...and they kept telling us the parrot was just resting. /sigh
 
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yikes those costs
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brianmac said:
Really, all we can hope for is that there is a special ring in hell for the Ford brothers. This is an absolute abomination.
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There is a nice article in the Star today reviewing Doug's list questionable decisions. Its rather long and damming. But we should ask ourselves why we keep getting inflicted with these incompetent provincial governments - cast your mind back to the previous Liberal and Conservative governments as well. It's not just that they made the incorrect decision, that happens. But that he decisions are heavily underpinned by deceitful practices. Why do we continue to elect officials, who in turn hire a bureaucracy, that believe they can lie, cheat and generally bungle themselves to a further government mandate. Is it the power of the $250 cheque? Is that really the level of our conscious thinking about making decisions on who to vote for, or even to participate in the process.

If Doug decided late tonight that he was going to declare martial law in Ontario because of too many accusations of incompetence with Metrolinx, would we skip our morning Timmies to head down-town and launch a massive counter protest? Or would we just roll over, yawn, and ask our partner to turn out the lights.

In Korea, in France, In Belgium, they know how to protest.
 
just east of the creek said:
There is a nice article in the Star today reviewing Doug's list questionable decisions. Its rather long and damming. But we should ask ourselves why we keep getting inflicted with these incompetent provincial governments - cast your mind back to the previous Liberal and Conservative governments as well. It's not just that they made the incorrect decision, that happens. But that he decisions are heavily underpinned by deceitful practices. Why do we continue to elect officials, who in turn hire a bureaucracy, that believe they can lie, cheat and generally bungle themselves to a further government mandate. Is it the power of the $250 cheque? Is that really the level of our conscious thinking about making decisions on who to vote for, or even to participate in the process.

If Doug decided late tonight that he was going to declare martial law in Ontario because of too many accusations of incompetence with Metrolinx, would we skip our morning Timmies to head down-town and launch a massive counter protest? Or would we just roll over, yawn, and ask our partner to turn out the lights.

In Korea, in France, In Belgium, they know how to protest.
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Looks like you've been reading the Star too much. Do yourself a favour and just stop.
 
just east of the creek said:
There is a nice article in the Star today reviewing Doug's list questionable decisions. Its rather long and damming. But we should ask ourselves why we keep getting inflicted with these incompetent provincial governments - cast your mind back to the previous Liberal and Conservative governments as well. It's not just that they made the incorrect decision, that happens. But that he decisions are heavily underpinned by deceitful practices. Why do we continue to elect officials, who in turn hire a bureaucracy, that believe they can lie, cheat and generally bungle themselves to a further government mandate. Is it the power of the $250 cheque? Is that really the level of our conscious thinking about making decisions on who to vote for, or even to participate in the process.

If Doug decided late tonight that he was going to declare martial law in Ontario because of too many accusations of incompetence with Metrolinx, would we skip our morning Timmies to head down-town and launch a massive counter protest? Or would we just roll over, yawn, and ask our partner to turn out the lights.

In Korea, in France, In Belgium, they know how to protest.
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Voters tend to elect officials on their policies and platforms. If those officials end up being corrupt and unethical, it's usually on those officials and not on the voters. And not to be confused with electing officials whose polices and platforms are knowingly awful...

northyorker1 said:
Looks like you've been reading the Star too much. Do yourself a favour and just stop.
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And how is this not different from reading the other papers? I agree The Star is pretty bad at times, but it goes pretty much downhill from there as far as Canadian media coverage is concerned, IMO. And sine you are bringing this up...
 
