[crs1026]

If ML is acknowledging that the properties have development potential.... would the development potential not inform the price that ML has to pay to procure the properties?

I can understand the need to mitigate the risk posed by construction, but shouldn't the benefit of that appreciated land value be passed (in whole or in part) to the present owners? Let the current owners sell the land directly to a future developer.

- Paul

 

[Northern Light]

If ML is acknowledging that the properties have development potential.... would the development potential not inform the price that ML has to pay to procure the properties?

I can understand the need to mitigate the risk posed by construction, but shouldn't the benefit of that appreciated land value be passed (in whole or in part) to the present owners? Let the current owners sell the land directly to a future developer.

- Paul

Mx if expropriating, is required to meet the 'public good' test.

But no, they do not have to compensate for unrealized gains, they compensate at current fair market value.

The sites are currently zoned for Single Family Homes and the owners to anyone's knowledge were not contemplating an assembly and can't build anything meaningful otherwise.

So there is no achievable gain for them, as things stand today. If Mx wants to rezone, it can (via MZO) or the normal process from the City. That's where the value creation lies.

 

[jcam]

That's not entirely clear. They appear to have some concern that tunneling, well below these properties, may result in cracking of foundations/structural damage.

Certainly, if that is the case, they would be on the hook; and if the risk were significant enough that there was any risk of structural collapse of buildings (or a gas explosion), then the current residents have to move out, at least temporarily.

If I remember and understand it correctly, the TBM was supposed to go ~5m below the Schulich building at York U for the TYSSE. They had spent a tonne of money on a jet-grout matrix injection under the foundations to provide extra support, but it never ended up working. When it finally came time to go under the school and into the station box, and after a thorough risk assessment, they decided to go for it and mined continuously until the TBM had finally passed the building. No settling occurred. Maybe the tunnel is closer to the surface here because it is just diving down from its surface alignment?

 

[nfitz]

If I remember and understand it correctly, the TBM was supposed to go ~5m below the Schulich building at York U for the TYSSE. They had spent a tonne of money on a jet-grout matrix injection under the foundations to provide extra support, but it never ended up working. When it finally came time to go under the school and into the station box, and after a thorough risk assessment, they decided to go for it and mined continuously until the TBM had finally passed the building. No settling occurred. Maybe the tunnel is closer to the surface here because it is just diving down from its surface alignment?

Maybe expropriating the houses (and reselling at a likely profit) is a cheaper option than mitigating construction costs.

(which would make for some interesting testimony if someone took this to the courts)

 

[hawc]

Wild. Trying to think of other instances of recent expropriation in Toronto.

25 homes on Toronto street to be taken over by Metrolinx for subway line

Over two dozen homes in Toronto's Riverdale neighbourhood will soon have to be vacated to make way for the construction of the forthcoming Ontario ...

www.blogto.com

 

[hawc]

Has anyone got a nice map/schematic of how the Ontario Line turns off the rail corridor and goes underground at this point?

I'm trying to visualize it.

 

[nfitz]

This is from the 2022 Environmental Impact Report.

 

[hawc]

Yeah those houses are toast.

 

[crs1026]

I suppose the idea of MX expropriating, clearing the houses, and just declaring a park is unrealistic ?

- Paul

 

[nfitz]

Yeah those houses are toast.

Really need a more detailed drawing. And the depths, as there's obviously some point where they are tunnelling with no issue. Here's a bit further north.

 

[crs1026]

The tunnel drops quite steeply between Langley and Riverdale, while the street actually slopes northwards. One assumes that the clearance between foundations and the tunnel are just not sufficient to ensure the soil doesn't move. (figures from the Ontario Line EA Report)

- Paul

 

[generalcanada]

The tunnel drops quite steeply between Langley and Riverdale, while the street actually slopes northwards. One assumes that the clearance between foundations and the tunnel are just not sufficient to ensure the soil doesn't move. (figures from the Ontario Line EA Report)

- Paul

View attachment 589939
View attachment 589940

yea thats around 8m depth there. I can see why they need it. They probably thought they didnt need it until the pape tunnel guys came in and told them otherwise

 

[hawc]

Feels like a real life version of this book is going to be happening for those residents.

 

[hawc]

The other question is how much are those residents going to feel the constant rumble of subways running for the rest of their lives if they stay there?

 

[torontologist]

yea thats around 8m depth there. I can see why they need it. They probably thought they didnt need it until the pape tunnel guys came in and told them otherwise

It's pretty clear from these maps that it wouldn't be safe for someone to be occupying those very old houses (most are +/- 100 years old) while extensive excavation is going on underneath.

I suppose the idea of MX expropriating, clearing the houses, and just declaring a park is unrealistic ?

- Paul

This area has sufficient parkland. Withrow Park, Riverdale Park, Greenwood Park all within 500m. This should be more homes, many more than what currently exists on these lots.