robmausser said:
How many tracks will be needed once the Kitchener, Milton and Barrie line all go to AD2W service in the future?
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Which area??

Barrie will have 2. Need to do a grade separation for CP tracks at Davenport with an elevation being the cheapest and fastest route as CP will not put up with another West Toronto Diamond mess. It will effect all its majors lines there compare to only 1 line at the diamond. An EA was started for this years ago and has to be updated. Don't expect to see anything until 2017 for it at this time, but you never know. You may get the St Clair station at the same time.

The Milton line will be 2 tracks up to the Junction. From the Junction to Milton, it will be 4 tracks with a fly-under in the Lambton Yard area and to be completed by 2021/23 depending on the timetable and funding. Close to $2 Billion for this expansion
I expect the Milton train will stop at Bloor in 2016 as the platform is there for it now.

The Halton Sub from Bramalea to Georgetown has to be upgraded to 3 tracks at the pinch points where 2 are today and 4 tracks where possible. No timetable at this time, but an EA is to come out late this year or early next for it. A fly-under will have to be built at Bramalea. The rest of the Kitchener line is to be upgraded to 2 tracks with some 3 tracks. You would be looking at about $2 Billion or more for this upgrade.

As noted above, the corridor south of Dundas will support 8 tracks, but different version as to number of tracks that will be there this years is between 5-7 tracks as it keeps changing. The north tunnel at Starchan has 4 tracks in it now. This means the south will see 1-3 tracks and expecting 3 this year.

The last track will be added as needed.

As for the tunnel bridge in Weston, costing an extra $1-$2 million for a park and noises level caused by your local NIMBY folks including the ward councilor and the local MP.
 
drum118 said:
There are to be 6 tracks in this area, but only 5 will be laid with track 1 missing.
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Contrary to what I had been told at the beginning, they are doing the full build-out now.

Which means that they will have 6 tracks through there - 4 for the Weston Sub, and two on the west side of the corridor for the Galt Sub.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
Contrary to what I had been told at the beginning, they are doing the full build-out now.

Which means that they will have 6 tracks through there - 4 for the Weston Sub, and two on the west side of the corridor for the Galt Sub.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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Well I don't see why they wouldn't. Getting another crew out there at some point in the future to slap in another track would be an additional and unneccessary fixed cost, and also cause additional and unneccessary train delay. It just wouldn't make sense.
 
How many tracks can fit under the 401 near Etobicoke North Station? It looks that's going to be a pinchpoint.
 
ShonTron said:
How many tracks can fit under the 401 near Etobicoke North Station? It looks that's going to be a pinchpoint.
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The existing structure handles 3, the EA allows for a new underpass for a 4th track north of the existing underpass. There are 2 structures that, at the end of the project, will not be built to full build-out spec and those are the Dufferin bridge (the city recently finished it to 7 which is 1 short of the 8 for full build), an the 401 underpass.
 
DonValleyRainbow said:
Well I don't see why they wouldn't. Getting another crew out there at some point in the future to slap in another track would be an additional and unneccessary fixed cost, and also cause additional and unneccessary train delay. It just wouldn't make sense.
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This is the same logic that says that we should build a subway anywhere and everywhere because "eventually they will need one", and it's completely and totally wrong.

By building a potentially unnecessary track now, these additional costs are now required to be paid on an ongoing basis in perpetuity:
- property taxes are higher on "improved" land. Tracks are considered an improvement.
- maintenance on the track and structure.
- additional switches and signalling to service that additional track.
- maintenance on those additional switches and signalling.

And some of these are not inconsequential on a yearly basis, especially the maintenance on switches.

Now, all that being said - if they run a considerably better service on the corridor once all of the improvements are complete than is currently being run, than you know what, I'm not going to complain too loudly. But if all they do is hourly off-peak and one or two more rush hour trains, that's not good enough, and that's a waste of money.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
This is the same logic that says that we should build a subway anywhere and everywhere because "eventually they will need one", and it's completely and totally wrong.

By building a potentially unnecessary track now, these additional costs are now required to be paid on an ongoing basis in perpetuity:
- property taxes are higher on "improved" land. Tracks are considered an improvement.
- maintenance on the track and structure.
- additional switches and signalling to service that additional track.
- maintenance on those additional switches and signalling.

And some of these are not inconsequential on a yearly basis, especially the maintenance on switches.

Now, all that being said - if they run a considerably better service on the corridor once all of the improvements are complete than is currently being run, than you know what, I'm not going to complain too loudly. But if all they do is hourly off-peak and one or two more rush hour trains, that's not good enough, and that's a waste of money.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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Perhaps this is just an acknowledgment that with the Liberal pre-election pronouncements that all lines would have two way 7 day 15 minute service within 10 years that the extra capacity will be needed much sooner than they originally planned?

Not to get too pedantic about your lists of costs but does ML pay property taxes?
 
smallspy said:
Railways pay property taxes to the municipalities, despite their federal oversight. Metrolinx is no exception.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
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Thanks....I assumed that railways like CN and CP would pay taxes....but also assumed that publicly owned entities like ML would not. Getting a bit astray but do they perhaps make PILT payments instead of taxes?
 
In a shocking move last week, MPP Cheri DiNovo of the NDP intoduced legislation that would stop Metrolinx from running the Union-Pearson train until electrification is complete - http://www.ontla.on.ca/web/bills/bi...en&BillID=2996&isCurrent=false&ParlSessionID=

I just can't get my head around how the NDP can be so completely fiscally irresponsible to suggest that service on this line be delayed for who knows how many years while they get the electrification running. Given that the Tier 4 diesels will create much less pollution than the taxis and buses currently in use, they are going to increase pollution and put lives of some of most sensitive residents at risk.

My gosh, I'm so relieved that the NDP (who seem to have become mostly a group of populists and Nimbys) have had their hold on the government eliminated, if this is the kind of crap that they think is acceptable.

Reading the legislation though, they have left the door open to using coal, rather than diesel. I wonder if the DMU is convertible to CMU.
 
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