[EastYorkTTCFan]

The whole thing needs to come down...not a stub. Time for this city to become ambitious and do something grand!

So how many lanes of traffic will lake shore become 8 or does it stay at 4? I couldn't image crossing an 8 lane lakeshore blvd as a pedestrian or even what it would be like for cars to turn on or off of it.

 

[ADRM]

So how many lanes of traffic will lake shore become 8 or does it stay at 4? I couldn't image crossing an 8 lane lakeshore blvd as a pedestrian or even what it would be like for cars to turn on or off of it.

Four sounds swell.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

Four sounds swell.

the problem is it add to the traffic that is already there. The Gardier allows Traffic to avoid the stop lights that slow traffic to a halt.

 

[ADRM]

the problem is it add to the traffic that is already there. The Gardier allows Traffic to avoid the stop lights that slow traffic to a halt.

I understand that, and four sounds swell.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

I understand that, and four sounds swell.

yup I get it. I don't drive but I don't think taking down the gardier without replacing it's capacity will help anyone. I just don't get what poel seem to think will happen if it comes down. If it's more space for pedestrians to get to the waterfront condos then maybe we should do what Chicago did with Lake Shore drive and bulkd under pases for pedisrins to use.

 

[amnesiajune]

I don't drive but I don't think taking down the gardier without replacing it's capacity will help anyone. I just don't get what poel seem to think will happen if it comes down.

I think people just don't realize what's going to happen. Imagine University Avenue, but with a 70 km/h speed limit (University's is 50) and double the traffic volume (University gets 40,000-50,000 cars per day). That's exactly what would be replacing the Gardiner - a wall of slow-moving cars during peak hours, and a wall of fast-moving cars the rest of the day.

Reclaiming space is nice, but it's a lot nicer to keep cars on the Gardiner separated from local traffic. What the city's doing right now makes a lot of sense - reduce the Gardiner's footprint as much as possible without significantly disrupting traffic, which includes pedestrian and bike traffic that currently doesn't have to cross an eight-lane, high-speed surface road.

 

[EastYorkTTCFan]

I think people just don't realize what's going to happen. Imagine University Avenue, but with a 70 km/h speed limit (University's is 50) and double the traffic volume (University gets 40,000-50,000 cars per day). That's exactly what would be replacing the Gardiner - a wall of slow-moving cars during peak hours, and a wall of fast-moving cars the rest of the day.

Reclaiming space is nice, but it's a lot nicer to keep cars on the Gardiner separated from local traffic. What the city's doing right now makes a lot of sense - reduce the Gardiner's footprint as much as possible without significantly disrupting traffic, which includes pedestrian and bike traffic that currently doesn't have to cross an eight-lane, high-speed surface road.

Agreed

 

[TransitBart]

I think people just don't realize what's going to happen. Imagine University Avenue, but with a 70 km/h speed limit (University's is 50) and double the traffic volume (University gets 40,000-50,000 cars per day). That's exactly what would be replacing the Gardiner - a wall of slow-moving cars during peak hours, and a wall of fast-moving cars the rest of the day.

Reclaiming space is nice, but it's a lot nicer to keep cars on the Gardiner separated from local traffic. What the city's doing right now makes a lot of sense - reduce the Gardiner's footprint as much as possible without significantly disrupting traffic, which includes pedestrian and bike traffic that currently doesn't have to cross an eight-lane, high-speed surface road.

If anyone has ever crossed the Champs Elysee that is about the most harrowing street in a city that I have ever experienced. But of course those Europeans are so much more civilized....really?

 

[ADRM]

If anyone has ever crossed the Champs Elysee that is about the most harrowing street in a city that I have ever experienced. But of course those Europeans are so much more civilized....really?

I thought the craziest thing I read tonight emanated from the White House and then I read someone suggest the Gardiner is nicer than the Champs Elysee...

 

[ADRM]

I think people just don't realize what's going to happen. Imagine University Avenue, but with a 70 km/h speed limit (University's is 50) and double the traffic volume (University gets 40,000-50,000 cars per day). That's exactly what would be replacing the Gardiner - a wall of slow-moving cars during peak hours, and a wall of fast-moving cars the rest of the day.

Reclaiming space is nice, but it's a lot nicer to keep cars on the Gardiner separated from local traffic. What the city's doing right now makes a lot of sense - reduce the Gardiner's footprint as much as possible without significantly disrupting traffic, which includes pedestrian and bike traffic that currently doesn't have to cross an eight-lane, high-speed surface road.

So tear it down, make the speed limit 50 and enforce it by using photo radar. Fixed the problems.

I just don't understand what's so hard to understand about the notion that if roads become unbearably congested, people will stop taking them. I appreciate that not every single user on the Gardiner has the ability to take public transit as an alternative but am simultaneously unconvinced that number is as large as most people assume it to be.

 

[TransitBart]

I thought the craziest thing I read tonight emanated from the White House and then I read someone suggest the Gardiner is nicer than the Champs Elysee...

I thought we were speaking of the aftermath of a takedown with 6 or 8 lanes in each direction on the Lakeshore...I must have been paying more attention to Don Lemon.

 

[amnesiajune]

If anyone has ever crossed the Champs Elysee that is about the most harrowing street in a city that I have ever experienced. But of course those Europeans are so much more civilized....really?

The Brooklyn Bridge, the Malecon and Woodward Avenue are very nice too, but I'm not sure how any of these four examples are relevant.

So tear it down, make the speed limit 50 and enforce it by using photo radar. Fixed the problems.

That's a fantasy, not a solution.

I just don't understand what's so hard to understand about the notion that if roads become unbearably congested, people will stop taking them.

I understand that notion. And they'll usually take other roads instead - more often than not, surface roads. The Gardiner keeps cars out of the way. Without the Gardiner, those cars will mostly be in the way on surface streets, where they form a physical barrier, rather than a psychological one.

I appreciate that not every single user on the Gardiner has the ability to take public transit as an alternative but am simultaneously unconvinced that number is as large as most people assume it to be.

What public transit can they take? The Yonge subway line is at capacity and Go Trains on the Stouffville Line run peak-direction, peak-hour, and don't take you anywhere beyond walking distance form Union without paying for a completely separate transit system.

Anyways, most people going downtown already take public transit. The people who don't take public transit are people transit are usually people who can't do so - either it's an unreasonably long trip, one that has no public transit available, or a trip through the downtown core.

 

[TransitBart]

but am simultaneously unconvinced that number is as large as most people assume it to be.

You are benchmarking by your own experience. It's very often a mistake.

 

[ShonTron]

I loved that the flashing lights at the "15 km/h" sign coming down the York Street ramp were still functioning as of last Thursday.

 

[TOareaFan]

I loved that the flashing lights at the "15 km/h" sign coming down the York Street ramp were still functioning as of last Thursday.

They should reduce the limit thru the construction zone