One main criticism I keep seeing about CityPlace is about how it is a sterile environment, poorly planned, not a vibrant community, urban suburb, etc etc..
Keep in mind it is still a construction site, vibrant communities take time. With that many people suddenly moving into the area, and loads of construction going around everywhere, of course they won't stick around and go to the retail shops in the area (that aren't even finished yet). Once CityPlace is genuinely finished is when you will see people sticking around, and the neighbourhood will become more vibrant over time. Look at what surrounds it.. Spadina and Bathurst, the Waterfront, the Skydome, a newly developing and commercializing Bremner.. Very soon this will truly bring loads of people to the retail in the area, and there will be a lot of "life" thrust into an area that previously nobody would even approach.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither is CityPlace.
 
Spectra is really designed for all the complaints that cityplace lacks colour and is too much glass. Now they turned those criticism into a marketing ploy for this building.

People will never satisfied with Concord!
 
My point is, there are few sites in this city that have had as much time to plan as this site has. Yet the buildings all look the same, they do nothing to create an "urban" dynamic streetscape. It's absolutely true they have built a few parks but this area could have had a more street-conscious design - blend in with the downtown rather than what it is - a cluster of separate sterile glass clad buildings - a vertical suburban subdivision in the centre of the city. It would have been nice to see a few buildings employ different exterior materials (is it so bad to have a couple of the buildings look a little different than the next?), add more retail to the street etc.

It doesn’t require a great deal of scrutiny to see that the developer has instructed his architect to keep it cheap. When the architectural flare of a building is some coloured glass, you just have to shake your head.
 
you all will be glad that they stuck it out with glass, glass will always be trendy unlike brick
 
wang888 said:
you all will be glad that they stuck it out with glass, glass will always be trendy unlike brick
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Untrue.

What do you think will go out of style first?

bank_america_tower_c160610_dsesto.jpg


Or

kveus0734s.jpg
 
wang888 said:
you all will be glad that they stuck it out with glass, glass will always be trendy unlike brick
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Totally disagree .... brick and stone will age much better ...

what looks better now now, TD Centre or Queens Park ??
 
The_Architect said:
One main criticism I keep seeing about CityPlace is about how it is a sterile environment, poorly planned, not a vibrant community, urban suburb, etc etc..
Keep in mind it is still a construction site, vibrant communities take time. With that many people suddenly moving into the area, and loads of construction going around everywhere, of course they won't stick around and go to the retail shops in the area (that aren't even finished yet). Once CityPlace is genuinely finished is when you will see people sticking around, and the neighbourhood will become more vibrant over time. Look at what surrounds it.. Spadina and Bathurst, the Waterfront, the Skydome, a newly developing and commercializing Bremner.. Very soon this will truly bring loads of people to the retail in the area, and there will be a lot of "life" thrust into an area that previously nobody would even approach.

Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither is CityPlace.
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Vibrant street life is absent from Cityplace by design. It will be a nice place to go for walks and there will be some foot-traffic by library patrons and by those using the few businesses that are located in the bases of some of the towers. But it's not a mixed use community in the urban sense. It's a homogeneous residential (bedroom) community with a few commercial amenities.
 
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This building is still primarily grey, like all the other buildings in Cityplace. What is the point of that little colour strip? It doesn't relate to anything. Yeah, I know, there is also some colour in the podium but the grey is so overpowering, it loses its punch. Cityplace is a mass of grey, no matter what direction you look and I can't figure out why people seem fine with that. Is grey always going to be the IT colour in Toronto? (our winters aren't grey enough, right?) I guess it wouldn't be such an issue if so many other condos around town weren't also grey. I don't care how much people love the colour grey, isn't there a point that it becomes too monotonous? I reached that point a long time ago. Once this city becomes overwhelmingly grey, we are going to have to live with this depressing colour indefinitely. Cityplace has just become too overwhelmingly grey and dull for me. Parade is one of the ugliest coloured buildings in Toronto. What the hell were they thinking? Picture those same buildings in white or black and it would have been a much more attractive complex.

