Wooba
Active Member
That picture is an eyesore. I'd move if that was built on my street
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Eug
Senior Member
And I'd be happy to see you go. Good riddance.
Wooba
Active Member
Eug
Senior Member
Well, you said you'd move, if someone dared build a modern home like that in your neighbourhood. If you want to talk about overreaction, I think yours is the ultimate example. And I gave you my honest reaction, which is that I would very happy to see you move out of the neighbourhood over that.
I'm glad to see even the city can now see the benefits of progress. Without some forward thinking designs, we'd be stuck with the same old crap forever.
interested
Senior Member
Actually the modern home on the street shown is a little too much for my taste. Not that I care for the obvious (and in my view) less than attractive add-on on the building on the left (though perhaps functionality dictated the room was required) but I find the new building is simply out of place in comparison to the rest. I guess eventually, if more of the street turns over, it will gain some traction. That said, we complain about cookie cutter homes, and then we complain about old nostalgic streets saying they look dated. There is obviously going to be a time in between where existing homes are either torn down or renovated and the street will look somewhere in transition.
I believe Eug makes a clear and valid point when he points out that there are a lot of problems with older homes for all the reasons he pointed out and that often one has to question whether it makes sense to maintain something that is old when new can be constructed often for less money with more functionality. That said, I will await Bishops Block completion as I understand inside it is totally new but the restoration job from the outside is nothing less than outstanding. However, not everyone will spend or has the kind of money to take down old brick to remake and restore to the level that this has been done. I am sure a new structure would have been a fraction of the cost.
Eug
Senior Member
That is a very reasonable response, as it is indeed a bit jarring in the way it sticks out. However, if someone built that on my street, I'd love it. My immediate neighbours might react similarly to you, but another neighbour down the street might just freak out. By the way, we all despise that last guy and would love it if he moved out of neighbourhood.
Ironically, I probably wouldn't buy a house like that. I find the front windows too exposed for a small street like that. Not as private as I'd like. But in terms of aesthetics, I think it's great, and looks way better than the old house to the left.
My own house is a teardown, but what was built in its place was a more classic Cape Cod-like design. Not exactly par for the neighbourhood, but there is already enough variation in the neighbourhood that it fits in quite nicely partially because it doesn't give off the McMansion vibe.
However, one of the new homes on the street is quite modern. Nothing like that house in The Beach I posted, but it's still quite different than the rest of the neighbourhood. In truth, I don't think it's necessarily a super gorgeous home or anything, but I do appreciate the fact that it adds variation to the neighbourhood. Having all the homes in the neighbourhood being the same 50s brick designs just screams boring to me, and just a little bit depressing.
interested
Senior Member
From the Huffington Post.
Interesting re the Ritz.
From July 12, 2011. Not sure what has happened regarding sales since but I believe they are still slow.
the question I believe this begs if true: how can Ice justify $700/sq.ft. and other condos if the Ritz is getting $724. Granted that may be a large unit and hence may still be $2 million (I am just speculating on this) vs. a 600 sq.ft. unit at $420K. But still.....
Condo Madness?!
Posted: 12/ 7/11 03:36 PM ET
We've all watched in amazement as the city's skyline has been totally transformed over time, particularly over the last decade. I remember my mother telling me that when she moved here from England back in 1958 the Royal York Hotel stood out as the tallest building in the city (it was actually the second tallest). As a child growing up here in the '70s and '80s, I recall dreaming of living in the Palace Pier condo at the mouth of the Humber River, Toronto's first luxury high-rise. It seemed so glamorous and nothing else like it existed back then. Of course, that was before traffic jams became the norm in this city. Now the commute from the Humber river to downtown makes the option less appealing. Oh how times have changed.
Today Toronto leads all cities in North America with 132 high-rise buildings currently under construction. To put that in perspective, Mexico city is a distant second with 88, New York captures third place with 86, and Chicago is a very distant fourth with just 17. The vast majority of those buildings in Toronto are condos and that doesn't count the hundreds of condo buildings already built. If you're like me and own a unit downtown, you can't help but be a little nervous about where all of this is heading. It's the luxury condo market, however, where nerves are really getting frayed.
