[spider]

In the way of an update I delivered a bag of garbage to the temporary dump site in Sunnybrook Park at 9:30 this morning. There was no line-up although there was a lot of traffic, the attendant opened the back of my minivan, yanked the bag out and closed the door, all of which took about 5 seconds.

A little drive around the Leslie, Lawrence, Don Mills and York Mills Road areas showed very little litter, many garbage cans were full but not overflowing. Other garbage cans were empty strangely enough. I browsed around areas likely to be used as a dump such as the local Arena parking lot and behind plazas and strip malls - no garbage.

If the union is hoping to see a sea of garbage that will induce public sympathy for their cause they are not getting it, either the sea or the sympathy.

 

[salvius]

Since everyone on council seems to agree that this will be a long strike, the media should canvass our elected officials to see what they are doing with their garbage. I've been storing my garbage in the garage and if this goes on past the end of summer I'll probably rent a bin and use it to get rid of not only the garbage, but also all the junk that's in the garage.

By the way, doesn't Miller live in Etobicoke? And isn't Etobicoke the only part of town that has private garbage collection?

He lives around High Park, and we're very much affected.

 

[slowtyper]

Whats the situation like at Bermundy transfer station late in the evening like 10pm? Any hassles?

 

[W. K. Lis]

The Naples, Italy garbage strike started on December 21, 2007 and ended by July, 2008. Over 6 months. See this link for more information.

Could Toronto's garbage strike last that long?

Piles of garbage lining a street in Pozzuoli, Province of Naples (January 2008)

 

[Canuck]

Good for these folks, they inspire me.

Strike reveals our apathy - and our urge to do good

Jul 08, 2009 04:30 AM

Noor Javed
STAFF REPORTER

For the first week of the strike, Alnoor Sayani, ignored the garbage as it accumulated near his restaurant, Lahore Tikka House on Gerrard St.

Midway into the strike's second week, he began to get worried.

"What if they strike goes on for eight months? Are we just going to live in a big dump?" Sayani said.


Yesterday afternoon, Sayani took 30 of his staff off the job, handed them brooms, bright yellow gloves and plastic bags, and worked alongside them to clean up the Gerrard India Bazaar, from Greenwood Ave. to Coxwell Ave. "We are doing this for the sake of our community, where we live, where we eat and where we make money. It is our turn to give back, " Sayani said to his staff before they began.

As the group walked up and down the street, store owners, nearby residents and tourists stopped to watch. "I can't believe they are actually doing this," said Nabila Ahmed, who lives in the area. "It's nice to see. At least the streets will stay clean for a few days."

While some observers congratulated them, others didn't seem to understand. "Why are you doing this? It's not our job," said a man named Mo, who would only give his first name.

At the end of the hour-long clean-up, the group had filled more than 70 garbage bags. "I know it won't stay this clean for long," said Sayani. "Probably just until the weekend.

"Doesn't matter. When it gets dirty, we will clean it again."

Source

If you're in Little India, be sure to stop at his restaurant, buy some food, and congratulate them for caring and taking action.

 

[Redroom Studios]

I am a fairly left leaning person politically, but I find this action by the union shameful and selfish. They are tarnishing the reputation of the city, scaring away tourism dollars and basically screwing all their fellow citizens. I had my sister and brother in law visiting last week and we were in Toronto early last week in the first few days of the strike. Things were generally not too bad other than over flowing public garbage bins but still rather unpalatable to have to walk by and make excuses for.

I have never worked a unionized job (mainly by choice). I have always been treated more than fairly and given generous raises without resorting to striking or issuing ultimatums. Different places of work will offer different perks or bonuses as well as vacation time based on seniority that are discussed and agreed to at the time of hiring. They generally do not improve from one year to the next... and that has never been a cause to feel short changed.

I do applaud those who are making an extra effort to properly dispose of their own garbage an even organize to clean up their neighbourhood. Contingency plans by the city seem to be helping keep things somewhat acceptable and hopefully this will allow the city leverage as time goes by.

