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darwink said:
It depends.

Air Canada's flight to Red Deer were rumoured to be anchored by 3 Super Elite flyers plus the members of Parliament. The flight kept them loyal, and otherwise was a wash. A net benefit. Those were Beech 1900-Ds though, 17 passengers.

Q400s are just too big for lots of flights. Air Canada has ordered 30 30 seat ES-30s (below) and if they're delivered, they'll be able to boost frequency on lots of routes where frequency can induce demand (I fly often these days between Vancouver and Kamloops-before going all Q400 Kamloops had double the frequency and locals bemoan it).
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These are aircraft from Heart Aerospace, a brand new hybrid electric airplane company so the ability to get these is pretty uncertain. If there was demand, the most suitable existing aircraft is probably the ATR42, which Canadian North operates. The reality is probably there's not enough commercial demand to be viable, that the only ways these routes could exist is local government subsidies.
 
Albertasaurus said:
I wonder if 2 - 3 hours might be close enough where most people won't see a need to fly, especially when you consider the cost. The flight is short but when you factor in time to check in, go through security, grab baggage on the other side etc you're not really saving any time vs driving.
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This is why I like the idea of a separate heliport for those short flights, minimal facilities with minimal waiting. Turns out the idea isn't all that novel, the Brits did it back in the early 80s for air service to their smaller islands. 44 pax with some models capable of over 1500km range.

fastest-civilian-transport-helicopters-in-the-world-2776627209.jpg



CalgaryTiger said:
You have to think about if differently for Lethbridge. I'd say most aren't flying to get to Calgary, they flying to get to YYC, which you then go on to somewhere else.
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Yeah I see the Alberta routes as an equity issue primarily, ensuring that as much of the province as possible is within reasonable distance of daily air service.

Same story for BC I too, I'm actually surprised they didn't follow the Brit lead back in the 80s, given how much time it could save to smaller cities in the interior.
 
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InfrastructureEnthusiast said:
This is why I like the idea of a separate heliport for those short flights, minimal facilities with minimal waiting. Turns out the idea isn't all that novel, the Brits did it back in the early 80s for air service to their smaller islands. 44 pax with some models capable of over 1500km range.

View attachment 717634




Yeah I see the Alberta routes as an equity issue primarily, ensuring that as much of the province as possible is within reasonable distance of daily air service.

Same story for BC I too, I'm actually surprised they didn't follow the Brit lead back in the 80s, given how much time it could save to smaller cities in the interior.
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Just read on google a Chinook Helicopter costs $5-6000. (USD) an hour operate and close to $10,000/hr in maintenance costs. Not sure this would economically viable as an option
 
Golfing guy said:
Just read on google a Chinook Helicopter costs $5-6000. (USD) an hour operate and close to $10,000/hr in maintenance costs. Not sure this would economically viable as an option
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Yeah I've seen a lot of variance in the Chinook numbers, but as its primarily used by militaries I think those number skew high like $500 hammers.

Moot point though, like everything else Boeing, there's a long waiting list for new airframes. I think the Brits lucked timing wise out with the post Vietnam production lull allowing for new variants to be produced.

But even if operating costs were half of what google says, it'd still likely need a subsidy, in which case it'd just be simpler for the province to subsidize improved west jet service until regional rail is ready.

Now if China can make an autonomous hybrid tiltrotor with a similar capacity to the Boeing 234, there could still be a market for that.

Have to think Calgary to Revelstoke in 30 minutes would draw some customers..
 
Helicopters are used for rich people, political figures, athletes, tour operators, etc for a reason - they're very expensive to run for more convenience. The higher operating cost is offset by not having to land at airports. With more economical smaller planes, I don't think BA runs these helicopter routes anymore. If you are flying airport to airport, helicopter would cost significantly more than a comparably sized aircraft. Not to mention helicopters are far more dangerous than airplanes. It's still safe overall, but over years of operations, the airline probably doesn't want the risk of being associated with helicopter accidents. BA had three accidents in the span of two years, and sold the division 2 years after the last accident.
 
The only major airline I can think of that still operates helicopters is Air Greenland, and it's mainly because lots of these very small communities don't have airports large enough for turboprops in the first place. There is a reason why helicopters for short-haul or "commuter" flights aren't commonplace.
 
Don't disagree on the cost and use cases for helicopters, but it just so happens there are quite a few use cases directly west of Calgary.

I think we're well past the safety concerns though, especially with the Chinook. The platform is three times as old as it was when the Brits ran them, its been fine tuned and is essentially a solved problem now. It'll likely stay in production for decades to come.

Can't dodge the high operating costs though, even if you do get what you pay for.

The new gen aircraft are interesting, EREV aircraft should have much lower maintenance and fuel costs, and if they can be run without a pilot that'd make for much cheaper operations.

But then being a new platform, there will inevitably be some safety issues along the way.

Circle of life...
 
darwink said:
It depends.

Air Canada's flight to Red Deer were rumoured to be anchored by 3 Super Elite flyers plus the members of Parliament. The flight kept them loyal, and otherwise was a wash. A net benefit. Those were Beech 1900-Ds though, 17 passengers.

Q400s are just too big for lots of flights. Air Canada has ordered 30 30 seat ES-30s (below) and if they're delivered, they'll be able to boost frequency on lots of routes where frequency can induce demand (I fly often these days between Vancouver and Kamloops-before going all Q400 Kamloops had double the frequency and locals bemoan it).
View attachment 717617
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Having lived in Red Deer for a short period, can confirm YYC and YEG are simply too close for rational/sustainable service to those 2 markets. 1:10 door to door, avoids the connection/delay you don't control
 
With another year of data out, I can update my old charts with a full decade of data!
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Interesting takeaways for me are transborder really dropping off in the second half of 2025; along with continued strong international growth.

Pre-pandemic, international was around 55% of the transborder volume (around 2/3 in the winter and around 1/2 in the summer). The last 12 months, it's up to 73% of transborder volume (60% in the summer and 85% in the winter), and Jan 2026 international volume was 99.1% of transborder, barely 2000 pax difference. That'll be a big milestone of sorts when they cross (even if it's due as much to transborder fall off as international growth.)
 
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Some interesting stats from YYC's presentation at the end of the year. If I'm reading the first chart correctly, even pre-WJ direct flight, YYC-ICN had really high passenger numbers, basically matching YYC-NRT passengers post direct flights.
Similar to what people have been saying, there's definitely potential to grow the Trans-Pacific market. 90+ load factor while only capturing 60% of passenger share.

 
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