BB ON
Active Member
Pioneer Village:
Highway 407:
VMC:
Highway 407:
VMC:
- Thread starter 299 bloor call control.
- Start date
steveintoronto
Superstar
Yeah, that was discussed in this string some months back. The station looks like shid, like something in a junk-yard, and cases of the product not living up to claims were posted and detailed.
Here's the claim:
[Weathering steel, best-known under the trademark COR-TEN® steel, is a group of steel alloys which were developed to obviate the need for painting, and form a stable rust-like appearance if exposed to the weather for several years.]
"Several years?"
They're going to have to treat that now with a finish that seals it. God knows how they got sweet-talked into using it. I thought when discussing it some months back that heat-treating it formed a patina, but studies have shown that not to be the case.
There's this magical treatment called "clear varnish" that works well...or since it looks so God awful, make that pigmented varnish.
Here's how UT wrote about it:
"Throughout much of the space, an intricate terrazzo floor has been installed. The multi-toned floor is accented by notes of rust, which subtly reference the weathered steel cladding that characterizes the station."
http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2016/08/inside-ttcs-will-alsop-designed-pioneer-village-station
Let me paraphrase that: "We meant to do that"...
There've been many warnings, even the propriety manufacturer warns:
http://www.distressedmetals.com/corten/limitations/[...]
Chlorides
Environments where the protective rust layer cannot spontaneously form on weathering steels is in coastal environments where the amount of air-borne sea-salt particles is relatively high. A general metric Distressed Metals uses when identifying zones where weathering steel will
have protective issues with salt deposition into the oxide layer is areas located within 1 mile from the ocean shore that receive continual salt spray.
When salt is continually deposited onto the steel surface, it tends to develop the rust product Akaganéite which is a non-adherent rust product and in high concentrations is not constructive to the development of the inner
protective oxide layer. Beware of weathering steel products which use high amounts of chloride (salt) as a initiator to the rust layer. Over time they will display the non-adherent nature of their oxide layer and do not provide adequate corrosion protection that is typically desired when using weathering steel as a cladding material.
De-icing Salt
The use of de-icing salts on roads in close proximity to weathering steel may lead to problems in extreme cases. Typically, their use is not an issue unless consistent and concentrated amounts are deposited onto the surface of the weathering steel and are not allowed to be rain-washed off.
Pollutants
Avoid environments where high concentrations of corrosive chemicals or industrial pollutants are present such as Sulfur Dioxide (SO2). Environments with high concentrations of Sulfur Dioxide are rarely encountered today and studies have shown that industrial environments containing normal to low levels of pollutants aid the steel in developing the protective oxide layer. [...]
So OK as long as the buses don't burn hydrocarbons (diesel being the worst) and idle and de-icers aren't used on the roadway. Someone send a memo to the TTC.
http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/28/nyregion/building-with-weathering-steel-both-rugged-and-rusty.html[...]
“When the material gets wet, there is a rusty wash that goes down onto adjacent areas of concrete,” said Michael Devonshire, a materials expert at Jan Hird Pokorny Associates, an architecture firm. “It can get really funky looking.”
TheEast of East condominium building in Long Island City,Queens, for example, uses thin slabs of corrugated weathering steel, applied as a scrim over the building’s envelope. The slabs have rusted to a deep burnt orange, staining sections of the surrounding sidewalk.
[...]
Amol Sarva, the developer of East of East, said he planned on tidying up the sidewalks by pouring new ones. (His architect said that a gutter system was designed to catch the rusty drips, but they were not properly installed).
[...]
Architects suggest that the reason might be that the material can be tricky to work with and the detailing must be done precisely. For example, if the design allows water to pool in a given spot, the building is likely to end up with holes in its facade where the rust has eaten all the way through.
Brian Messana, a partner at the architecture firm Messana O’Rorke, who built a weathering steel extension on his own country house in Columbia County, N.Y., mentioned another big drawback.
Rusty water that has dripped from the Greenwich Street town house over six years has stained portions of the sidewalk below.CreditRuby Washington/The New York Times
“It rusts,” he said. “In the city, you don’t want it to rust onto somebody else’s property.”
Mr. Messana said he considered the material to be quite beautiful, describing it with words like modern, warm and tactile. But he has reservations about it, even in his own country home.
