[Thaboss]

Eglinton Crosstown will be a true game changer

You're gonna love it, but Rob Ford was right

markmcqueen.substack.com

It appears that this person was given acesses to line 5 two or three days ago along with some other journalists.

They've got some clips in there article if anyone cares to look.

 

[hw621]

For me also reliability is more important than speed. Speed is good to have, but reliability is essential. That's my own view, others may disagree.
That begs a question: How reliable will Line 5 be? In particular, how well will it maintain the scheduled headways. Will TTC do any better here than with streetcars.

Finch has neither...

 

[hw621]

the disastrous line 6 operations have been so depressing to the point that i'm kind of checked out on caring about any future transit developments. i have no faith that the people running things will do it properly. its like they are actively trying to make transit bad.

They don't need to try.

 

[pleaseLRT]

A concerning comment from a Line 5 operator:

"Line 5 op here: I’d like to point out that when they do open the line, plans are to have significantly reduced trains and operating hours. The biggest kink they haven’t been able to figure out and what made the testing run as long as it did is trains bunching up and getting bogged down. Poor station placement is a big factor; for example Ionview’s proximity to Kennedy and the fact that there’s an intersection at the portal coupled with the axle counter placement that governs train proximity - speed restrictions over crossovers - if they have to turn a train it takes forever, and plans are during bad weather to just not run the surface portion. They knew this was going to happen, as Laird is built as an end terminal complete with supervisor and operator rooms.

The underground portion moves quick though, provided there aren’t delays. However after the morning rush and trains are running in to the yard, there will be massive delays getting in and out of keelesdale / mount Dennis as this also is a slow process"

 

[Tuscani01]

I don't understand how any company, designer, engineer etc. can design a system that requires all of these slow and overly cautious turns and maneuvers and think "oh yea, this will be fine".

It's absolutely insane. Anyone who had any part in the decisions that lead to this should never be allowed to touch a transit project again.

 

[Chaplinurbex]

Eglinton Crosstown will be a true game changer

You're gonna love it, but Rob Ford was right

markmcqueen.substack.com

It appears that this person was given acesses to line 5 two or three days ago along with some other journalists.

They've got some clips in there article if anyone cares to look.

This was a great read, and seeing how quick the train moves in the tunnel was a relief. I'll also say I think the stations look really fantastic.

Giving my selfish use case here. I live at Chaplin, and most of the time all I need is to get to Cedarvale or Eglinton Station. On Line 5, that is only 2 stops. It should be a very fast underground trip (5-6 minutes maybe). Comparing to the current 32 bus going in either direction, it will be a game changer. A lot of folks in this thread talk about the bus being faster, and maybe that is true in Scarborough, but it is absolutely not the case in midtown. There is so much backed up traffic around Allen, Avenue, and turning into the bus terminal at Yonge, that it can take 15 minutes to move a couple blocks. Buses are ALWAYS late, so you are stuck waiting in the cold with no idea when it will come. And when/ if you do get on, you are crammed in like sardines.

This train will change my life. I'm sorry for all the people who are disappointed in the above ground east arm of this line, but as someone who lives in between both sides of line 1, this will be an enormous improvement. TTC, please open this line.

 

[Bojaxs]

the disastrous line 6 operations have been so depressing to the point that i'm kind of checked out on caring about any future transit developments. i have no faith that the people running things will do it properly. its like they are actively trying to make transit bad.

Yeah, I understand now what Reece Martin meant when he talks about obsessing over Toronto transit becomes rather depressing, and you just start looking at other cities and see what they're doing. This is part of the reason I recently went to London, England. Now I find myself more interested in London/ U.K. transit rather than Toronto's.

Going to London served to highlight everything Toronto is doing wrong.

 

[Bojaxs]

A concerning comment from a Line 5 operator:

"Line 5 op here: I’d like to point out that when they do open the line, plans are to have significantly reduced trains and operating hours. The biggest kink they haven’t been able to figure out and what made the testing run as long as it did is trains bunching up and getting bogged down. Poor station placement is a big factor; for example Ionview’s proximity to Kennedy and the fact that there’s an intersection at the portal coupled with the axle counter placement that governs train proximity - speed restrictions over crossovers - if they have to turn a train it takes forever, and plans are during bad weather to just not run the surface portion. They knew this was going to happen, as Laird is built as an end terminal complete with supervisor and operator rooms.

