General rating of this project

  • 1 Great

    Votes: 12 18.5%

  • 2 Good

    Votes: 43 66.2%

  • 3 So So

    Votes: 6 9.2%

  • 4 Not Very Good

    Votes: 3 4.6%

  • 5 Terrible

    Votes: 1 1.5%
  • Total voters
    65
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They mention two towers but they are actually conjoined and will functionally act as one tower.

Here is the render from the article. Updated, and shows the nice new glass facade treatment above the podium that I am really liking...

pba-land-will-build-a-downtown-calgary-hotel-under-two-flags.jpeg
 
I actually like this project a lot, especially the scale, usage, location, and grade level. it's no head turner, but a well-positioned integrated hotel will do good for the neighbourhood.

As for PBA, I wonder if the updated design is better than the last.
 
RyLucky said:
I actually like this project a lot, especially the scale, usage, location, and grade level. it's no head turner, but a well-positioned integrated hotel will do good for the neighbourhood.

As for PBA, I wonder if the updated design is better than the last.
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I can't say it looks particularly different in the render from the paper. The website still has the shot feature as from the front page of the thread. It does say construction is slated for 2015, so it definitely isn't up to date. Even if it does stay the same it's forgettable but not super offensive to me. I'll add my plaudits to the foyer though and another plug for the 27th floor bar-restaurant.
 
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I never liked this one much, but the rendering Warrior posted has made me warm up to it. I like the base and streetfront, which to me is the most important thing for that location.
 
Always_Biking said:
The street level portion looks decent in that rendering.
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Looks fine, but adding an unnecessary taxi pull-in lane is another small step in our continual erosion of the pedestrian realm. Usually this isn't a big deal, but it's 5th Avenue. The road is already 5.5 lanes wide at this site, why add another pull in?

Its the small details like this that don't seem important. But add up all the little small details over a few decades - which downtown Calgary has continued to do - and you create a bizarre, inconsistent and hostile pedestrian core.
 
CBBarnett said:
Looks fine, but adding an unnecessary taxi pull-in lane is another small step in our continual erosion of the pedestrian realm. Usually this isn't a big deal, but it's 5th Avenue. The road is already 5.5 lanes wide at this site, why add another pull in?

Its the small details like this that don't seem important. But add up all the little small details over a few decades - which downtown Calgary has continued to do - and you create a bizarre, inconsistent and hostile pedestrian core.
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I think you're being a touch melodramatic about the erosion of the pedestrian realm. Considering what's there right now, calling this anything but a major net gain for the pedestrian realm is laughable.
 
Oddball said:
I think you're being a touch melodramatic about the erosion of the pedestrian realm. Considering what's there right now, calling this anything but a major net gain for the pedestrian realm is laughable.
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Totally agreed. I mean the pull in isn't great, but this development is an improvement over all scales.
 
Oddball said:
I think you're being a touch melodramatic about the erosion of the pedestrian realm. Considering what's there right now, calling this anything but a major net gain for the pedestrian realm is laughable.
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This is an improvement of what is there right now. It should be considered that this proposal (if built) will occupy the site a lot longer than the current parking lot. The street level isn't bad overall but, it's the bare minimum for downtown . There is a lot of room to improve upon. Right now, it's a hotel lobby and a drop off area cut into the sidewalk. It's comparable to an inward facing office project.
 
Myself, I don't have a problem with the cut in space in front, as long as there is sufficient sidewalk space for pedestrians. If it's only hotels that do this, it shouldn't be an issue.
 
A drop off point is a pretty big necessity with any larger hotel. Unless you have plans for permanent parking along the rest of the street lane, its probably better to have a dedicated space like this instead of having to constantly stop traffic.

I'm all for putting pedestrians first, but you still have to be realistic. Like most hotels in the core, this will most likely serve the business community first. People are not going to walk/bike here from the airport.
 
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DiscoStu said:
A drop off point is a pretty big necessity with any larger hotel. Unless you have plans for permanent parking along the rest of the street lane, its probably better to have a dedicated space like this instead of having to constantly stop traffic.

I'm all for putting pedestrians first, but you still have to be realistic. Like most hotels in the core, this will most likely serve the business community first. People are not going to walk/bike here from the airport.
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Agreed, and I am not saying don't have a drop off point, they are clearly important to hotel operations. I also agree that a hotel is a better use than a parking lot.

What I am saying perhaps using one of the existing 5.5 lanes to do it as they are not needed for traffic operations. Why bother making another car pull in - in a downtown littered with them - to disrupt the pedestrian realm again when there is plenty of room already with no pedestrian or traffic impacts?

The 2015 traffic volume counts on 5th Avenue in this area are ~13,000 / day for 5.5 lanes. This is around the same as many busy 2 lane roads such as 33rd Avenue SW and 20th Avenue NW. Better yet, give the hotel a pull-in from the existing road right of way by shrinking 5th Avenue in is block from 5.5 lanes to 4 lanes + a pull-in. Win-Win.

It's a death by 1,000 cuts scenario; no single pull-in or small-scale car-centric design is a deal-breaker for the pedestrian realm, but together the mishmash of all of them throughout the core dramatically effects the public realm.
 
I'm on the fence here. While I can see hotels needing a pull in for vehicles, I see where CBBarnett is coming from, downtown Calgary needs to not just retain their pedestrian environment, but improve it.
 
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