Trump takes Manhattan - by me

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TonyV said:
The more I see of Trump Toronto, the more I like it. I think it may be Eb's best work. Very urban.
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Ok, um you are going to have to explain this to me... how is this his best work? And It is very urban because of the limitations of the site- there is nothing special about this building, its just tall...... Personally I think this building is one of the ugliest in the city- Its a post modern monstrosity with no character or architectural ambition. So if someone can enlighten me to why this is a good building please go ahead.


azzo
 
azzo said:
Ok, um you are going to have to explain this to me... how is this his best work? And It is very urban because of the limitations of the site- there is nothing special about this building, its just tall...... Personally I think this building is one of the ugliest in the city- Its a post modern monstrosity with no character or architectural ambition.
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Woah there, champ. He's entitled to his opinion just as much as you're entitled to yours.


So if someone can enlighten me to why this is a good building please go ahead.


azzo
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So you're not a fan of postmodern architecture -- I don't think it's anyone's job on this forum to make you change your mind.
 
Hipster Duck said:
Those aerial shots are amazing.

Viewed from that angle, there is a clear difference in scale between all of the Class A bank towers (including B/A) that were built since the TD centre and the rest of the office bulidings in the core. The pre-1967 office buildings were not block-spanning forms and have similar footprints to the pre-war office buildings in Lower Manhattan - the difference, of course, being that they were not nearly as tall.

Trump Tower is basically a throwback to that era of building within lots and parcels rather than establishing a giant hulking mass on its own plaza. It's also as tall as a Wall street tower like 70 Pine or 40 Wall. I think Toronto's financial district would have been more architecturally interesting and varied - and the canyon effect of Bay street more perceptible - if we had continued to build like that.
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Bay Street's canyon effect is very much perceptible. Buildings from all eras tend to be built up to the street. It's King Street which is really affected by the plazas like that of the T-D Centre, but then again, King Street is an impressive street in the Financial District with a superb built form. The plazas have their own merits, allowing green spaces, pedestrian flow and interesting positioning of towers. They showcase the Modernist ideal of building tall buildings: both high density and open spaces could be achieved. Obviously, many Modernist plazas often didn't work too well, but in the Financial District I think they do. I love walking through the plazas of the T-D Centre as a shortcut, surrounded by beautiful architecture and sculptures.

While it's true that if the Modernists built on smaller lots more could have been preserved, what they achieved in Toronto's Financial District is admirable and interesting and something that cities with nothing but walls of buildings side-by-side could admire too.
 
junctionist said:
Bay Street's canyon effect is very much perceptible. Buildings from all eras tend to be built up to the street. It's King Street which is really affected by the plazas like that of the T-D Centre, but then again, King Street is an impressive street in the Financial District with a superb built form. The plazas have their own merits, allowing green spaces, pedestrian flow and interesting positioning of towers. They showcase the Modernist ideal of building tall buildings: both high density and open spaces could be achieved. Obviously, many Modernist plazas often didn't work too well, but in the Financial District I think they do. I love walking through the plazas of the T-D Centre as a shortcut, surrounded by beautiful architecture and sculptures.

While it's true that if the Modernists built on smaller lots more could have been preserved, what they achieved in Toronto's Financial District is admirable and interesting and something that cities with nothing but walls of buildings side-by-side could admire too.
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Well put. Once you experience first hand the congestion on Wall Street on a hot July weekday afternoon.. it really makes you appreciate Toronto's financial district for what it's worth.
 
Not wishing to respond to azzo's aggressive criticisms (he or she is entitled to disagree with me) -

I find the design of Trump Toronto to be a welcome addition in all respects.

Melange (in this case, meaning mixture & variety) is what I like about how the Bay St. environment has developed over the years and I feel that Trump is going to be a strong contributor in that sense. And frankly, it's so refreshing to see something both tall and slender, built on a lot which only a short time ago would not have been considered for a building of this scale or height.

I walked by the site yesterday and found lots about the finishes to admire, too. I am upbeat about this building and the developing Bay St. canyon effect in general.
 
I love walking through the plazas of the T-D Centre as a shortcut, surrounded by beautiful architecture and sculptures.
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Yes. Toronto is lucky when it comes to having an entire integrated modernist "district". In fact, there really should be a move afoot to declare the 60's and 70's modernist district a "heritage area" before someone gets the bright idea of ripping up the plazas and "intensifying".
 
One modernist thing I would rip up and intensify, is the Bank of Montreal podium at King and Bay. I would go back in time and force them to keep the bank building that was there and integrate the new First Canadian Place around it. It was mowed down for no reason. They didn't create a plaza or a public space. Seems like pointless destruction to me.
 
I do like the podium on the inside but the destruction of the old bank of Montreal building is probably more regrettable than the Star Tower. At least the Star was replaced by a 950 footer. The Bank of Montreal mirrored the Bank of Nova Scotia perfectly too.
 
maestro said:
I do like the podium on the inside but the destruction of the old bank of Montreal building is probably more regrettable than the Star Tower. At least the Star was replaced by a 950 footer. The Bank of Montreal mirrored the Bank of Nova Scotia perfectly too.
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FCP has nothing on the old Toronto Star building, to hell with height.
 
Now that more of the glass is up, I'm really liking the contrast with the stone. Doesn't look so bleak after all.
 
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