Though the condo boom has been going on in this city for a decade, the luxury condo market is just now coming into its own. This year has been like nothing ever seen before in Toronto, with the "big four" all either just completed or very near completion. I'm referring to the Ritz Carlton, Shangri-La, Four Seasons, and Trump Tower. It's one thing to imagine buyers for all the $300,000 units at City Place, but it's another to imagine enough people able and willing to pay for all of these luxury units and sales are starting to back that up.
According to Truecondos.com, since the Ritz Carlton was registered on the MLS in the summer, there have been five sales. The first three to sell, all during the summer, averaged about $914/sq. ft. The fourth unit, which didn't sell until September, dropped to $865/ sq ft. More recently, just last week in fact, the fifth unit sold for just $728/sq. ft. That is a remarkable figure, considering the developer was marketing these units at over $1,200/sq. ft. during construction.
No one knows for sure where prices are going in the future, but one thing is certain, Toronto's skyline will be continuing to change for years to come. The recent announcement of a 70-plus story condo at 10 York St. is proof of that.
"I think 100 storeys is completely doable in Toronto; that's sort of the next generation of height," said Rudy Wallman, whose firm Wallman Architects designed the development.
So considering how fast the skyline is changing and growing, I can imagine my daughter Zoey amazing her grandchildren with stories of how the CN Tower used to be the tallest building in the city. And then it will be their turn to be open-mouthed in disbelief!
Interesting re the Ritz.
From July 12, 2011. Not sure what has happened regarding sales since but I believe they are still slow.
the question I believe this begs if true: how can Ice justify $700/sq.ft. and other condos if the Ritz is getting $724. Granted that may be a large unit and hence may still be $2 million (I am just speculating on this) vs. a 600 sq.ft. unit at $420K. But still.....
Condo Madness?!
Posted: 12/ 7/11 03:36 PM ET
We've all watched in amazement as the city's skyline has been totally transformed over time, particularly over the last decade. I remember my mother telling me that when she moved here from England back in 1958 the Royal York Hotel stood out as the tallest building in the city (it was actually the second tallest). As a child growing up here in the '70s and '80s, I recall dreaming of living in the Palace Pier condo at the mouth of the Humber River, Toronto's first luxury high-rise. It seemed so glamorous and nothing else like it existed back then. Of course, that was before traffic jams became the norm in this city. Now the commute from the Humber river to downtown makes the option less appealing. Oh how times have changed.
Today Toronto leads all cities in North America with 132 high-rise buildings currently under construction. To put that in perspective, Mexico city is a distant second with 88, New York captures third place with 86, and Chicago is a very distant fourth with just 17. The vast majority of those buildings in Toronto are condos and that doesn't count the hundreds of condo buildings already built. If you're like me and own a unit downtown, you can't help but be a little nervous about where all of this is heading. It's the luxury condo market, however, where nerves are really getting frayed.
Though the condo boom has been going on in this city for a decade, the luxury condo market is just now coming into its own. This year has been like nothing ever seen before in Toronto, with the "big four" all either just completed or very near completion. I'm referring to the Ritz Carlton, Shangri-La, Four Seasons, and Trump Tower. It's one thing to imagine buyers for all the $300,000 units at City Place, but it's another to imagine enough people able and willing to pay for all of these luxury units and sales are starting to back that up.
According to Truecondos.com, since the Ritz Carlton was registered on the MLS in the summer, there have been five sales. The first three to sell, all during the summer, averaged about $914/sq. ft. The fourth unit, which didn't sell until September, dropped to $865/ sq ft. More recently, just last week in fact, the fifth unit sold for just $728/sq. ft. That is a remarkable figure, considering the developer was marketing these units at over $1,200/sq. ft. during construction.
No one knows for sure where prices are going in the future, but one thing is certain, Toronto's skyline will be continuing to change for years to come. The recent announcement of a 70-plus story condo at 10 York St. is proof of that.
