Westey
Active Member
When (if) Highway 7 New is extended to Brampton, does it follow this route north of Guelph lake and following just north of highway 7 to join 413 near Mississauga Road.
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- Thread starter Haljackey
- Start date
Jonathan's Junction
New Member
The original 413/GTA West Corridor was actually supposed to start in Guelph, so I presume this fantasy Highway 7 extension is just that. To be honest, don't really see a pressing need for it, especially if the 401 is widened between Milton and Cambridge.
Westey
Active Member
It's much more urgent than 4-laning Chalk River to Mattawa, or Cochrane to Nipigon, or Heyden to Nipigon.
nfitz
Superstar
Highway 7 EA from Elmira Road to Woodlawn Road? If that's new 7, then isn't it already in the Highway 7 EA from Kitchener to the Hanlon? If it's old 7, then why bother ... but wouldn't that also be in the Highway 6 Woodlawn Road interchange.
Pretty much I'd think. Not a big surprise, the AADT on 6 leaving Guelph was about 19,000 in 2021, and Fergus continues to expand. Approaching Fergus the AADT it was 16,600. But only about 8,000 north out of Fergus growing to 10,000 entering Arthur (and then about half that to Owen Sound).
I wouldn't be surprised if it's 4-laned, and perhaps a dual carriageway all the way to Fergus. I don't see there needs to be grade-separated interchanges. Roundabouts and unsignalized crossings should suffice.
I wonder if they'll bypass Fergus one day ... that will be tricky, and I'd think they'd have to go around to the north .... though the I expect that will be an uproar no matter what they do (I doubt they'd get any kickback about Marden).
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ericmacm
Active Member
Really difficult to say at this point since there is so little information. That section of HWY 7 was definitely part of the original EA/design process for the remainder of the New HWY 7 project. Given that the Woodlawn interchange is in the detail design stage, I believe that they are probably planning a new interchange (possibly free-flowing) with a new HWY 6 north alignment connecting somewhere between the Elmira Road and Woodlawn Road interchanges.
Morriston1986
New Member
But they just wont build the Morriston bypass. Ive now seen they are doing phase 3 being just a bridge and perhaps some interchange work on Brock road.
I dont understand the project
I dont understand the project
Monarch Butterfly
Superstar
Guess the solution for the PC's is to widen the roadway... again.
Bojaxs
Senior Member
Good lord! Please tell me she was arrested.
ZEBuilder
Active Member
The fact they are including all 4 of those projects makes it seem like the MTO wants to protect for a future northern extension of the Hanlon and is going to redesign the connection of New 7 with 6 to protect for that. The Marden bypass study only makes sense if they're trying to connect 6 north of Guelph to the Hanlon, there isn't much else you could do with that stretch of 6. If you're doing that you're going to have a new freeway-freeway interchange between a hypothetical extension of 6 with 7 which makes the new EA and preliminary design for New 7 make sense, similarly upgrading the Hanlon from Woodlawn to Wellington fits in with that as it's mostly freeway from there to the 401. The Woodlawn bridge for New 7 was also expected to get tendered earlier and happen at a similar time as Frederick St in Kitchener but that never happened which makes sense if they're redesigning the entire corridor.
Some alignment like this certainly seems what they're protecting for with the EA and Marden study. the alignment I drew passes through some rather swampy areas which you'd rather avoid but it's definitely possible to make something pass through there.
Haljackey
Active Member
These AADT figures- when high on a 2 lane road, clearly show the need for some sort of upgrade. A freeway or dual highway between K-W-C and Hamilton does seem chronically overdue for example.
When the AADT is low- that doesn't paint the full picture for the need. Here the expansion comes as a safety upgrade and/or a understanding that this is a critical corridor essential to the area/province/nation.
Ex- the Thunder Bay to Nipigon stretch makes no sense from a capacity perspective- but it's the only road. The 401 widening London-Windsor also seems unjustified. There is other reasoning why expansion is happening here- unsafe median, much higher % of traffic is trucks, more (expected) traffic when (if?) Gordie Howe opens, etc.
Also- Ontario's remote roads experience brutal winters with a need for more forgiving design standards and alternative routes when there is a major accident, landslide, weather event, etc. I think what happened to the Nipigon Bridge was a good example of this vulnerability.
Don't forget that AADT doesn't show the full picture. In the summer, you can get a ton more traffic than one would expect looking at these numbers. I remember being stuck in a queue of maybe 4 dozen vehicles that were all behind a slow truck on Hwy 17 along Lake Superior last summer. We were going 30-40km/h at most times. Impatient drivers were dangerously passing one another during dashed yellows, merging in tight before they were about to be hit by oncoming traffic. Yes dedicated passing lanes do exist on some hills/curves but a lot more is needed. A 2+1 setup would give you a much safer design which, yes, would open up when private homes/businesses or crossroads meet it. This is unlike the 11 or 35/115 where it's more of a RIRO highway with overpasses to cross every now and then.
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just east of the creek
Senior Member
We should rank the loneliest highways in Canada. I have a list, including a couple in Manitoba and a couple in Sask (excluding ice roads ). I think we could come up with some great examples.
Jonathan's Junction
New Member
By strict definition of "lonely" as farthest from civilization, the end of the Trans Taiga Road in northern Quebec is the loneliest, at 745km to the nearest town by drivable distance.
just east of the creek
Senior Member
Cannot argue with that, and travelling the James Bay Road to get there is only minimally less isolated. but perhaps a 'touch' more traffic (I only know from winter driving). The Taiga I have not yet been on, past the junction point, although one day, with a boat in hand and rods in the other, I think you could have pretty nice fishing vacation.
Out west, the drive from Winnipeg to Thompson along 6, especially at night, especially in the winter has to be on the list. There is nothing for 100's of km's.
In Saskatchewan, Hwy 102/05 to Wollaston (and the winter roads from there), and also Sask 955 and 914.
It is a big, lonely land out there, and I am sure there are other very worthy candidates. The above I know from first hand experience, I would exclude some of the well known isolated routes (Dawson Hwy for example) as there is just too much traffic*.
*All in relative terms if you are comparing the roads above.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
looking at this again, it looks like MTO is rethinking the east end of New Hwy 7. Originally the highway was to curve on a tight 575m radius curve (this is below the minimum threshold for a 100km/h speed limit) to meet the Hanlon at Woodlawn:
There was no clear provision for a northward extension of 6 to eliminate the "jog" to Fergus. It now appears that MTO is perhaps rethinking it, building a "Marden Bypass" to eliminate the jog and redesigning this curve to accommodate it. They are re-initiating the EA process for Highway 7 through this end of the highway, which means that they are going to make some significant design changes.
Unfortunately this also means that Highway 7 being completed remains many, many years out..