So to say it again, these workers, most notably the garbage collectors have no sympathy from me. Final word - ridiculous!

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

I've actually noticed the parks I bike through seem to be much, much cleaner than usual.

As for the strikers...

Are they trying to insult residents further by just parking wherever the hell they want? Would it be too much of a hardship for them to park legally a few minutes away or would it just be too trying for them to walk more than ten feet from their lawn chairs to their carseats?

Poor things.

I've seen a considerable improvement this week with neighbourhood types, retailers and the like walking around with brooms, dustpans and garbage bags around town. Cycling around St. Lawrence Market today I saw dozens of people on Front Street and in the areas south of there keeping their neighbourhood clean. How very refreshing and inspiring. Pics of David Crombie Parks (St. Lawrence Market) will be posted when I have the energy under the Buildings, Architecture & Urban Design heading, Toronto Parks thread. I haven't copied the photos from my SD disc yet but I'm sure I captured the good neighbours in action down there but the parks, sidewalks and roads are near spotless.
Way to go TO!

 

[Redroom Studios]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NwmS-8cUZdg

 

[slowtyper]

Just went to bermondsey, lineup was at least 40 cars deep so I turned around and went home. I'm thinking of going at like 2am but everyone else might have the same idea

 

[gei]

This entire situation has me very disillusioned. I realize the vast majority of the population is stupid and shouldn't be taken seriously... but some of the comments posted in various newspapers are just sad.

ie. "I make minimum wage... why should they make more", or "I only get 5 hours of vacation per year... why should they get more".. or "I don't get ANY sick days.... why should they get any".

I am 100% certain that if the city had proposed to slash EVERY city workers salary by 15% and said it was necessary because of this "recession", the rest of the public would be in full support of this idea. When it comes down to it, it's "their tax dollars", and they would like to to see CUPE workers paid as little as possible.

The sad thing is that these people should look at their own terrible jobs and lives and hope for more... not lambaste the people who have it better. There were seriously people commenting about how they don't get ANY sick days at all, and think it's unfair that city workers get any. Umm.. really? No wonder we in north america have it so terrible. Instead of fighting for more, we are content to FIGHT for less. I have a friend who JUST started a new job in europe after graduating and STARTED with 6 weeks of vacation. That would be absolutely unheard of here.... even for government employees.

We truly do live in a greedy society. But it's not city workers who are the greedy ones IMO.

 

[Hank]

Vacation is different from sick days. It's well known that Europe offers more vacation than North America. If you're trying to compare yourself to someone, it makes more sense to compare yourself to someone closer to home...I don't go to my boss and demand six weeks of vacation because that's the standard in Europe, I'm happy to get three or four because that's a good amount in North America.

In the same vein, garbage collectors should be ecstatic to get $25 an hour with 18 sick days (which, let's be honest, are really a way to give them a huge bonus on retirement) because that's well above what the standard is for garbage collectors in North America. Comments like "I make minimum wage, why should they make more?" are as ludicrous as "the police union got a 3% wage increase, why should I make less?". They're both wrong. People shouldn't hate CUPE employees because they hate their own jobs, I agree. But people are perfectly justified in asking why we're paying CUPE employees more than their' jobs are worth.

If the city could slash every worker's wage by 15% and not suffer significant job losses, why would anyone be against that? All that means is that city employees are willing to do the same work for less pay. Why should we, as taxpayers, be paying them more to do the work than they're worth? I do want to ses CUPE paid as little as possible because I'm the one paying them. Any employer wants to pay their employees as little as possible to do their jobs; it's not mean, it's the reality of the free market.

If you have skills that make you a valuable employee, then employers will in effect bid on the chance to hire you, driving up your wage. If you have no skills and are applying for a job as a garbageman, then the reality is that you're not going to get a good wage. It's no more a 'race to the bottom' than it is a 'race to the top'...it's a race to an equilibrium where everyone makes what they deserve. In any competitive environment, garbage collectors would not deserve $25 an hour. They simply wouldn't. It's an unskilled job that many people would be willing to do for much less money.

