I can't believe people would want to live in a 330 sq ft room? How on earth can you sandwich in a bathroom, laundry, kitchen, living room, etc in that small space. Unbelievable! That would be like living in my master bedroom. I can only imagine that a unit like this will probably fetch over $350,000 and 350/month in condo fees!
 
travis3000 said:
I can't believe people would want to live in a 330 sq ft room? How on earth can you sandwich in a bathroom, laundry, kitchen, living room, etc in that small space. Unbelievable! That would be like living in my master bedroom. I can only imagine that a unit like this will probably fetch over $350,000 and 350/month in condo fees!
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If you're a Ryerson student, even a U of T one as it's close too, if you can afford the rent, you'll happily live in 330 sq ft during school years.

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If you have well-off parents than this is a much nicer accommodation than the dorms at U of T or Ryerson (plus there is a shortage on those campuses). These tiny units could also be used as a executive crash pad (or those who work long shifts and don't need much), illegal Airbnbs, etc...
I've also seeing more and more multi-generational families living in the same condo building in multiple units, so this could be a granny/in-law suite.
Also remember that large buildings like this have extensive amenities so you are not confined to your own unit to live your own life.

There are lots of micro-apartments in London, Hong Kong, New York and other places in the world where the cost of living is extremely high.
If you can simplify your life and not keep stuff you don't need or use, it's doable, it's just difficult in North American culture where consumerism and consumption prevails.
 
Larissa Doherty said:
Ummm.... actually, $350K for a unit like that would be considered cheap. The builder's in fact selling all of their bachelor units for just under and above $500K, according to the price lists that have been released. I suspect there are so many micro units in this project specifically because it provides that many more "affordable" options for buyers.

Also, all of the builder's printed promo material states the tower is 85 stories - at least for now.
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Yeah.. the current price per sq. ft. in Toronto downtown is around $1000 CAD. Is this considered cheap ? May be.. if you compare the current price in Manhattan (as per diagram), Hong Kong, London etc.
Question is whether Toronto will continue to attract investment to generate jobs and population growth (from abroad or other provinces/cities).

The speculative/investment money is highly dependant on mortgage rate and vacancy rate in the rental market.
The owners/buyers will consider their life styles and values. As the townhouse prices came down and condo price went up in the last year or so,
people will now have a choice.

My view (may be stating the obvious) is the condo price will be driven primarily by the construction cost, demand and (unlimited) supply :), but not going to spike up any time soon. But it is amazing to see how Toronto skylines have changed in the last decade.


New-York-Property-Price-Trend-1024x714.jpg
 
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Larissa Doherty said:
Ummm.... actually, $350K for a unit like that would be considered cheap. The builder's in fact selling all of their bachelor units for just under and above $500K, according to the price lists that have been released. I suspect there are so many micro units in this project specifically because it provides that many more "affordable" options for buyers.

Also, all of the builder's printed promo material states the tower is 85 stories - at least for now.
Click to expand...

$500,000 for 330 sq ft? Oh man that's just crazy. I get the convenience factor 100%, but it seems to me the units keep getting smaller. I personally could never imagine selling my 1350 sq ft bungalow (with another 1350 finished sq ft in the basement, plus 2 car garage, backyard, modern updated) to exchange it for a 330 sq ft bedroom in Toronto. I don't care how convenient it is!

Regardless, Im sure investors will gobble this one up as well given the high rental demand in TO. Its just a shame the average everyday Canadian could never afford even this small unit. Let's say you managed to save up $50,000 (a great accomplishment), you'd have to mortgage $450,000 which translates into just over $2000/month in payments plus another $500/month in condo fees, plus another $200/month in taxes, plus internet, hydro, insurance, etc. That poor soul would be shelling out 3k per month just to live in a bedroom! The individuals income would have to be over 80k per year just to qualify for the mortgage. I just don't see how this is sustainable. I can now see why residents in TO are crying about affordability.
 
travis3000 said:
$500,000 for 330 sq ft? Oh man that's just crazy. I get the convenience factor 100%, but it seems to me the units keep getting smaller. I personally could never imagine selling my 1350 sq ft bungalow (with another 1350 finished sq ft in the basement, plus 2 car garage, backyard, modern updated) to exchange it for a 330 sq ft bedroom in Toronto. I don't care how convenient it is!

Regardless, Im sure investors will gobble this one up as well given the high rental demand in TO. Its just a shame the average everyday Canadian could never afford even this small unit. Let's say you managed to save up $50,000 (a great accomplishment), you'd have to mortgage $450,000 which translates into just over $2000/month in payments plus another $500/month in condo fees, plus another $200/month in taxes, plus internet, hydro, insurance, etc. That poor soul would be shelling out 3k per month just to live in a bedroom! The individuals income would have to be over 80k per year just to qualify for the mortgage. I just don't see how this is sustainable. I can now see why residents in TO are crying about affordability.
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This is what happens when you ignore problems that have existed for a while, then you go and add rent control and other rules adn the prices rise even further. Less people can afford to buy so they look to rent and that also pushes up the $.

