[nightstreak]

Why not? Bathurst just got one.

Bathurst doesn't have a multibillion dollar subway line running under it. Pro-car conservatives build transit to get transit out of the way of cars.

There's large swaths of Queen that will be far from the Ontario line. Anything west of Spadina for example. Though I could see an east bound 501 turning south there once the station at Queen Spadina opens.

I'm not suggesting the 501 be eliminated, only that it be reconfigured to reinvent its purpose so it doesn't fall victim to political death sentence for being redundant. Some years back, our resident transit expert Steve Munro advocated for splitting the 501 in two to avoid the cascading of issues down a 24km line in mixed traffic when something happens at any point along the way. That recommendation paired with the dual role of a downtown subway line performs — rapid cross downtown jumps and well spaced local hops — has convinced me that this is not only the correct approach but inevitable, if not planned before the line opens, will become evident once passengers are choosing the faster and more reliable subway and leaving the 501 empty through downtown.

 

[nfitz]

Bathurst won't have a multibillion dollar subway line running under it. Pro-car conservatives build transit to get transit out of the way of cars.

Queen doesn't have a subway under most of it either ... unless you are only going 3 subway stations.

Will you tell me that there shouldn't be bus lanes on Atwater because it has a metro going along it?

 

[officedweller]

I'm not suggesting the 501 be eliminated, only that it be reconfigured to reinvent its purpose so it doesn't fall victim to political death sentence for being redundant. Some years back, our resident transit expert Steve Munro advocated for splitting the 501 in two to avoid the cascading of issues down a 24km line in mixed traffic when something happens at any point along the way. That recommendation paired with the dual role of a downtown subway line performs — rapid cross downtown jumps and well spaced local hops — has convinced me that this is not only the correct approach but inevitable, if not planned before the line opens, will become evident once passengers are choosing the faster and more reliable subway and leaving the 501 empty through downtown.

Some people will stay on the streetcar to avoid the transfer, but if streetcars back up regularly in the central portion,
people will learn to transfer to the OL as soon as possible just to avoid the possibility of being stuck on the streetcar.

 

[416InTrouble]

The good news about metrolinx’ latest failure on Finch is we may actually get to transit priority light systems like the rest of the world got in 1993. Woot woot!

 

[nightstreak]

Queen doesn't have a subway under most of it either ... unless you are only going 3 subway stations.

You realize you're on the Ontario Line thread? This is about how the new subway line may force changes on the streetcar network, not about today's conditions. There will be 5 stations on Queen from Degrassi to Spadina and 3 more within under a 5 minute walk of Queen.

Will you tell me that there shouldn't be bus lanes on Atwater because it has a metro going along it?

Bus routes and streetcar infrastructure aren't the same and you know that. Please stop being disingenuous.

The good news about metrolinx’ latest failure on Finch is we may actually get to transit priority light systems like the rest of the world got in 1993. Woot woot!

Agree. I think this high profile failure will force the city to make policy changes and will protect Mayor Chow from Doug Ford who will not want a repeat of this on Eglinton. With the policies in place, we may even see TSP on King Street.

 

[Vortex112]

One thing I noticed from this blogTO article is that the tail tracks go even further north than I expected, what looks like less than 100m from the CP Belleville sub (at minimum? The image is cut off).

Does anyone know if they’re banked upward to pass over that rail corridor in the future? Or are we signed up for a rebuild for any northward extension of the Ontario Line.

 

[nfitz]

You realize you're on the Ontario Line thread? This is about how the new subway line may force changes on the streetcar network, not about today's conditions.

No one here is talking about today's conditions. This is an Ontario Line thread, and we are talking about future conditions.

There will be 5 stations on Queen from Degrassi to Spadina and 3 more within under a 5 minute walk of Queen.

Please stop being disengenious. The single Leslieville stop does little to help people move along Queen - a long way from any other stops; unless you actually live at that stop; which has never been a busy stop.

A relatively short section of Queen with subway stops will not do much to switch (future tense) people travelling from points west and points east to the subway. There's certainly be some loss, but certainly not enough to remove the justification of removing a bit of parking along Queen, so that there can be simultaneously a traffic lane and a streetcar lane. Ditto for Dundas from about Jarvis to Spadina, and College/Carlton from about Jarvis to Bay.

 

[nightstreak]

No one here is talking about today's conditions. This is an Ontario Line thread, and we are talking about future conditions.

You said:

Queen doesn't have a subway under most of it either ... unless you are only going 3 subway stations.

The Ontario Line will have the following FIVE (5) stations on Queen Street:

1. Riverdale-Leslieville
2. Moss Park
3. Queen-Yonge
4. Osgoode
5. Spadina

Do you know how to count past three? If not, then I'm the one who must apologize. People with special needs deserve some grace.