Society, including the unions, isn't greedy, society is realistic. The union weighed the odds and figured that they could get a better deal by striking. That's not greedy, it's a calculated decision. They may be right or wrong, but they're trying to get the most money for their members and I don't blame them for that. I personally don't think that their demands are reasonable, so I support the city in holding firm. In the end, whoever's being less reasonable will hopefully end up having to give in.

 

[kEiThZ]

The Europeans get more vacation because they are more productive than us. You can bet that they aren't paying trash collectors 25 dollars an hour to do 50% less work than a private contractor. Instead they'd provide the contractor (who works harder) with 20 dollars an hour and six weeks of vacation (if he gets the work done faster you can afford to give him more time off)....all possible because that worker is more productive. If the unionized trash collectors can achieve the same productivity as the private sector, I would have no problem with paying them more and giving them more vacation. The fact they aren't and are seemingly refusing to even be compared to private sector contractors tells me that they don't even deserve what they are getting now.

I'd agree that comments from peanut gallery on compensation will always be idiotic and generally reflect a tone of jealousy. However, that does not mean there are no legitimate criticisms.

 

[salvius]

Vacation is different from sick days. It's well known that Europe offers more vacation than North America. If you're trying to compare yourself to someone, it makes more sense to compare yourself to someone closer to home...I don't go to my boss and demand six weeks of vacation because that's the standard in Europe, I'm happy to get three or four because that's a good amount in North America.

And that's really too bad, because there's pretty solid evidence that longer vacation times increase productivity. Which - after all - makes sense. But, because we compare ourselves with our pathetic (when it comes to this issue) American neighbours, we are destined to remain overworked.

 

[nfitz]

Just went to bermondsey, lineup was at least 40 cars deep so I turned around and went home. I'm thinking of going at like 2am but everyone else might have the same idea

I forgot it was there, and drove past about 8:55 AM the other morning; the pickets were there, and I guess there were cars waiting - but nothing significant ... I really had to resist the urge to roll down the window and stick my finger out as I passed ...

 

[Northern Light]

So many thoughts

A few thoughts:

One, I support fair wages, and don't think $25.00 an hour is outrageous, its 50k a year, living in this City isn't really possible on under 35k....

That said, the 18 sick days is nuts, I do understand where it comes from for the garbage workers, who at one time had to do lots of heavy lifting, though it still seems excessive even then. But now with automated machines doing the lifting of bins, there is no reasonable basis for 18 sick days.

I hasten to add though, that while I support the City curtaining this benefit on a go-forward basis, you can't take back time already banked. That would be like clawing back bonuses from 10 years ago. They may or may not have been justly awarded, but you don't get to take back what's already out the door.

****

As to striving to better employment standards for all, whether in sick days, vacations or medical benefits I am, generally, a firm believer in more social generosity and higher labour standards.

That does not allow for 18 sick days!

But, I suspect the Union movement as a whole has lost some public support for the very reason that it is not seen as the champion of more for everyone, but rather more of themselves. I don't say that disparagingly, but as an observation of fact, and of bad PR. If those workers said, we're on strike till the province legislates 5 sick days paid for everyone......I suspect there would be a good deal more support.

Speaking of which, I do believe in some sort of legislated minimum for paid sick days, as the people who most often don't get them (low-end retail workers etc.) are those most likely to be low-paid, living close to the edge, and at risk of not making the rent if they miss even one work day. I note Obama has pushed a bill (now introduced into Congress) which will make 7 paid sick days the law in the U.S.

***

As to European vacation standards.....Brazil is 30 days paid, by law, Japan has 13 stat. holidays and 2 weeks + 1 day for each year of service; low vacation standards are almost unique to North America.....

Though, Saskatchewan requires 3 weeks paid vacation by law (4 after 10 years of service)