[syn]

Then explain the existing ridership on the corridor. Kipling is a huge station with about 50,000 passengers using it on a daily basis. That's one of the highest in the system. The point is that an area doesn't have to be dense, it has to be served by the demands of travel. In the case of Yonge, that's heading downtown. People from side streets funnel into Yonge and this is what generates the existing 120 K PPD along the corridor.

It's a terminal station. There's a GO connection. That doesn't mean extending the line west is any sort of sensible idea.

Just because Finch is busy doesn't mean a 5 stop extension in to Richmond Hill makes any sense, especially given other needs.

Build subways where subways were meant to be built.

Why isn't Mississauga tripping over themselves to build a subway on Hurontario?

 

[Streety McCarface]

It's a terminal station. There's a GO connection. That doesn't mean extending the line west is any sort of sensible idea.

Just because Finch is busy doesn't mean a 5 stop extension in to Richmond Hill makes any sense, especially given other needs.

Build subways where subways were meant to be built.

Why isn't Mississauga tripping over themselves to build a subway on Hurontario?

The area you mentioned, Langstaff, is a future GO transitway terminal. It would be a terminal station for some YRT routes. Finch isn't just busy, YONGE STREET is busy. There is existing demand there that actually warrants a subway.

Mississauga is a car city that barely even wants the Hurontario LRT, let alone pay for a full fledged subway in a car-centred city.

 

[syn]

The area you mentioned, Langstaff, is a future GO transitway terminal. It would be a terminal station for some YRT routes. Finch isn't just busy, YONGE STREET is busy. There is existing demand there that actually warrants a subway.

Mississauga is a car city that barely even wants the Hurontario LRT, let alone pay for a full fledged subway in a car-centred city.

You have a very, very skewed idea of what Mississauga has become and what justifies a subway.

An LRT connected to Finch would be perfect for this corridor.

Mississauga has managed major growth (unlike Scarborough) without any kind of direct connection to the TTC. Hurontario is getting an LRT because that's what it warrants - the city can't afford to spend money on frivolous projects that make no sense given the full context of the situation.

I have no issue with this project - if it's built when it actually makes sense and other major needs are addressed first.

 

[BMO]

Yes. Exactly.

40 years after it opened, and the subway hasn't transformed the area.

We need to build this kind of infrastructure where it's needed.

I'm not suggesting no transit should be built in Richmond Hill, etc., but a subway is waste of money, especially given other needs.

And I'm sorry, but Yonge north of Steeles has nowhere near the density necessary to justify a subway.

Here is the area where Richmond Hill Centre Station would be:

https://www.google.com/maps/@43.8414763,-79.4301393,3a,75y,130.01h,92.89t/data=!3m7!1e1!3m5!1sqmn3Ymo8_3Mu9IXGM3LV7g!2e0!6s//geo1.ggpht.com/cbk?panoid=qmn3Ymo8_3Mu9IXGM3LV7g&output=thumbnail&cb_client=maps_sv.tactile.gps&thumb=2&w=203&h=100&yaw=42.807606&pitch=0&thumbfov=100!7i13312!8i6656

Let me guess - the people of Richmond Hill deserve a connection to Kelsey's Roadhouse, Indigo and The Brick. Anything less and they're being treated like 2nd class citizens!

You're being rude and overly confrontational, the likes I haven't seen from someone on this forum in a long time. Beyond this it sounds like you are ill-informed about what is going on north of Steeles where tremendous growth is occurring and high-rises have been built despite a lack of funding for a subway (just between Clark and Steeles there are 7 condos and another currently under construction and a few more already approved). Not to mention the entire corridor has been zoned and planned for transit-supportive densities between three different municipalities. All this and the corridor still represents one of the strongest transit corridors with hundreds of buses currently using Yonge Street daily. It's not a matter of if ridership will be there, but whether too much will be there. Even some of the most hardened Toronto-first advocates like Steve Munroe have conceded that this line is needed, even if he says the DRL is needed first.

So no, we can't just simply build an LRT for this corridor, because it's been proven time and again that a subway is justified and needed for this corridor.

 

[syn]

You're being rude and overly confrontational, the likes I haven't seen from someone on this forum in a long time.

Is that so. Suggesting we don't build this line now is rude?? If that's the case then you haven't been on this forum for very long at all.

The kind of density required is many times what would be provided by 7 condos - and that's not to mention the employment growth that's needed. You can find nearly 7 projects on the go in quite a few downtown blocks:

http://urbantoronto.ca/map/

An LRT could handle the ridership in this corridor well for a very long time.

 

[mdrejhon]

My two pennies:

Or a Canadian Nickel, since there's no Canadian pennies anymore.