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UtakataNoAnnex said:
Voters tend to elect officials on their policies and platforms. If those officials end up being corrupt and unethical, it's usually on those officials and not on the voters. And not to be confused with electing officials whose polices and platforms are knowingly awful...
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And when they elect officials who are knowingly corrupt and unethical?
 
just east of the creek said:
There is a nice article in the Star today reviewing Doug's list questionable decisions. Its rather long and damming. But we should ask ourselves why we keep getting inflicted with these incompetent provincial governments - cast your mind back to the previous Liberal and Conservative governments as well. It's not just that they made the incorrect decision, that happens. But that he decisions are heavily underpinned by deceitful practices. Why do we continue to elect officials, who in turn hire a bureaucracy, that believe they can lie, cheat and generally bungle themselves to a further government mandate. Is it the power of the $250 cheque? Is that really the level of our conscious thinking about making decisions on who to vote for, or even to participate in the process.

If Doug decided late tonight that he was going to declare martial law in Ontario because of too many accusations of incompetence with Metrolinx, would we skip our morning Timmies to head down-town and launch a massive counter protest? Or would we just roll over, yawn, and ask our partner to turn out the lights.

In Korea, in France, In Belgium, they know how to protest.
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Big difference between declaring martial law and expediting a development that will see an under-utilized asset turned into something usable. There is a lot more OP rage on this forum and the Toronto Star than there is in the general public. Most of the people I speak to are happy something is finally happening on this property.
 
Civdis said:
Big difference between declaring martial law and expediting a development that will see an under-utilized asset turned into something usable. There is a lot more OP rage on this forum and the Toronto Star than there is in the general public. Most of the people I speak to are happy something is finally happening on this property.
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Are your claiming that your sample size of your circle of people you speak to is more accurate in gauging opinion on this than that of this forum or the Star?

...I mean, not that's really important here or should be. Rather the findings of inadequacies and problematic ethics in acquiring the change, regardless of public opinion...or the opinions of your friends for that matter.
 
UtakataNoAnnex said:
Are your claiming that your sample size of your circle of people you speak to is more accurate in gauging opinion on this than that of this forum or the Star?

...I mean, not that's really important here or should be. Rather the findings of inadequacies and problematic ethics in acquiring the change, regardless of public opinion...or the opinions of your friends for that matter.
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Do not want to get into an argument about the statistical accuracy of my sampling, but I will say that my network is likely much more diverse than the contributors to this forum. This forum is a collection of city building nerds (me included 😎) who have strong opinions on these issues. I am not saying that Doug always plays by the rules, but I am saying that the majority of Ontarians do not seem to care, rightly or wrongly. I may have to hold my nose sometimes, but I really like Ford's ability to get things built. It is obvious that the majority of Ontarians agree with me.
 
Civdis said:
Do not want to get into an argument about the statistical accuracy of my sampling, but I will say that my network is likely much more diverse than the contributors to this forum. This forum is a collection of city building nerds (me included 😎) who have strong opinions on these issues. I am not saying that Doug always plays by the rules, but I am saying that the majority of Ontarians do not seem to care, rightly or wrongly. I may have to hold my nose sometimes, but I really like Ford's ability to get things built. It is obvious that the majority of Ontarians agree with me.
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You brought it up, I was just pointing out that you probably don't want to go there.

...but my main gist is that's not really important, regardless of opinions or polls. Rather is what the government is doing following the rules they agree to when it comes to ethics, interests and oversight. And the audit has concluded that they're not. And we should be concerned about that whether we support Doug's OP rebuild here or not...

...if you still think that's fine, then all I can say you are getting what you vote for. And that's all I am going to say on the matter.
 
UtakataNoAnnex said:
You brought it up, I was just pointing out that you probably don't want to go there.

...but my main gist is that's not really important, regardless of opinions or polls. Rather is what the government is doing following the rules they agree to when it comes to ethics, interests and oversight. And the audit has concluded that they're not. And we should be concerned about that whether we support Doug's OP rebuild here or not...

...if you still think that's fine, then all I can say you are getting what you vote for. And that's all I am going to say on the matter.
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We can I agree on that, "I am getting what I voted for", a government that invests in infrastructure and gets things built. Doug is far from perfect (all governments battle with ethics), but overall I am happy with the results.
 
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