[Felino]

It's well known that condo developers have way too much power and leeway when it comes to the purchase of your condo unit.

I won't get into details, but the bottom line for me: I will never buy a new condo again.

The builder of my building put in very small print in the contract in lawyer jargon that basically they can change whatever they want.

Basically, they leased the entire mechanical infrastructure of the building and now the unit holders are responsible for paying the monthly cost of the lease and will be on the hook to buy it outright once the lease is up. This is a fairly new tactic that builders are using for new condominiums!!! Buyers beware!!! Find out before you put your hard earned money down!! The building's property manager (very reputable) said they spoke to the builder about this and they said it's more cost effective in the long-term to lease the mechanics of the building. This is laughable, more cost effective for whom? For them, that's who!

I don't care if they are legally allowed to do this or not, bottom line: purchasers should know this up front.

So this is a new tactic that builders are using nowadays to pass the buck to consumers in a very sneaky way. Buyer beware once again.

Also, our developer cheated hundreds of people in our building on their property tax assessments, and the city is putting us on the hook to deal with them directly.

Basically, I paid my property taxes up to the day I closed (during the phantom months). The builder inturn is responsible for taking that money and paying the city. Thing is, the builder underpaid so now the city is coming after the unit holders since the developer is no longer officially on the hook for anything to do with the building. We told the city that we paid the taxes for 2007 already once we "closed" with the builder and officially took ownership. The city says: "yes, the builder was responsible to pay them with the property tax portion of the closing costs but since they didn't we're on the hook, take it up with the developer to get back the money!! In fact, the lady from the city was so eloquent: "that's not our problem, you owe this money and it has to be paid! Just pay it!" I'm not kidding, she actually said this.

So I overpaid my property taxes for fear of what would happen and now the developer is pretty much ignoring everyone's calls and emails and is dealing with unit holders one-by-one taking their damn ass time.

So again, the 2001 Act falls very short of protecting consumers when it comes to purchasing condominiums. It's well known that the builders have WAYYYYYYYY too much power and something needs to be done to protect consumers.

I don't want to hear: 'read the fine print'. I paid big for a good lawyer when I first bought and he's telling me that the wording in the contract is so vague as it is with most contracts that builders can pretty much get away with murder. My builder was a very well known builder and is building some massive projects in the city as we speak.

Our board is telling us that everyone is in a different situation so we all have to deal with the builder individually on this matter. Thing is, dozens of people are in the same situation in our building, some don't even know they overpaid and the developer is counting on this (in my opinion).

They are not one of the larger builders (not Tridel for example). I've dealt with Tridel years ago, they are fantastic and reputable. This company is not. So my guess is that they use whatever tactics they have to get money upfront so they can use on their next project or pay their debts.

Shame on the city of Toronto for not protecting consumers.

 

[kennyx]

who's the builder?

 

[simuls]

There's a meeting Wednesday April 22 at 7pm at 627 Queens Quay W. to discuss Condominiums in Toronto and Condo owner's rights. Politicians and concerned citizens will be there if you'd like to come.

 

[Felino]

Thanks simuls, much appreciated. I will definately be at this meeting.

 

[Brian69]

While I haven't suffered like the original poster (at least not yet) I recently bought a new condo and learned firsthand how the developer has all the advantages in the arrangement--just little things that kept working in the builders favour. So the creation of a "Tenant Bill of Rights" or at least some kind of consumer advocacy for buyers would go a long way towards rectifying this imbalance and lowering the number of (to varying degrees) pissed-off condo buyers.

 

[jaycola]

A friend bought a new unit off of plans and closed recently. Upon inspecting the unit, there was a column (not decorative, just a box floor to ceiling against the wall) which protuded over a foot into the room along the longest wall in the suite. It is the only wall that can accomodate the sofa. There was no indication of the column on the plans. It is a service conduit and cannot be removed. She now has a room that is too small to accomodate a sofa and coffee table. The builder stated that the contract allows them to make alterations to the suite.
She got ripped off...

