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yes, there's nothing to say they can't look into expanding Rogers Centre or adding a track to the football turf. I'd prefer that over building a second stadium. Rogers Centre, despite improving substantially over the past few years, is still empty most of the time. We don't want to build a massive void in the heart of the Portlands.

And as for transport, I stand by the logistical nightmare that a stadium would pose. Rogers Centre works right now because it's not isolated.. and there are countless options in dispersing the crowds. The Portlands, no matter how you look at it, is isolated solely based on the few connections there are between it and the rest of the city. THe Expo plan would have worked in the Portlands because despite high crowds, there's little "surge"... it's just busy all the time. A 70,000 seat stadium letting out after a game would overwhelm the Portlands transport system, and there aren't many options, unless you walk a long distance (remember the Portlands is the size of all of downtown Toronto) - especially in wintertime. At least if you don't want to deal with the subway or the streetcar crowds from Rogers Centre, you can walk 5 minutes to another line or station... that won't be possible at the Portlands. Not to mention there wouldn't be much to keep people entertained before and after games, so the surge loads on the system would be even worse as there's no reason for people to get there earlier or leave later. Yes, it's going to be a mixed-use community down there, but it won't have as many restaurants and bars that populate King Street because of Rogers Centre.

Finally, I don't think there is enough contiguous space down in the Portlands for a stadium the size of Rogers Centre.... the biggest plots of land are the Docks (which I don't think is big enough) and the Marine Terminal, which would probably be the only feasible spot. THe remaining large lots are already designated (FilmPort) or too close to environmentally sensitive areas (Don River and around the Spit)
 
A reconfigured Rogers Stadium would be nice in an ideal world, but sadly we don’t live in one. A full track will not fit into it, and increasing capacity is not an option.

As for transport in the Portlands, it is possible.

The 2008 Olympic Plan called for a 100,000 seat stadium plus an additional 3 sport venues for swimming, archery and rowing, along with an Athletes’ Village for 15,000 athletes and officials all in the Portlands.

I also read in depth the traffic study for EXPO 2015, and there would have been two surges daily, one in the morning when the gates open and another in the evening when it closes with upwards to 100,000 people during peak periods.

One of the biggest transportation points would have been the new Cherry Street GO Train Station which is less than a 8-10 minute walk to where the new stadium would be built.

Finally, there is plenty of room for 75,000 stadium in the Portlands. The proposed 100,000 seat stadium and 30,000 seat aquatic centre for the 2008 Olympic Bid had it placed on the lands where the Docks are currently located.

Louroz
 
From what I read the COC is pushing a sporting event in Hamilton that will require a new 30,000ish stadium. That's really the only point Hamilton and the Tiger Cats are pushing to have this bid for.
 
I wasn't even really aware the last Pan Am Games were going on until they were finished. As AP mentioned, they weren't even on TV.

I don't see the need for another stadium on the Portlands. To me it seems like a total waste of space that could be put to better use. The Rogers Centre is still a good stadium and has a lot of useful years left.
 
just because building a stadium on the Portlands for the Olympics was "justified" (I still think logistically it's impossible), it doesn't mean it's a good idea at all. It's the worst idea that anyone can ever pull out of their minds right now. The West Don Lands and the Portlands are finally getting off the ground in large part to extensive community consultation, all of which were wary of any large scale intervention. When TO was bidding for the Olympics, these plans were not in place. Not to mention we were still in the days of stupid waterfront development and were desperate for anything to make it better, and a 100,000 seat stadium would have been "better". And it's a was a bid document that said that transport would have worked. Of course it would say everything would have worked. Why would the bid document say that transport would fail when a 100,000 seat stadium emptied out. Though Iw ouldn't mind walking from the stadium to the GO Station on Cherry during the summer, I could no imagine doing that on a day like today after a November/December NFL game.

Toronto is no longer "desperate" for things to happen on the waterfront. We don't need a white elephant to spawn development.

Secondly, the days of massive international events are waning. Expo is nowhere near as big as it used to be. Again, a 100,000 seat stadium ould be simply stupid. Stupid.
 
299 bloor call control. said:
Again, why would Toronto need a SECOND Rogers Centre size stadium? There is ZERO business case for a second one, even with a NFL team. The NFL season runs with very little overlap with the CFL and MLB seasons. A stadium in the Portlands would be a logistical nightmare, with only two routes (Cherry and Leslie) in and out of the area. Like I said, a mid-sized stadium would be fine, a la BMO field that could function as a community facility. Finally, if our vision for the Portlands is for a signature community on the waterfront, building another giant stadium will do nothing but drive people away hoping to live central, but not in hyper-urbanity.
Click to expand...

SPECACULAR AND RIGHT ON!

Who is going to pay for this boondoggle?
Would private enterprise? Hell no- then it's a bad idea and we shouldn't do it.
 
I wonder why the 100,000-seat figure is being thrown around. There is not a single current stadium in the NFL that seats 100,000.

