- Thread starter IceCreamMan
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David A
Senior Member
Our governments were eager to hand off partial funding our universities and colleges basically to foreign students, who could be charged more to and make up for the shortfall. Well I suppose it seemed like a good idea at the time to all of them, until the unintended consequences happened.
Of course the educational institutions expanded the number of spots for these more profitable students, much like a business would react by increasing supply. Unfortunately our housing supply was already very constrained, but educational institutions generally had no responsibility for and so did not care about that. Also some foreign students were more interested in using the educational route opened up to get jobs and become permanent residents than to study.
So now we have reduced funding for universities and colleges, a government that has been embarrassed and less support for immigration. Gee that worked well. Perhaps well intended, but badly implemented public policy.
Out of Towner
Active Member
It's crazy to conflate international student enrollment with the cost of rent. The size of the variable in a quantitative relationship between the two in econometric modeling has to be small. If it isn't then the new MacEwan business building should be shelved. Perhaps even knock down some of the building at MacEwan so that the cost of rent comes down.
David A
Senior Member
It probably seemed crazy too those people who thought bringing in more international students was the solution to several problems with no downsides, but people can and did arrive faster than accommodation was built.
Unfortunately those making public policy did not understand economics or consequences. It was the increase in marginal demand that had an effect on price/rent for a relatively inelastic supply of accommodation.
Unfortunately those making public policy did not understand economics or consequences. It was the increase in marginal demand that had an effect on price/rent for a relatively inelastic supply of accommodation.
Out of Towner
Active Member
Interest rates and the regulatory environment have more of an impact on the cost and supply of accommodation than the marginal increase in demand from international students imho. It's unlikely that Edmonton will ever become a "college town" but there is an opportunity to develop a niche industry that can contribute to the urbanization of downtown Edmonton that many on this forum apparently desire.
ChazYEG
Senior Member
It is not small. The temporary resident population reached a peak of almost 10% of the population at one point (and then down to around 7%). It is not only the international students, it's their kids and spouses (and other family members in some cases).
Larger, more repurable Universities like McEwan and the U of A are not going to be the ones to suffer from the cut-backs, as these never based their whole existence around the immigration industry that grew from the free-for-all student visas. The dozens of strip mall colleges are the ones that will have to readjust their entire model.
Edmonton, in particular, probably won't see as drastic changes as Toronto or Vancouver, as we don't have as many of these colleges.
Out of Towner
Active Member
Let's be realistic. Rent in Edmonton has not increased because of international student enrollment at dozens of strip mall colleges. That kind of rhetoric isn't only silly and unwelcome, it's dangerous. The reality is, scale is needed for buildings like MacEwan's business building to be constructed. In other words, you're not constructing that building for a couple hundred students. You need lots of students for that building to make economic sense.
Read the article just posted by johnnyboy. Academic institutions are having difficulty filling the hole in their operating budgets left by the decline in international student enrollments. It's not hard to assume that the higher tuition fees paid by international students acted as a subsidy to Canadian students and now the revenue shortfall being experienced by some institutions will need to be picked up by Canadian students or their parents. Taxpayers could possibly end up making up for the shortfall. One thing that is clear, lay-offs and scaling down programs is not conducive to construction of new building.
Read the article just posted by johnnyboy. Academic institutions are having difficulty filling the hole in their operating budgets left by the decline in international student enrollments. It's not hard to assume that the higher tuition fees paid by international students acted as a subsidy to Canadian students and now the revenue shortfall being experienced by some institutions will need to be picked up by Canadian students or their parents. Taxpayers could possibly end up making up for the shortfall. One thing that is clear, lay-offs and scaling down programs is not conducive to construction of new building.
ChazYEG
Senior Member
Again, larger, reputable institutions are not suffering from the effects of these cut-backs nearly enough for this argument to make sense. These institutions' main sources of funding are endowment funds or provincial government transfers, not tuition.
Additionally, as me, and others here have pointed out, Edmonton is an outlier in the sense that it didn't feel the impacts of the poorly thought escalation of temporary resident numbers, but I'm cities like Vancouver and Toronto (and others in southern Ontario and the Lower Mainland) this has a substantial impact, and the government cannot create specific immigration and visa approval rules for different cities.
No one here is saying that we shouldn't have those international students, but the growth was too fast and infrastructure, not just housing, didn't keep up with it. It needs to be brought down to a point in which we can sustain the growth while maintaining affordability, job creation and quality infrastructure for everyone, including those coming here.
Out of Towner
Active Member
Don't take my word for it. Read the testimonials made by the administrators of academic institutions in the article posted by johnnyboy. They say they have revenue shortfalls because of smaller enrollments by international students. As "inclusion" pointed out earlier, universities have enrollment quotas for many programs and a student from Victoria studying at UBC is no different than a student from Hong Kong studying at UBC. They're both going to have residency in Vancouver and drive up the price of rent in Vancouver according to your theory. The Hong Kong student is a more valuable student to UBC though because he's paying a bigger tuition fee than the guy from Victoria. So if the student from Victoria doesn't have marks that are good enough to gain entrance into a program, he's going to be the first one to complain about international students, and it's something you hear from red necks all the time.
ChazYEG
Senior Member
You are missing the point entirely, but at this point, trying to have a productive conversation with you is like talking to a brick wall.
Institutions like UBC, U of A, etc did not ramp up the number of students they admit to their programs (like the countless no-name colleges all over the country did), and students accepted to these kinds of institutions will not be impacted by the curtailing of student visas (mind you, visas are only issued after acceptance by the university...).
The absolutely crazy numbers of temporary residents coming through strip mall colleges, and bringing their families alongside, these are the ones who were mostly gaming the system and putting a strain on housing, the job market and the country's infrastructure.
constance_chlore
Active Member
I don't think this is true. There's a definite increase in the administrative load that comes with the clampdown, and greater uncertainty about whether a visa will be issued at all, even for highly competitive graduate programs.
ChazYEG
Senior Member
There might be the odd one that's trickier here and there, but considering how part of the recent overall targets for this administration also involve "brain drain", especially focusing on competition with the US, I do not see major institutions being heavily affected.
archited
Senior Member
Be careful or you'll be compared to a brick wall... you don't want that reputation, do you?
ChazYEG
Senior Member
Being attacked by you is like a badge of honor at this point, so thanks.Be careful or you'll be compared to a brick wall... you don't want that reputation, do you?
constance_chlore
Active Member
They are being affected. Whatever verbal commitments the administration makes, the burden and scrutiny on international MSc and PhD students and their advisors has gotten worse. I'm saying this as someone at U of A having conversations with my colleagues about these exact issues.