The underground portion moves quick though, provided there aren’t delays. However after the morning rush and trains are running in to the yard, there will be massive delays getting in and out of keelesdale / mount Dennis as this also is a slow process"

The fact that trains can fly though the underground portion while struggling at the surface level is further justification that we should have built a subway instead.

I wonder though how this won't resort in bunching of eastbound trains at Laird? At some point underground, eastbound trains will have to slow down so as to not catch up with eastbound, surface level trains that are having to stop at red lights and travel slow through intersections.

I hold onto the belief that at some point in the future, the city will simply give up on the surface portion of the line, and turn all trains around at Laird while running express buses between Laird and Kennedy. The surface portion of the line will get the same treatment as the Scarborough RT.

 

[hw621]

The fact that trains can fly though the underground portion while struggling at the surface level is further justification that we should have built a subway instead.

I wonder though how this won't resort in bunching of eastbound trains at Laird? At some point underground, eastbound trains will have to slow down so as to not catch up with eastbound, surface level trains that are having to stop at red lights and travel slow through intersections.

I hold onto the belief that at some point in the future, the city will simply give up on the surface portion of the line, and turn all trains around at Laird while running express buses between Laird and Kennedy. The surface portion of the line will get the same treatment as the Scarborough RT.

Why can't they just keep the surface portion like a streetcar line?

 

[Bojaxs]

Why can't they just keep the surface portion like a streetcar line?

Because then you'll watch the buses fly pass you.

 

[hw621]

Because then you'll watch the buses fly pass you.

Good for sight seeing and time killing though lol

 

[Kelson]

Great, so a simple trip from Mount pleasant station to the future flemington Park stn on the ol will involve me getting on ect at Mount pleasant, getting off at laird to catch a bus, taking that to Don valley stn, and then waiting for the ontario line again

 

[urbanclient]

How reliable will Line 5 be? In particular, how well will it maintain the scheduled headways. Will TTC do any better here than with streetcars.

Unclear, but what Line 5 operators are saying doesn't bode well for 'reliability'.

I'm not going to bore everyone with more math. Good news: 88 km/h top speeds in the tunnel. Bad news: 22 min Mount Dennis to Laird with stops, but no other trains or passengers.

Besides the surface section limitations, they used a garbage bespoke signalling system instead of standard, off-the-shelf technology. Signalling / software issues were widely reported in the last couple of years, e.g. Globe and Mail. It's mind boggling to build an expensive custom solution, as if Metrolinx wanted the project to fail.

The surface-elevated-underground-surface-underground-surface-underground tram was already novel enough.

we should have built a subway instead.

subway is a no-no word, say elevated light metro for an air of sophistication. Heck, say ALRT for popular appeal.

The biggest kink they haven’t been able to figure out and what made the testing run as long as it did is trains bunching up and getting bogged down. Poor station placement is a big factor; for example Ionview’s proximity to Kennedy and the fact that there’s an intersection at the portal

@T3G ^ Bunching and delays were inevitable in practice. Not every train gets the same amount of red light time.

I personally heard back from a source corroborating these Reddit comments. Feel free to take it with a grain of salt, but if anything, my predicted travel times from yesterday were underestimates...

 

[zang]

Eglinton Crosstown will be a true game changer

You're gonna love it, but Rob Ford was right

markmcqueen.substack.com

It appears that this person was given acesses to line 5 two or three days ago along with some other journalists.

They've got some clips in there article if anyone cares to look.

"That the NDP at Toronto City Hall pushed for so many above-ground routes was an obvious strategic blunder, and we’ll never know how much money was actually saved in the end by choosing a different form factor. "

If Ford had gotten his way or were still mayor, we'd still not have the subways he promised. Aside from just the increased time and logistics required for a fully underground system, his refusal to increase taxes or revenue (in fact, an outright drive to lower both), plus a vast amount of the budget being gobbled up by police and the Gardiner means we'd never find the money for a project the size of which he championed. We saw alone how the SSE got stations cut, and costs nearly doubled, and that's just for 3 stop extension that still won't open until 2030.

We'd would still be hunting for P3s to eat the cost of it, all the while the Ford family would be taking credit for something that'd still be a decade away.

 

[zang]

Why can't they just keep the surface portion like a streetcar line?

Because we need to really stop with the belief that cars (and not people) use the roads, and that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few (or the one).