Wikipedia list of NFL stadiums

It seems like 100,000-seat stadiums are found in places where the demand for additional seating already exists (such as on football-mad US college campuses, or soccer-mad Latin America and Europe), or countries like China or India that need stadiums that match the size of its population (for example, the Olympic Stadium in Beijing seats 100,000), or countries ruled by megalomaniacs (the 150,000-seat May Day Stadium in Pyongyang, North Korea)
 
Hume shoots down the Pan-Am bid...

Link to article

Pan-Am bid likely won't go too far


Dec 10, 2007 04:30 AM
Christopher Hume

Toronto's bid for the 2010 Olympics didn't work out, and it couldn't quite meet the deadline for its Expo 2015 entry. Now there's word the city might go after the Pan-American Games to be held in eight years.

If that fails, who knows what we might try for next – the World Tiddlywinks Championships?

But then, why bother? Hosting such an event is simply not in Toronto's fate.

The reasons have nothing to do with civic willingness, but with the larger question of whether the city and its masters – provincial and federal governments – can muster the will. Don't hold your breath.

Writing about the Pan-Am bid, the Star's Jim Byers noted that, "one Queen's Park source said the government likes the idea at this early stage, especially since it's geared to the entire Golden Horseshoe and not focused on Toronto, which would be a tougher sell politically in other parts of Ontario."

God forbid that Premier Dalton McGuinty should be seen to favour Toronto over Oshawa, Peterborough, Wawa and the rest of the province. Wouldn't that be awful?

Little wonder Toronto has always been passed over. Which is why there's little reason to get excited about the Pan-Am Games. However unremarkable the competing cities – former host sites include Indianapolis, Winnipeg and Cali, Colombia – Toronto, make that, Ontario, is unlikely to be chosen.

To begin with, it doesn't make sense to spread the games over an area that stretches from St. Catharines to Barrie. For a second-tier athletic event to have any impact, it needs to be concentrated in a location where it can create a critical mass of activity and awareness.

Secondly, the proposal makes it obvious that the jurisdictions involved – city and province – cannot rise above the political concerns that have historically kept both from realizing their potential.

Furthermore, city council is an embarrassment and the Legislature barely has a pulse. The former rarely manages get beyond its own dysfunction; the latter exists within a bubble that should have burst three decades ago.

Not only has Canada fallen behind its competitors, it is out of touch with the realities of the 21st century, and more critical, of itself. As national borders grow less and less important in an increasingly global economic order we remain steadfastly rooted in the parochial patterns of our 19th-century past.

Although the world is learning to think ever more regionally, Canada, and Ontario, are defiantly local. That may keep the neighbours happy for the time being, but it's no way to run a province, let alone an economy that's under growing pressure to stay competitive.

Yet hope springs eternal. Last week, we were treated to the spectacle of Greater Toronto Transportation Authority (now Metrolinx) chair, Rob MacIsaac, declaring that in just 20 years the city's transit infrastructure will equal London's. Oh really! This in a region that's already 30 years behind the U.K. What's the plan, magic carpets?

The blame goes well beyond Mac- Isaac, of course, but who does he think he's fooling?

Instead of shovels in the ground, we're treated to this sort of glib complacency. Rather than progress, we get gridlock, and words when we need work. It's no surprise there's such cynicism about the political process in these parts.

If the Pan-Am Games were actually awarded to southern Ontario, they'd have to be renamed the Highway Games because visitors would spend so much time travelling from one venue to another.

But as long as we don't offend Fenelon Falls, no reason to worry.

Ontario, still ours to discover.
 
"Toronto's bid for the 2010 Olympics didn't work out"

Toronto bid for 2010?? Hume, Hume... check your facts!
 
It looks like we'll be apart of the Pan American Games bid. Is it just me but does anyone else hate the fact that all the venues would be spread out too far, and Toronto won't be hosting Athletics but only 3 sports. If were gonna be a part of a Pan Am Games bid, shouldn't we be the centre of the bid with most of the venues being in Toronto???


Tuesday, February 05, 2008

Canada Could Bid For 2015 Pan American Games
Posted 11:03 am ET (GamesBids.com)

Canada is considering a bid for the 2015 Pan American Games. There are reports that boosters of a possible Canadian bid were encouraged after meeting late last month with Mario Vazquez Rana, head of the Pan American Sports Organization.

If Canada bids for the Pan Am Games, events could be held in several communities in the province of Ontario’s “Golden Horseshoe†including St. Catharine’s, Barrie, Toronto and Hamilton; and residents of those communities would benefit from the new facilities that would be built.

Paul Henderson, head of Toronto’s failed 1996 Olympic bid said, “this gets us facilities. It gets the job done because you’ve got a deadline. You have to be ready on that Friday night of the opening ceremonyâ€.

Now the Canadian Olympic Committee must formally declare its intention to bid for the Games which could happen in April.
 
St. Catharines would be used for the rowing competitions, and if a ferry service between Toronto and Port Dalhousie were used, it wouldn't be that far. But there's not much reason to spread it around outside of Toronto or even the GTA otherwise, except to keep places like Barrie and Hamilton happy.
 
True...but I would love, love, love to see the resurrection of the old Olympic plan to put a six-lane, 2000M rowing course down the Shipping Channel. The "Western Beaches Watercourse Facility" may be great for dragon-boaters, but for rowing it's beyond useless.
 
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