We got to this point because of a group of people who complained about affordability. Things just got more unaffordable for them :eek:
 
travis3000 said:
Regardless, Im sure investors will gobble this one up as well given the high rental demand in TO. Its just a shame the average everyday Canadian could never afford even this small unit. Let's say you managed to save up $50,000 (a great accomplishment), you'd have to mortgage $450,000 which translates into just over $2000/month in payments plus another $500/month in condo fees, plus another $200/month in taxes, plus internet, hydro, insurance, etc. That poor soul would be shelling out 3k per month just to live in a bedroom! The individuals income would have to be over 80k per year just to qualify for the mortgage. I just don't see how this is sustainable. I can now see why residents in TO are crying about affordability.
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I don't totally disagree, but, baked into your analysis is an assumption that a person making $80k/year should be able to afford a brand new condo located right downtown in one of the city's nicest/tallest buildings in one of the world's major cities. Yes, it's a small condo, but it's still a luxury condo. While I would like to live in a world where that person could afford such a condo, I don't think it's unreasonable to live in a world where they can't. If they want to buy they'll have to change their criteria, such as being less central or buying in an older building or waiting a few years until their downpayment is larger and/or their salary is higher. And, of course, none of that prevents this person from living in that luxury condo for less via renting.
 
travis3000 said:
$500,000 for 330 sq ft? Oh man that's just crazy. I get the convenience factor 100%, but it seems to me the units keep getting smaller. I personally could never imagine selling my 1350 sq ft bungalow (with another 1350 finished sq ft in the basement, plus 2 car garage, backyard, modern updated) to exchange it for a 330 sq ft bedroom in Toronto. I don't care how convenient it is!

Regardless, Im sure investors will gobble this one up as well given the high rental demand in TO. Its just a shame the average everyday Canadian could never afford even this small unit. Let's say you managed to save up $50,000 (a great accomplishment), you'd have to mortgage $450,000 which translates into just over $2000/month in payments plus another $500/month in condo fees, plus another $200/month in taxes, plus internet, hydro, insurance, etc. That poor soul would be shelling out 3k per month just to live in a bedroom! The individuals income would have to be over 80k per year just to qualify for the mortgage. I just don't see how this is sustainable. I can now see why residents in TO are crying about affordability.
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I have been lucky enough to work for a Fortune 500 company right out of school in 1984 for going on 35 years. I earned a slightly above average salary throughout my career. Though I very much wanted to...the idea of living downtown was out of the question. I COULD NOT AFFORD IT! What I fail to understand is what gives the whining kids of today the right or justification to covet a downtown living location? Either rental or condo. I mostly grew up in Scarborough...not in a house, but in a low-rise rental apartment. My parents (average earners) could not even qualify for a down payment on a "Luxury" CONDO at Vic Park and the 401 back in 1975. The solution...move to Ajax. I did the same, after renting in Thornhill for a bit. Downtown living has always meant sacrifice. Getting things handed on a platter seems to be the order of the day now. I now own a condo in the core...it only took 33 years.
 
Properties are overvalued in this city. The 2% stress test on mortgages made me roll my eyes... When I bought a condo back in 2001, my rate was 6.75% and I thought it was low.
 
Bayer, I agree with you 100%. Makes me wonder how many properties are funneled through laundered money and tax evasion? There is no requirement for full disclosure of beneficial ownership hen purchasing real estate property. A lot of properties are purchased through trusts, foundations, where all that is required is an authorized signatory.
 
Star Fox said:
I don't totally disagree, but, baked into your analysis is an assumption that a person making $80k/year should be able to afford a brand new condo located right downtown in one of the city's nicest/tallest buildings in one of the world's major cities. Yes, it's a small condo, but it's still a luxury condo. While I would like to live in a world where that person could afford such a condo, I don't think it's unreasonable to live in a world where they can't. If they want to buy they'll have to change their criteria, such as being less central or buying in an older building or waiting a few years until their downpayment is larger and/or their salary is higher. And, of course, none of that prevents this person from living in that luxury condo for less via renting.
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Love your point! Everyone crying about affordability because they want what they cant afford, tons of unit across the GTA as we speak are under 360K with living space! most of us looking to buy champagne with beer budget, we would all like to travel first class but we walk the extra steps to the back of the plane to save a few hundred dollar and spend hours / days online searching for a good deal, we can do the same here.
Who is able to buy $1,800 + per sq.ft. for a good location and luxury building let them! #skyview
 
Isotack said:
I have been lucky enough to work for a Fortune 500 company right out of school in 1984 for going on 35 years. I earned a slightly above average salary throughout my career. Though I very much wanted to...the idea of living downtown was out of the question. I COULD NOT AFFORD IT! What I fail to understand is what gives the whining kids of today the right or justification to covet a downtown living location? Either rental or condo. I mostly grew up in Scarborough...not in a house, but in a low-rise rental apartment. My parents (average earners) could not even qualify for a down payment on a "Luxury" CONDO at Vic Park and the 401 back in 1975. The solution...move to Ajax. I did the same, after renting in Thornhill for a bit. Downtown living has always meant sacrifice. Getting things handed on a platter seems to be the order of the day now. I now own a condo in the core...it only took 33 years.
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lol....you tell them kids how its done!
 
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