Atticus
Active Member
I think this building would still be very cool and noticeable at 9 floors, but given the location it probably should be 12.
- Thread starter Surrealplaces
- Start date
Beazley66
Active Member
LOC2019-0188 appears to be a re-designation to accommodate MU-2. Ironically has a more restrictive height allowance than the Direct Control 1Z93. The DC SITE-1 designation is kind of tied to the old C-2 zoning requirements. So the LOC may also be use driven. Anyway, definitely eye catching, but I do have concerns, building height for one. The rest is purely personal opinion based, (which is causing me pain trying to balance objectivity and subjectivity), and other stuff that will probably set the thread ablaze.
Nimbus
Active Member
Fire this thread up and let's get some debate and discussion going.
Beazley66
Active Member
Well I applaud the ambition, I keep reminding myself of a song King Crimson performed, (dating myself, but they were good years), called Indiscipline...
"I carried it around with me for days and days..
Playing little games
Like not looking at it for a whole day
And then... looking at it.
To see if I still liked it.
I did."
Unfortunately I don't think I do. Maybe that's just my designer DNA, for better or worse. (I need to stress that I am not speaking for my firm, just myself.) I'm all for permeable building bases that open up to accept and engage with the public realm. This project potentially succeeds with this more so along 9th Avenue, but can't quite figure out the lawn bowling side. For me the concept starts to come apart as you move up the building, (up and way up). It appears that the commercial units and residential units are defined by a concrete structure contained within something like a CLT exo-skeletal structure. The reality of it is that actually building this thing to concept will be a challenge of extreme proportions. Providing the ratings between the floor along the perimeter of the slabs, would likely already deviate from what we are seeing here. The reality of floor to ceiling clear glass in a residential tower portion is also a problem. Sometimes a proposal is meant to look like an idea, obviating what it will look like in"use", so it sells. Everyone has something different on the mantle piece, so the myth dies. The massing needs a bit of work also. I'm curious about the hermetically sealed building mass above, wondering what punched balconies could do to animate the glazed facades. Just saying. Finally, I'm all for density in the right places, and at the right time, but 12 stories.... not likely.
Finally, I'm really starting to get pissed off at sole sourced design work in this place especially at a time when higher end small firms here struggle. (I see fire and thread ablaze potentially) Apologize if I have offended anybody.
"I carried it around with me for days and days..
Playing little games
Like not looking at it for a whole day
And then... looking at it.
To see if I still liked it.
I did."
Unfortunately I don't think I do. Maybe that's just my designer DNA, for better or worse. (I need to stress that I am not speaking for my firm, just myself.) I'm all for permeable building bases that open up to accept and engage with the public realm. This project potentially succeeds with this more so along 9th Avenue, but can't quite figure out the lawn bowling side. For me the concept starts to come apart as you move up the building, (up and way up). It appears that the commercial units and residential units are defined by a concrete structure contained within something like a CLT exo-skeletal structure. The reality of it is that actually building this thing to concept will be a challenge of extreme proportions. Providing the ratings between the floor along the perimeter of the slabs, would likely already deviate from what we are seeing here. The reality of floor to ceiling clear glass in a residential tower portion is also a problem. Sometimes a proposal is meant to look like an idea, obviating what it will look like in"use", so it sells. Everyone has something different on the mantle piece, so the myth dies. The massing needs a bit of work also. I'm curious about the hermetically sealed building mass above, wondering what punched balconies could do to animate the glazed facades. Just saying. Finally, I'm all for density in the right places, and at the right time, but 12 stories.... not likely.
Finally, I'm really starting to get pissed off at sole sourced design work in this place especially at a time when higher end small firms here struggle. (I see fire and thread ablaze potentially) Apologize if I have offended anybody.
Always_Biking
Senior Member
You bring up some good points @Beazley66. There are things I like about this project but there are a couple of things I am wondering about. I’ve been wondering about the glazing on this project since I first saw the rendering, and wondering if this is actually what it will look like in the end . With the windows end up being smaller with spandrel or panels taking up some of the area. If it becomes the case this becomes a different project.
The second thing I’m concerned about is the height. I know we want density in the inner city, but I think even dropping it to nine floors would make a big difference. You’d be sacrificing the density of only about 30 people yet it would make a difference to the feel of the area.
There are things I really like about this proposal. I love that they want to incorporate the old CIBC building. I also love the concept of the open timber frames. I think whatever ends up on that corner should be something notable.
The second thing I’m concerned about is the height. I know we want density in the inner city, but I think even dropping it to nine floors would make a big difference. You’d be sacrificing the density of only about 30 people yet it would make a difference to the feel of the area.
There are things I really like about this proposal. I love that they want to incorporate the old CIBC building. I also love the concept of the open timber frames. I think whatever ends up on that corner should be something notable.
LloydBraun
Active Member
I am a bit curious about your comment regarding sole sourced design work.. as a private development i don't understand the frustration. I might be wrong but is this not typical? Public projects of course have a request for proposal process, but private endeavours...
Calgcouver
Active Member
Totally agree. the method of construction looks like a very serious undertaking, and I am always leery of renderings that show too much transparent glass. What will the whole building have effectively R-2 insulation? Will no systems on the exterior of the building need to be masked by panel, especially in apartments?
