[jje1000]

With the location of those existing buildings and the magnitude of the proposed structures, I am guessing that leaving them there would make construction of the towers almost prohibitively more slow/expensive/complicated.

A project the scale and budget like this should be able to budget at least for facadism. Much smaller projects in Toronto have done these sorts of things before- IMO it's probably either Gehry or Mirvish's reluctance to save these buildings.

 

[adma]

It's funny. The last 10-15 years has seen boatloads of banal garbage go up in this city and a lot of it in this very neighbourhood. Yet, the moment something visionary comes along here come the "planners" to throw water on the fire. It's way too bold!!!

Except that the "boatloads of banal garbage" generally hasn't come at the expense of decreed heritage--at least, not to the degree as here.

I'm just stating once again: heritage is the tripping point. Not height, or scale, or boldness, or the threat of the "visionary". If it were a tabula rasa site, things'd be much different...

 

[interchange42]

A project the scale and budget like this should be able to budget at least for facadism. Much smaller projects in Toronto have done these sorts of things before- IMO it's probably either Gehry or Mirvish's reluctance to save these buildings.

There's no secret here. Mirvish has publicly stated, and we have published, that he has wanted to give the world's most celebrated architect a free hand here. He wants Gehry to be able to create a Toronto masterpiece without having to compromise on his design.

Meanwhile, Gehry is up to his 45th (or so) model of the plan. Mirvish stated at the Empire Club lunch that Gehry has told him he usually works up about 75 or so models before he settles on his design. I have some new images of the podium coming.

42

 

[ushahid]

There's no secret here. Mirvish has publicly stated, and we have published, that he has wanted to give the world's most celebrated architect a free hand here. He wants Gehry to be able to create a Toronto masterpiece without having to compromise on his design.

Meanwhile, Gehry is up to his 45th (or so) model of the plan. Mirvish stated at the Empire Club lunch that Gehry has told him he usually works up about 75 or so models before he settles on his design. I have some new images of the podium coming.

42

so does that mean that there was a redesign.

 

[interchange42]

That means that the design continues to evolve, and it will continue to evolve.

So, these are the close-ups of the latest podium, at least the latest one to be public:

These two stress the podiums' wooden beams, with which Gehry wants to evoke the post and beam heritage of the area's warehouses.

This one looks west along the sidewalk from King and Duncan.

This one look northeast across King and John. The TIFF Bell Lightbox would be across the street to the left of the photo.

The first of these to be shown at the Empire Club actually elicited an 'Oooo/Ahhh" from the audience when it flashed on the screen.

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[ushahid]

its different from the rest of the city.

 

[ttk77]

Those are stunning. I love the scale of those wooden beams.

 

[diminutive]

I'm not the most well versed in terms of engineering. Are those wooden beams actually, umm, wood? Given their scale wouldn't that require a sequoia or a red wood or something?

I'm impressed with how the podium is coming. When the first proposals got leaked I couldn't make out what exactly was going on there, but it looks like things are coming together well!

 

[caveape]

A project the scale and budget like this should be able to budget at least for facadism. Much smaller projects in Toronto have done these sorts of things before- IMO it's probably either Gehry or Mirvish's reluctance to save these buildings.

Of course they could afford to keep the facades - you are missing the point. Look at the images 42 just posted of what could be. Many mistakes have been made in destroying great buildings in the past for new ones just because they fit the current fashion. That is not the case here. Gehry's plan is a masterwork and will elevate this strip from "nice old buildings" to arguably the finest high density residential development of this century so far.

 

[interchange42]

If you want to get a look at how the cloud-like glass sections shown in the models would be translated into real life, check out these blog entries covering the Fondation Vuitton in Paris, a Gehry design currently under construction there.

42

 

[jje1000]

Of course they could afford to keep the facades - you are missing the point. Look at the images 42 just posted of what could be. Many mistakes have been made in destroying great buildings in the past for new ones just because they fit the current fashion. That is not the case here. Gehry's plan is a masterwork and will elevate this strip from "nice old buildings" to arguably the finest high density residential development of this century so far.

I definitely know this. I'm just stating that it's not so much that Mirvish lacks the resources, it's that he just doesn't want to save the buildings.

IMO the point about the wooden beams evoking warehouses is a futile attempt at connecting at the site's history, especially if the development is one degree removed from the original buildings themselves. I also have some reservations to the feasibility of the podium design itself, if there might need to be some significant cost-cutting in order to make it happen. The Louis Vitton Foundation building in the post above cost around $127 million, and I doubt Mivish Productions is equivalent to Louis Vuitton S.A. We may need some public money in this down the road if necessary.

I think that a design that uses existing site features (in this case, the warehouses) can be no less inferior to a tabula rasa development- in fact, I find that they can sometimes be much superior in being able to incorporate materiality and form that's long gone, and also being able to create special spaces which a design may overlook or eliminate in designing a completely new building.

Some examples:

http://www.arcspace.com/features/herzog--de-meuron/caixa-forum/

http://www.archdaily.com/204701/flashback-hearst-tower-foster-and-partners/

http://www.archdaily.com/432300/astley-castle-wins-the-2013-riba-stirling-prize/
And one local example:

http://www.arch2o.com/royal-ontario-museum-studio-daniel-libeskind/

IMO, retaining some of the existing buildings would be beneficial to the project- it keeps the project grounded in its surroundings and offers some very interesting opportunities for unique spaces. Remember that the quality of a project has nothing to do with what's on the site, but what the architect does with the space. And I believe that an architect with the skills of Gehry can make amazing things happen.

 

[picard102]

It completely undermines the project to slap on some gutted facade and pretend it's heritage preservation.

 

[jje1000]

It completely undermines the project to slap on some gutted facade and pretend it's heritage preservation.

It's just as futile to loosely emulate the post-and-beam structure of the warehouses in an attempt at connecting to the past. I think that the project needs to be developed further.

And there is no undermining of the project in historic preservation. Like I said earlier- The quality of a project has nothing to do with what's on the site, but what the architect does with the space.

I did a quick hackneyed example of what might happen. I'm sure that Gehry can do something much better.

 

[gabe]

The podium looks fantastic!!

 

[khris]

If you want to get a look at how the cloud-like glass sections shown in the models would be translated into real life, check out these blog entries covering the Fondation Vuitton in Paris, a Gehry design currently under construction there.

42

That would look awesome with this glass being used: