FriendlyDrunks said:
The community has so much going for it that surely bike lanes will be added at some point...
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I agree it's not a lost cause, as the roads are probably wide enough for them to be added in later. But chances there will most likely need to be some design shoe-horning that will lead to usability compromises, that might've been prevented if done right from the start. It just kind of feels similar to when we you see the City install some questionably-designed infrastructure/roadwork/lights...and then a year or two later see them digging it up again to rectify an obvious mistake. A waste of time, money, and resources that could've been mitigated with a little more effort on the front end.
 
artvandelay said:
Bike lanes aren't really a great fit for retail high streets with lots of pedestrian traffic. They've got them on Bloor in Toronto and it's annoying AF.
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I literally walk on Bloor everyday, this isn't true at all. They make cycling along Bloor significantly safer, and provide a buffer between personal vehicles and pedestrians. They also keep the cyclists who don't want to risk their lives in traffic off the sidewalk.

The only people it's annoying for are people who spent tens of thousands of dollars on the least efficient means of transportation, in the urban center of the busiest city in the country - and even then, it's perfectly serviceable.
 
Urban Outdoorsman said:
If they're putting the bike lanes on Kovitz I'm pretty sure they'll be extending that road once they start that next phase where the family housing will be, so in the long run it will essentially run parallel to university Ave all the way to the campus, so in my mind that doesn't seem like a huge trade of.
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If Kovits ended up running parallels to University ave, I'd by fine with bike lanes there, but so far there are no plans showing Kovitz running any further than what it currently is. There would have to be big changes to extend Kovitz east, whereas University Ave is already done and is already a main corridor. It would be so easy to just put in a protected bike lane.
 
There is an excavator on site, not sure if it's just utility work or if they're actually starting phase 2 of U/D.

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Apologies for this tangent:
MissingMiddle said:
I literally walk on Bloor everyday, this isn't true at all. They make cycling along Bloor significantly safer, and provide a buffer between personal vehicles and pedestrians. They also keep the cyclists who don't want to risk their lives in traffic off the sidewalk.

The only people it's annoying for are people who spent tens of thousands of dollars on the least efficient means of transportation, in the urban center of the busiest city in the country - and even then, it's perfectly serviceabl
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I spend a lot of time in Toronto as well (unfortunately 😂) - specifically Bloor / Ossington area, and I'm gonna have to disagree with you on that one!

Obviously the lanes are great for cyclists, but on a retail intensive high street they are taking up limited space that would be better allocated to both pedestrians and patios for adjacent businesses. I've witnessed many near-miss cyclist / pedestrian incidents along Bloor - especially in the sections where the bike lane is at the same grade as the sidewalk.

It's simply not ideal urban design. A much better solution is locate the protected bike lanes on a street with less pedestrian traffic parallel to the retail high street - this way you can provide the same level of access while improving safety and speed of travel for cyclists and pedestrians. Similar to what they are doing in Calgary on 15th Avenue.

Unfortunately there are not really any continuous parallel streets in close proximity to Bloor, which is why they are stuck with the current design.
 
artvandelay said:
Apologies for this tangent:

I spend a lot of time in Toronto as well (unfortunately 😂) - specifically Bloor / Ossington area, and I'm gonna have to disagree with you on that one!

Obviously the lanes are great for cyclists, but on a retail intensive high street they are taking up limited space that would be better allocated to both pedestrians and patios for adjacent businesses. I've witnessed many near-miss cyclist / pedestrian incidents along Bloor - especially in the sections where the bike lane is at the same grade as the sidewalk.

It's simply not ideal urban design. A much better solution is locate the protected bike lanes on a street with less pedestrian traffic parallel to the retail high street - this way you can provide the same level of access while improving safety and speed of travel for cyclists and pedestrians. Similar to what they are doing in Calgary on 15th Avenue.