If we are giving additional height based on design merit, and renderings are this far out from DP level of detail or the reality of what the finished product will be, what if materials and design change and it turns out like shit?
Treating this rendering as anything but a slick, super-transparent massing model would be a mistake, especially if it is only in for Land Use.
Here is your Massing Models:
Assessing this as a massing model, and without cool render, is the scale still appropriate?
NOTE: not being a debbie downer just being critical at this stage considering what is being asked for in the LOC. 6.5FAR is crazy imo.
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Urb
Active Member
These guys are shooting for the moon. 6-8 stories is more suitable.
retrofiturbanism
Active Member
Could be cool to do a mix of transparent glass and opaque glass like the library does. Can be a bit of a nod to the library design, while also helping a bit with insulation (architects and building science people correct me if I am wrong).
Protecting heritage doesn't always mean limiting the growth of new development. In fact, if you use the right tools, such as density transfers, you can actually incentivize the protection of heritage assets more than with lower allowable densities, but no transfer ability. The economics are complex, so it isn't a simple "more density means more demolition" argument. AsI like to say- planning isn't about whether or not a city grows, it is about the how and where. In this case, allowing more density doesn't necessarily change the rate of growth of the neighbourhood and in fact, it can lessen the pressure on heritage assets, as more growth can be accommodated in less buildings if they are larger.
Protecting heritage doesn't always mean limiting the growth of new development. In fact, if you use the right tools, such as density transfers, you can actually incentivize the protection of heritage assets more than with lower allowable densities, but no transfer ability. The economics are complex, so it isn't a simple "more density means more demolition" argument. AsI like to say- planning isn't about whether or not a city grows, it is about the how and where. In this case, allowing more density doesn't necessarily change the rate of growth of the neighbourhood and in fact, it can lessen the pressure on heritage assets, as more growth can be accommodated in less buildings if they are larger.
googspecial
Active Member
Another potential solution to the insulation issue I see would be double or dual glazed (or whatever it's called) like the McKimmie retrofit, or the Bow.
artvandelay
Active Member
I don’t really get the criticism either. Private sector developments of this scale and smaller are often ‘soul sourced’ if a developer has a good working relationship with an architect. You typically only see RFP processes on much larger scale private sector projects backed by publicly traded or institutional investors. Why would a privately held developer be expected to put their projects out to open competition? They are entitled to do as they wish.
To be fair to Roundsquare, they have done a really nice job at giving work to talented local architects including (off the top of my head) Moda, FAAS, and David Vera.
artvandelay
Active Member
For the record, I really like this project as a concept but I think it’s going to be tough to execute from both a pro forma and building science perspective. Best of luck to them because I think something iconic like this would be a fantastic addition to Inglewood.
Alkarimd
New Member
Hey All,
Just wanna say I am enjoying watching all the comments ! All the concerns,excitement and overall engagement is great ! It's hard not to respond as its a live application and we want to ensure we capture all engagement but I couldn't resist. I'll throw out a few little nuggets and encourage you all to submit your feedback to www.rndsqrblock.com. It's difficult for us to track all comments on all the different platforms but your voices are important and do help us achieve the best outcomes.
1. We have been actively meeting with RJC engineering over the last several months.
2. We have also been working with LEDCOR on precon scope/details.
3. We will be onboarding a local firm to support the design architect firm 546.
The largest move on this building which I think is the biggest move is how the building turns on its axis to offer relief to 9th ave, the restored heritage asset and the law bowling club on the rear. If you pull back the shell which can be skinned a million different ways which I am teasing out here ! =) the actual structure is fairly simple. The glazing strategy along with the solid can be done in a number of different ways and the new energy code will obviously have an impact. I've also attached a few Kuma buildings which we are taking strong inspirations from. ENJOY !!
Best,
Just wanna say I am enjoying watching all the comments ! All the concerns,excitement and overall engagement is great ! It's hard not to respond as its a live application and we want to ensure we capture all engagement but I couldn't resist. I'll throw out a few little nuggets and encourage you all to submit your feedback to www.rndsqrblock.com. It's difficult for us to track all comments on all the different platforms but your voices are important and do help us achieve the best outcomes.
1. We have been actively meeting with RJC engineering over the last several months.
2. We have also been working with LEDCOR on precon scope/details.
3. We will be onboarding a local firm to support the design architect firm 546.
The largest move on this building which I think is the biggest move is how the building turns on its axis to offer relief to 9th ave, the restored heritage asset and the law bowling club on the rear. If you pull back the shell which can be skinned a million different ways which I am teasing out here ! =) the actual structure is fairly simple. The glazing strategy along with the solid can be done in a number of different ways and the new energy code will obviously have an impact. I've also attached a few Kuma buildings which we are taking strong inspirations from. ENJOY !!
Best,
Calgcouver
Active Member
Thanks for the additional details Al. Glad to see you're moving into detailed design, as this is a really cool project. Definitely love the sources for inspiration you have for your glazing strategy, and for the building design so far. Good luck on the project!
Mountain Man
Senior Member
Thanks for the info Al!