“It stained some of the glass,” he said. “Just a couple weekends ago I was thinking, ‘I should really figure out how to get that off.’ “
To fend off some of the headaches, the steel on the Barclays Center was weathered before it ever made it to Brooklyn. Gregg Pasquarelli, a principal at SHoP Architects, which designed the arena, said the steel components spent about four months at anIndianapolisplant where they were put through more than a dozen wet-and-dry cycles a day. (Mr. Pasquarelli said the arena looked to him like what would happen if “Richard Serraand Chanel created a U.F.O. together.")
The process put about six years of weathering onto the steel, according to Robert Sanna, an executive vice president and director at Forest City Ratner, the developer of the Barclays Center. So while there probably will be some rusty dripping, Ms. Sanna said, “this should keep it to a minimum, and you won’t have to worry that it will stain your sweater as you walk by.”
[...]
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TJ O'Pootertoot
Senior Member
Don't get me wrong - the station seems massive for what it is, especially with the 407 Transitway that was supposed to give it relevance pushed back beyond 2040 BUT...
it won't be entirely dependent on the buses. It will also be the parking terminal for anyone coming from the north, as there is no lot at VMC. (It occurs to me, I have no idea what they're doing but I assume they're putting up fare gates and such at the Walmart and other big-box parking right around VMC....
Transportfan
Senior Member
How will you pay with cash?
Edit: I get it now. The new Presto gates accept tokens you buy at the booth or machine I assume.
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Leo_Chan
Senior Member
Actually, they their minds and are building a parking structure (underground IIRC) for TTC parking.
Attachments
Transportfan
Senior Member
I don't get why the plans changed and they're now building a terminal at VMC. A suburban style terminal doesn't belong in VMC and having all non-VIVA/Zum transferway connections at 407 would give the station a lot more use
Leo_Chan
Senior Member
smuncky
Senior Member
From what I read at the station and saw, was there is a 300-400mm strip of permeable concrete, at least around the 2 entrance buildings, that was especially put in for the reason of containing the rust runoff.
WillTo
Senior Member
Actually I don't recall seeing Presto gates that accept tokens.
Maybe they will have to setup "crash" fare collectors with a manually opened gate until limited-use Presto medium is available.
NotMathematical
Active Member
With cash, you will have to purchase a single ride PRESTO card from the vending machines at these stations. No tokens can be used or purchased at these stations too.
WillTo
Senior Member
Just reading the postcard they were handing out at the Open House
This raises more questions than answers.
Being a Presto user (and someone who can't really use the extension anyways) I didn't think to ask how they plan to accept the non-presto non-metropass medium.
This raises more questions than answers.
Being a Presto user (and someone who can't really use the extension anyways) I didn't think to ask how they plan to accept the non-presto non-metropass medium.
Adjei
Senior Member
Too much concrete in interior of these stations..
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steveintoronto
Superstar
Most of them are brutal. Concrete can look wonderful if finished or white/specialty type. The irony is that the best looking subway station on that line by far remains one of the old ones, and in bad need of some TLC: Dupont.
I have absolutely no compulsion to go up to the nether regions to view such monstrosity. I've seen far more inviting factories in my day. This is what happens when a project 'goes off the rails'.
Chris Selley: Spadina subway extension a classic Toronto transit screwup
As CEO Andy Byford says, there are important lessons to be learned here for the TTC. We must hope its political masters are willing to learn them as well
http://nationalpost.com/news/toront...y-extension-a-classic-toronto-transit-screwup
Some architects sued the TTC for breach of contract, and I'm sure some of the result we see is spite from that.
Meantime, here's a project on-time, on-budget, and a delight in architectural enlightenment:
http://www.efig.co.uk/index.php/all-news/item/efig-s-visit-to-crossrail-roof-gardens
And down below:
Even before the lighting is installed, note how close that comes to the renditions:
http://www.crossrail.co.uk/route/stations/liverpool-street/
London can be a bitch of a city to live in, (I defined it as 'social claustrophobia' even working in the midst of the music industry as a technologist) but for a nation that has screwed up previous projects badly, it now seems to be Canada's turn to be the laggard.
Byford's "Lessons to be learned" alright. But will we? No sign of change yet in 'the provinces'.
And all of the pics posted of Crossrail? Almost all concrete...with flourishes of wood, some stations being almost entirely of grain oriented wood. It isn't high-tech so much as style and class. And competence.
steveintoronto
Superstar
Parts of it are far better than other stations, it's really a patchwork though, as this illustrates:The concrete interior of Highway 407 station looks fantastic, in my opinion. The shapes and textures, especially approaching platform level, are interesting.
It's a shame few people will ever see the station in person
Even some top-coat on the concrete would go a long way to improving it. That's *glum*...on a good day.