Unfortunately there are not really any continuous parallel streets in close proximity to Bloor, which is why they are stuck with the current design
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I agree that the street width is very narrow, and that more space should be allocated to pedestrians.

but you're suggesting they take it from the bike lanes, instead of the lane of parked cars?

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It's ridiculous to make bikes go onto a parallel street. The beauty of a bike is you can be riding along a cycle track on a high street and see a place and stop at it easily to give it your business. Bikes mean business, cars whip by and maybe just maybe see a place and want to stop at it spontaneously...but oh wait they have to find a place to park and oh well I'll just keep going instead.
 
MissingMiddle said:
I agree that the street width is very narrow, and that more space should be allocated to pedestrians.

but you're suggesting they take it from the bike lanes, instead of the lane of parked cars?

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Don't think I said anything about parked cars did I?

My point is that the current setup is mediocre urban design that is not great for pedestrians nor businesses, as is evident from your screenshot!
 
Mountain Man said:
What are the pathway connections between U/D and the University like? U/D is well connected by the pathways around it, but I've only driven in there so I'm not sure how they connect inside the area.
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None if I'm not mistaken. I used to cycle a lot from Bow to University and I would take U/D main street and then there would be a turn and another road to get to the University. I don't remember any pathways, and if they were they are probably not as direct as the route I mentioned.

UofC has a really low number of bike commuters but it's understandable, it's so poorly connected to the rest of the network and it's almost an island surrounded by Crowchild on the east, 16 Ave on south and a big hill on the west.
 
Mountain Man said:
What are the pathway connections between U/D and the University like? U/D is well connected by the pathways around it, but I've only driven in there so I'm not sure how they connect inside the area.
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I'm just repeating what @boreal96 said, but no, there aren't good pathways between U/D it's more the opposite as the two are very poorly connected. If you ride down University Ave into the UofC you enter a mishmash of pathways that are un-intuitive to navigate, with some paths leading to dead ends.

Some pathways look like they traverse the campus but are blocked. For example on Google maps it shows a couple of north-south campus pathways, but in reality they are actually blocked. Other pathways are open, but they zig-zag, and aren't a uniform width or style. Without a map it's difficult to tell where they go. It's a shame the University campus wasn't designed with at least one main artery for pedestrians or cyclists with a direct path through the campus. From U/D you can get into the Uinversity by collegiate blvd, but it's a dog's breakfast once you get into the university, or you can take Warren street down to 24th and come in via the main entrance. Even that route again is poorly connected when trying to get anywhere into the University.

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Blatchford in Edmonton has had a slower start to it’s build out and it’ll be interesting to see if the plaza and retail desired come together as well as it is in UD with the city of Edmonton as the primary developer. But one advantage of their city holding the initial design work is bike lanes being added from step 1. Saves the future disruption and ensures from day 1 there’s good biking & transit connections so it’s not just a denser car dependent area.

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thommyjo said:
Blatchford in Edmonton has had a slower start to it’s build out and it’ll be interesting to see if the plaza and retail desired come together as well as it is in UD with the city of Edmonton as the primary developer. But one advantage of their city holding the initial design work is bike lanes being added from step 1. Saves the future disruption and ensures from day 1 there’s good biking & transit connections so it’s not just a denser car dependent area.

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Really nice separation from the street, actually feels like it was designed that way and not an afterthought. I said this on the Metro line thread already but that strip in Blatchford with the LRT and bike path will be amazing once some development happens.
 
thommyjo said:
Blatchford in Edmonton has had a slower start to it’s build out and it’ll be interesting to see if the plaza and retail desired come together as well as it is in UD with the city of Edmonton as the primary developer. But one advantage of their city holding the initial design work is bike lanes being added from step 1. Saves the future disruption and ensures from day 1 there’s good biking & transit connections so it’s not just a denser car dependent area.

View attachment 469874View attachment 469875View attachment 469876View attachment 469877
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I didn’t see 1 cyclist in any of those pictures! What a colossal waste of tax payer money! /s
 
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