 

[cabbagetowner]

...that's just some of the problems when buying from plans.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

Respectfully, a "good" Real Estate Lawyer would catch any vague language or difficult to interpret legal language to protect you, rewrite it/explain it to you and then send you back to the developer to get the altered language approved. That has been my experience. On my last purchase I went back & forth several times and got all but two or three altered clauses agreed to by the developer, and there were many. Eventually when the sales reps. would see me coming they'd run, but who cares. I got what I wanted and slept well at night.
On my first purchase I learned a lot. Bulk-heads can turn up anywhere, room sizes didn't match the floorplan dimensions, HVAC units can be in different locations, closets disappear - so much can go bad. Solid language in a purchase & sale agreement is crucial when buying a new home.
That said, purchasers in this province are still at a considerable disadvantage when buying a new home.

 

[Ken]

Or buy from a respectible builder. I bought mine from Monarch, it's not bad at all.

 

[Felino]

There were many unit holders with good lawyers in my building, none could anticipate that the builder was going to 'lease' the building's mechanical infrastructure.

Every condo agreement has vague language. They're all purposely written that way. Yes, you can go back and forth about bulk heads and stuff like that.

Our builder took out a bank loan to finish the building because they ran out of money. The entire loan including the interest was built into the closing costs of our building. How can a lawyer anticipate something like that? None of them did. Also, the builder then leased the entire mechanical infrastructure of the building, the lawyers did not miss this.

Bottom line, the entire agreement on every contract is vague and can be interpreted in so many ways. The city has to come up with an act to prevent this type of stuff from happening. I called the CMHC and they were very rude to me on the phone. They asked me, "then why did you buy it??".
WTF???

The major changes in our building had nothing to do with floorplan dimensions or HVAC units being switched. It was almost as if the builder combed through the agreement they created looking for holes and took advantage. Shame!

 

[CanadianDriver]

so, um... are you going to tell us the name of this builder or what?

 

[urbandreamer]

Lotsa Iranians live in NYCC in those Yonge St condos. Wonder if it's something up there?

Felino, why not go to major media outlets with your story?

 

[Felino]

Lotsa Iranians live in NYCC in those Yonge St condos. Wonder if it's something up there?

Felino, why not go to major media outlets with your story?

First, I can't name my builder since I'm selling my unit soon.

Also, I'm not north, i'm downtown.

The thing about leasing the mechanical infrastructure is HUGE, but it's not illegal. Plus them ripping me off on property taxes, they will say 'we're getting around to correcting this'. Also, the part about them taking out a loan and charging everyone this extra cost upon closing was not illegal also.

So despite the fact that this shows this builder is shady, the board doesn't feel it's worth fighting in court. Many of them own multiple units in our building and are afraid the price of the units in our building will fall if people get wind of some of the stories in our building.

Also, I forgot to mention. The builder is leasing the mechanical infrastructure and is paying 10% interest!!!! Which family member of the builder negotiated that lease???!!??!!?? I pressed the board hard during our annual meeting about this ridiculou 10% interest rate, my cheated property taxes (hundreds of unit holders were cheated), the leased mechanics and the loan we paid for since the builder ran out of money. They were clearly annoyed with me since they're all friends and are in cahoots together. They simply want to avoid controversy and don't address the hard issues.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

They were clearly annoyed with me since they're all friends and are in cahoots together. They simply want to avoid controversy and don't address the hard issues.

That is why you vote and attend AGM's, too bad-so sad that they were annoyed with you. When BoD terms end, you vote them OUT. Further, if everyone is as unhappy as you are with the current state of affairs with your BoD, talk to your neighbours and get together to arrange a building blitz to Requisition a Meeting. You need to clearly state the reason for the meeting, obtain 20-30% signatures of the building owners to sign on (I can't remember the exact percentage that you need), then send the Requisition to the President of the Board by registered mail. Your Property Manager can advise you on the exact instructions for the Requisition.
This is not a pair of jeans purchased here, this is the most expensive purchase most will make in their life. Stand up and take action, you have the power.

 

[Josef]

so, um... are you going to tell us the name of this builder or what?

It doesn't seem like it's Pemberton, so I think I can cross that off the list, as there's really no condos built by them in the downtown core yet.