"I think 100 storeys is completely doable in Toronto; that's sort of the next generation of height," said Rudy Wallman, whose firm Wallman Architects designed the development.
So considering how fast the skyline is changing and growing, I can imagine my daughter Zoey amazing her grandchildren with stories of how the CN Tower used to be the tallest building in the city. And then it will be their turn to be open-mouthed in disbelief!
redfirm
Active Member
^
CG, what's going on with Ritz? It can't be people just realized that there are no balconies ... First Trump, now this ...
CG, what's going on with Ritz? It can't be people just realized that there are no balconies ... First Trump, now this ...
KA1
Senior Member
... and here comes Shangri-La.
A question about a different building.
33 Bay Street has a few floors which are 'upscale'. These days, I see listings all over for units in 33 Bay. Anyone with any idea as to psf selling price of these 'upscasle units?
drewp
Active Member
Not much selling in the building right now. Ton of rentals though. One unit recently sold for $640 a square foot parking included.
KA1
Senior Member
Thanks
interested
Senior Member
I think SL will come down too. The question is: if it comes down to say $800/sq.ft. (below what I paid) given that these are not hotel units, I don't think there will be a fire sale. However, let's assume there is a price decrease; won't 1 Bloor which sold at $800-$1000/sq.ft. come down then to $600-700 and Aura and other mid to upper scale projects will follow suit as well. After all, I am guessing that if SL is offered the same as these 2 or close; people will buy the more upscale building, would you not think?
The response about 33 Bay from drewp makes me think that MLS and Ice also can not command the pricing. Remains to be seen. My point, if the high end is coming off, then surely the mid high end is next to follow.
KA1
Senior Member
By the way, I was just reading a 'twitter' on the website of remaxcondosplus.com. Scotiabank thinks/predicts 10% decrease in prices in 2012. Remax's take is 0.5% up. Even the individuals in business are admitting that things in 2012 won't be rosy.
interested
Senior Member
^^^
Meaning Ka1 you have joined the "dark side" and are no longer predicting price increases?
Say it isn't so. Are you siding with Scotiabank or Remax at this point in time. The bank economists, notably Benjamin Taal of CIBC has been calling for a 10-15% correction. Scotiabank and BMO I believe have also called for the same. However, CREA, REMAX, and I believe LEPAGE call for increases. The difference.....the banks are not in the business of talking up real estate like the latter 3. Also, they are more worried and would rather see an orderly slow price decline than a "bubble" with continued increases outstripping historical norms in my view.
Meaning Ka1 you have joined the "dark side" and are no longer predicting price increases?
Say it isn't so. Are you siding with Scotiabank or Remax at this point in time. The bank economists, notably Benjamin Taal of CIBC has been calling for a 10-15% correction. Scotiabank and BMO I believe have also called for the same. However, CREA, REMAX, and I believe LEPAGE call for increases. The difference.....the banks are not in the business of talking up real estate like the latter 3. Also, they are more worried and would rather see an orderly slow price decline than a "bubble" with continued increases outstripping historical norms in my view.
KA1
Senior Member
No, I haven't change sides. I am there where I always have been -- that is, on my side.
Slowdown in price increase or even a decrease is a normal process of real estate activitiy. It should not make a difference, as long as you are finacially secure.
In November 2001, I bought the unit in RoCP where I am living in.
As I had made a post sometime ago, one Saturday afternoon, I am driving by. I saw a sign that a building is coming on this site. On Monday, I phoned the number on the sign. It took R/E agent exactly one week to return my call. It took me another week to make up my mind. Prices have doubled since then.
Those slow days seem to be coming back. And they will not last too long. A buying opportunity for a 'savy' deep pocketed investor like you.
Tomorrow, Monday, is a working day. Daveto will be back on the job. Judging by the past experience, he (she?) will have thoughtful comments on today's post about Ritz,Trump and Shangri-la. Then there will be replies from the usual posters -- interested, Redfirm etc.
It is going to an interesting day tomorrow to be on this thread.
I am all excited. I hope I can go to sleep
.