Another problem is, that every space is being built out, so how will Cityplace be able to develop in the future? If every developable plot of land is built on, there is no possibility for other uses to develop. There will be no room for new retail complexes, theatres, cinemas, music venues, nightclubs or anything that makes downtown life interesting. I can't see any urban fabric developing, except for maybe services or some tiny retail units, in some of those condos along Fort York. Where else will there be space to build anything cultural, interesting or fun? That's it, the opportunities for a mixed use, downtown neighbourhood, have been squandered. The fact that all the towers seem so similar, is also not a plus. They could have offered a bit more diversity in the built form. (or some god damned colour! lol)

We know how to build great neighbourhoods, that offer a diversity of uses, and give something back to all Torontonians, yet we allow developers to turn downtown land, into dull, residential neighbourhoods. Hell, even Canoe Landing Park seems like a patch of cement beside a patch of grass. It has no meeting place or any focal point. People use it to kick a ball around the soccer field and take their dogs for a crap. I never see anybody using that park for the sake of enjoying the park. If you don't play soccer or have a dog, there is no use to go into that park. Sugar Beach is harder to get to and much smaller, yet I've never seen even half as many people in that park, as I do regularly, in Sugar Beach. It just does not attract many people.

Yes, I know it will change when everything is finished but so far, I can only feel bad for the fact that Cityplace could have been so much better if the city put a bit more effort into designing the district. While I do not consider Cityplace a disaster, I do not want to see another Cityplace built ever again, in Toronto. We can do SO much better. Oh well, live and learn.
 
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Good for pointing out Spectra ain't Mies. In fact, from a design perspective, it has more in common with the slab you've posted - that's what Cityplace would have used if it was built in the 50s/60s/70s.

AoD
 
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I can't believe people are calling this area lifeless. The area is not finished! The community centre and school are not yet built. The library is not yet built. The west end of the site is a massive construction site. The "Signature" site is still a condo sales centre. Wait until all the buildings are built and occupied including the new retail coming. Wait until people can walk or cycle in and out from Bathurst and from Front Street. Right now the people west of Bathurst basically are cut off from this place. There will be a lot more people coming in and out when everything is done.
 
Edward said:
I can't believe people are calling this area lifeless. The area is not finished! The community centre and school are not yet built. The library is not yet built. The west end of the site is a massive construction site. The "Signature" site is still a condo sales centre. Wait until all the buildings are built and occupied including the new retail coming. Wait until people can walk or cycle in and out from Bathurst and from Front Street. Right now the people west of Bathurst basically are cut off from this place. There will be a lot more people coming in and out when everything is done.
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Haters love to hate. I think some members here have made it their full time job to come down hard on Cityplace for every single detail.

I ain't saying its the most spectular part of Toronto. But its a lot better than other places.

And what's with the whole thing about adding mega retail to Cityplace? Has it ever occurred to these haters that people actually like a small suburbia within the city? Why are we trying to turn Fort York into the next Vegas strip?

I plan to raise a small family at Cityplace so do I really want drunk zombies lurking around when I'm out for a walk with my family?
 
RedRaptor said:
Haters love to hate. I think some members here have made it their full time job to come down hard on Cityplace for every single detail.

I ain't saying its the most spectular part of Toronto. But its a lot better than other places.

And what's with the whole thing about adding mega retail to Cityplace? Has it ever occurred to these haters that people actually like a small suburbia within the city? Why are we trying to turn Fort York into the next Vegas strip?

I plan to raise a small family at Cityplace so do I really want drunk zombies lurking around when I'm out for a walk with my family?
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Throwing out the 'hater' nonsense is not meaningful discussion. My personal interest is in trying to understand how built form effects community as well as individual experiences. There are many things to like about city place but there are many things it does not do well. By design, it will never have an organic community feel. The scale is too large and homogeneous. And there is no possibility to change that. There are no spaces where a small business could renovate and create a cool little cafe, or gallery, or clothing store. There will be foot traffic by those coming and going as well as by park users and people just going for strolls. This will create some street life but not in the urban sense. It will never be the Danforth or Queen West. It will never evolve into anything other than what it was designed to be, which is a bedroom community with a few amenities.
 
neubilder said:
Throwing out the 'hater' nonsense is not meaningful discussion. My personal interest is in trying to understand how built form effects community as well as individual experiences. There are many things to like about city place but there are many things it does not do well. By design, it will never have an organic community feel. The scale is too large and homogeneous. And there is no possibility to change that. There are no spaces where a small business could renovate and create a cool little cafe, or gallery, or clothing store. There will be foot traffic by those coming and going as well as by park users and people just going for strolls. This will create some street life but not in the urban sense. It will never be the Danforth or Queen West. It will never evolve into anything other than what it was designed to be, which is a bedroom community with a few amenities.
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You're already being proven wrong. A small gallery has already opened up in the base of Parade (One of the live/work units). The spaces are there, but like everyone else has said, 'Rome wasn't built in a day'.
 
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