation at the Yonge Street/Dundas Street and Bay Street/Dundas Street intersections.
The first pedestrian scramble phase intersection will be installed at the Yonge Street/Dundas Street intersection on August 28, 2008 at approximately 11:00 a.m.
A pedestrian scramble phase (also known as the “Barnes’ Dance†or “exclusive pedestrian phaseâ€) gives a walk signal to pedestrians in all directions at the same time while drivers are stopped in all directions. The primary advantage is that pedestrians can cross the intersection safely without any conflicting motor vehicle movements as well as a decrease in the walk time for pedestrians wishing to cross from one corner to the opposite corner.
How the traffic signals will operate:

• Phase A: Pedestrians are allowed to cross north-south east-west as well as diagonally in both directions.

• Phase B: The north-south traffic is given the “green light†on Yonge Street with all pedestrian displays showing DON’T WALK.

• Phase C: The east-west traffic is given the “green light†on Dundas Street with all pedestrian displays showing DON’T WALK.

2764662225_657969d0b1_o.jpg


• At the Yonge Street/Dundas Street intersection, vehicle turning movements will continue to be prohibited; staff, however, will monitor the operation of the intersection and may consider allowing right turns in the future if appropriate.

• There will be accessible pedestrian signals and signs indicating the installation of a pedestrian scramble phase at this location.

• “Traffic Assistants†will be available on-site during the day of implementation to provide guidance to pedestrians on how the signal works.
Issues that may arise are:

• Pedestrian scramble phases can pose difficulty for blind and visually impaired pedestrians who use guide dogs and/or the sound of traffic as cues to cross the intersection. The City has been working with the blind and visually impaired community on this installation and will be providing enhancements to the accessible pedestrian signals.

• An increase in the signal’s cycle length due to the additional phase which can increase pedestrian wait times and vehicle delays.

• Pedestrians may not comply with pedestrian displays. As a result, pedestrian activity will be monitored to determine whether additional measures are required to address any problems.

• An increase in delays for pedestrians who only want to cross one leg of the intersection.
Research was conducted with other jurisdictions that have implemented pedestrian scramble phases. The jurisdictions include California, Florida, Colorado, New Zealand and Australia. They generally reported the following:

• A significant reduction in pedestrian-vehicle collisions.

• An increase in delays by both motorist and pedestrians due to longer signal cycle lengths.

• An increase in pedestrian violations due to longer wait times especially during the parallel vehicle green indication.

What I don't understand is if there is an increase in pedestrian violations due to longer wait times, how does that translate into a significant reduction in pedestrian-vehicle collisions?
 
What I don't get is the "don't walk" during traffic phases even while right turns will continue to be banned. Will traffic phases be shorter?

And I would think I would be more informed about an issue like this than the average Torontonian.
 
scrambulous

What I don't get is the "don't walk" during traffic phases even while right turns will continue to be banned. Will traffic phases be shorter?

yah -- this isn't a stealth move to reinstate turns at Y/D, izzit?

ps- posted an LA news link in the general scblemra thread -- they are getting more than ten, it seems
 

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