DRL Long first or concurrently (must be hand-in-hand), and if so -- then let's not forget that the Yonge North subway extension won't be complete for another 10-15 years even if Ford begins the EAs now.

That timing is within the growth window.

But stopping the YNSE subway 1 stop south of the terminus (Langstaff) may be more sensible, as that area might be a better transfer/density point than the Richmond Hill GO stop -- that one is still too suburban. And GO trains can still interchange at Langstaff.

 

[micheal_can]

Extending the Yonge line north to RH Station makes sense. Here is why:

1) RH is a GO train stop. That means that people could actually go North to RH get on GO to go to Union instead of being jammed in a subway.

2) Two different VIVA lines go there. Eventually they will become LRT. This means that the future connections are there.

3) Finch is busy only because it is the last station. All of the YRT buses would go to RH. The buses north of Finch would likely go to Steeles or any other stations in between.

4) The demand is there. So, it is not like it will be empty.

However, before building this, I am hopeful that the DRL is operational.

 

[rbt]

..., because it's been proven time and again that a subway is justified and needed for this corridor.

To be fair, the EA justified it through bus ridership rather than walkins. Bus ridership would be perfectly happy and well served by higher capacity service on Bathurst, Don Mills, or possibly elsewhere.

I'm in favour of the Yonge extension (that's about the only subterranean suburban extension I'm in favour of) but largely because I expect an actual buildout with far more density than is shown in the EA. Yonge is one of the few streets where "if you build it they will come" has proven true.

 

[Rainforest]

But stopping the YNSE subway 1 stop south of the terminus (Langstaff) may be more sensible, as that area might be a better transfer/density point than the Richmond Hill GO stop -- that one is still too suburban. And GO trains can still interchange at Langstaff.

Wouldn't that mean getting only one high-density area (Langstaff) instead of two (both Langstaff and RHC) for almost same price?

 

[JSF-1]

Aren't Langstaff and RHC the exact same place? Richmond Hill GO is nothing but suburban wasteland. Also as an aside does the station at Langstaff include shifting the GO station north because I really got to ask what the hell is up with the GO station and Bus Terminal being that far apart.

 

[Rainforest]

Aren't Langstaff and RHC the exact same place?

No. They aren't far apart, but Langstaff neighborhood is south of the Hwy 407 / Hwy 7 corridor, while RHC is north of that corridor.

Richmond Hill GO is nothing but suburban wasteland.

Richmond Hill GO is 2 km further north from the proposed subway terminus. It is all confusing:
- Langstaff neighborhood is south of 407
- Langstaff GO station is mostly north of Hwy 7
- Richmond Hill Center and bus terminal are north of Hwy 7 and a bit north (long walk) from Langstaff GO station
- Richmond Hill GO station is 2 km further north

Also as an aside does the station at Langstaff include shifting the GO station north because I really got to ask what the hell is up with the GO station and Bus Terminal being that far apart.

I think the station was built long before the bus terminal. It would seem logical to shift it north but I'm not aware of any plans to actually do that.

 

[nfitz]

Aren't Langstaff and RHC the exact same place? Richmond Hill GO is nothing but suburban wasteland.

Yes you are correct - RHC is at Langstaff GO - which is paradoxically north of 407 and no longer related to Langstaff Road which is south of 407 at Yonge. Richmond Hill GO is north of Major Mackenzie. Presumably some renaming will be in order at some point.

 

[mdrejhon]

Is this area is the 'real' future terminus of the YNSE?

If so, Langstaff GO is really the "real" Richmond Hill TTC Subway Station -- not the Richmond Hill GO station --

 

[syn]

Extending the Yonge line north to RH Station makes sense. Here is why:

1) RH is a GO train stop. That means that people could actually go North to RH get on GO to go to Union instead of being jammed in a subway.

2) Two different VIVA lines go there. Eventually they will become LRT. This means that the future connections are there.

3) Finch is busy only because it is the last station. All of the YRT buses would go to RH. The buses north of Finch would likely go to Steeles or any other stations in between.

4) The demand is there. So, it is not like it will be empty.

However, before building this, I am hopeful that the DRL is operational.

The DRL long is critical - no question it needs to be done before this project.

 

[nfitz]

If so, Langstaff GO is really the "real" Richmond Hill TTC Subway Station -- not the Richmond Hill GO station --

Richmond Hill GO Station is at Major MacKenzie - almost 4 km further north.

The proposed Richmond Hill subway station is at Highway 7, near Langstaff GO. There's also the proposed subway station at Langstaff/Longbridge south of Highway 407, according to the current project map.

I don't believe anyone in this ten-year old thread has said that this phase of the work will extend the subway an extra 4 km to Richmond Hill GO Station at Major MacKenzie!