skyhook19
New Member
Hazel screwed up big time.
Did Hazel decide this? I seem to recall her mentioning in an interview that the decision to make the MCC around square one was before her time as mayor?
Hazel screwed up big time.
Did Hazel decide this? I seem to recall her mentioning in an interview that the decision to make the MCC around square one was before her time as mayor?
But that's what happens when this city is build for cars rather than transit. The downtown exists where it does today because of it's proximity to hwy 403. Hazel screwed up big time.
Did Hazel decide this? I seem to recall her mentioning in an interview that the decision to make the MCC around square one was before her time as mayor?
Did Hazel decide this? I seem to recall her mentioning in an interview that the decision to make the MCC around square one was before her time as mayor?
I don't understand why Mississauga should locate its downtown based on the TTC, instead of Mississauga Transit.
10/Dundas is already a major node (it was the original downtown of Mississauga after all... ) and planned for further high density and mixed-uses, as is 10/Eglinton. There's a massive high-rise condo project under construction at the NE corner to 10/Eglinton.
The problem with comparing Brampton to Hurontario/Dundas is that while I don't know the status of the latter, but the former has been less built up because of all the huge swathes of the DT area that is covered under heritage protection. There's very few chunks of that downtown that can be redeveloped into huge towers.
And Brampton historically hasn't been as popular or desirable as Mississauga, or as populated. It's not a fair comparison.
Mississauga City Centre is a thriving node with well planned downtown that has attracted many awesome high rises, including the world famous Absolute World towers.
Brampton Downtown is just a historical feel good node that has attracted a total of 2 luxury condos and 1 apartment rental building. Granted, they have done well with the Rose Theatre, but still...I think Downtown Brampton is a total fail.
If Brampton had built out Bramalea City Centre as its downtown, I think it would have been far more successful. You would be approaching a mega city when you drive up the 410 towards Queen...instead its just a collection of 1970s towers. FAIL.
Mississauga's skyline rivals or is better than MANY MANY US cities of far bigger size. There is still lots of land left for increased density. The road grid is being improved to become more like a downtown. It has the best shot of competing with Toronto as a second downtown. Why? Highway access is nearby to get people from all over the region into this important node!
Add in things like the historical differences around how the cities were formed. Mississauga was already based at what is now MCC before they were a city......Brampton and Bramalea were much closer to being a "merger of equals" that needed to pick between one or the other location. The notion that the 410 is dramatically closer to Bramalea City Centre than the "4 corners" is just off as well.......one is 2.7km away and the other 2.1km away.
Aside from market influences (which you note) making condo development much riskier/more difficult in Brampton than Mississauga, there is the whole issue around the flood mitigation matters that the City/Province/CVCA can't come to grips with.
It is a very, very, tough comparison to make and I am not sure of the value of it. Would Mississauga's "core" look like Brampton's core if they had built their civic presence at Dundas rather than Burnamthorpe? I doubt it...but then again, I don't see much value in the comparison.
Brampton has several good historic buildings downtown - the Grand Trunk Station, the old Federal Building the Courthouse/Jail/Registry building, a dozen or two outstanding Victorian and Edwardian houses and churches and a fully preserved early 20th century factory (the other whose front and facade are to be preserved following successful redevelopment). Plus a great downtown park whose skating path is being replicated elsewhere. Downtown Brampton itself isn't lively, but it's far ahead of what it was ten years ago. I wouldn't have thought Starbucks would do well - and that Coffee Culture across the street would also survive. Bonus: Downtown Brampton has Batman.
What historic stock does Cooksville have? It was a much smaller community but there's nothing left of note these days. It's little more than a busy intersection surrounded by plazas.
I didn't know cities without glass condo towers constitute being called "total fails". I think when it comes down to urbanism and being in an urban environment, downtown Brampton takes the cake. Try walking in downtown Mississauga, then try walking in downtown Brampton. Does a skyline trump a walkable, dense, historic downtown? I personally don't think so.
By his logic, downtown Oakville or Burlington is a total fail as well.
Just to clarify, when I mean total FAIL - It depends on the context of what the city is trying to achieve.
Mississauga is trying to achieve a downtown that is large in scale and competitive with a big city. I believe Brampton has similar desires. So does Hamilton. And Vaughan...
Places like Oakville and Burlington have always aimed for a small scale "main street" type of node - With that goal in mind, they have been very successful.
Mississauga has been successful as well - Streetsville is an excellent small scale "main street" node as well.
If Brampton's goal all along was to build up a node similar to Oakville or Burlington, then they have succeeded. But I am sure they were aiming for more...and therefore it is a FAIL.