The single Leslieville stop does little to help people move along Queen - a long way from any other stops; unless you actually live at that stop; which has never been a busy stop.

Nobody said anything about eliminating the entire 501. In fact, I've been proposing maintaining the 501 (East) along Queen St to Victoria and 501 (West) along Queen to Bathurst throughout this entire discussion.

Nonetheless, Corktown Station is a 2 minute walk from Queen, or 250m. To exclude it just because it's on King is, yes, being disingenuous.

And King-Bathurst is a 5 minute walk from Queen to King or 400m, well within the standard 10 minute/800m walking distance expectation for a subway's service area.

If you want to have an intelligent discussion on the influence of the Ontario Line on rider patterns, I'm glad to. But begin on the foundation of facts rather than deliberately disingenuous omissions and misrepresentations.

 

[bearcat]

One thing I noticed from this blogTO article is that the tail tracks go even further north than I expected, what looks like less than 100m from the CP Belleville sub (at minimum? The image is cut off).
View attachment 702552
Does anyone know if they’re banked upward to pass over that rail corridor in the future? Or are we signed up for a rebuild for any northward extension of the Ontario Line.

it will cross the railway at grade with a diamond

 

[urbanclient]

In today's episode of Metrostinx...

[...]the numbers aren't public, but they aren't tracking well. The O/L is now significantly behind schedule and you can safely assume that means costs are up, more than a little.

For the record I am predicting a 2035 Ontario Line opening based on historical (lived) experience and a splash of wild-a** guessing. What with Line 5, Line 6, Go Expansion being 50% to 100% delayed. A ~10 year timeline easily becomes 15 to 20 years.

 

[torontowest91]

has anyone else walked across the bridge on queen street? shocked how deep it goes down already! wow

 

[adys123]

One thing I noticed from this blogTO article is that the tail tracks go even further north than I expected, what looks like less than 100m from the CP Belleville sub (at minimum? The image is cut off).
View attachment 702552
Does anyone know if they’re banked upward to pass over that rail corridor in the future? Or are we signed up for a rebuild for any northward extension of the Ontario Line.

Yes, the design is able to cross the rail corridor without a rebuild.

 

[hawc]

 

[kotsy]

Dundas & Logan bridge reconstruction update:

From Dundas:

From Logan:

 

[nfitz]

You said:



The Ontario Line will have the following FIVE (5) stations on Queen Street:

Good grief - please read for context. I was very clear for the dismissing the Leslieville/Riverside context, and I noted the relatively short distance between the other 4 station - from Queen/Spadina to Moss Park.

Do you know how to count past three? If not, then I'm the one who must apologize.

Simply because we disagree about the utility of 4 of the 8 stations that are somewhat proximate to Queen Street, does not give you the right to be so over the top rude and offensive. I really don't think anyone coming from the west pn a 501, is going to get off at Bathurst/King and walk up to Bathurst/Queen to get a 501!

Nobody said anything about eliminating the entire 501.

Indeed no one has mentioned it all - including myself.

If you want to have an intelligent discussion on the influence of the Ontario Line on rider patterns, I'm glad to. But begin on the foundation of facts rather than deliberately disingenuous omissions and misrepresentations.

I'm not being disingenuous. But surely going on about my counting the travel of 3 stops from Spadina to Moss Park (1 Osgood, 2 Yonge, 3 Moss Park) with such an inexcusably personal attack is not on. Heck, even if you mistook my response as being disingenuous, on a scale of 1 to 10, that's a 2 or 3. Making personal insults is a 9.

Nonetheless, Corktown Station is a 2 minute walk from Queen, or 250m. To exclude it just because it's on King is, yes, being disingenuous.

Do you think people travelling to Queen and Yonge are going to get off a 501 at Parliament, walk down to south of King, through FOUR busy traffic lights (personally I walk that all the time when there's no 504 coming, and it always seems to take forever to cross Richmond and Adelaide in particular).

And where do you get 250 metres? The distance from the centre of Queen/Parliament to King/Parliament is 330 metres. Bur the station entrance is not at King/Parliament! The station is on Berkeley, not Parliament.

The one entrance is on Berkeley, about 30 metres south of King. The other is about 15 metres south of King, and 35 metres east of Berkeley.

The walking distance from the Queen/Parliament westbound streetcar stop to the station doors is over 445 metres! It's not 250 metres, and it's not 2 minutes. I've waited many times for 2 minutes to cross at Richmond, and then another 2 minutes at Adelaide (it seems the lights are timed so that you always hit both walking, unless you run - what have you observed walking down Parliament Street).

If you want to get off at Queen/Parliament and walk 445 metres to Corktown station, why not instead walk the 460 metres (and only 2 traffic lights) to Moss Park station? Or stay on the 501 for only 2 stops?