[BurlOak]

I went to several offices of downtown councillors and was greeted with blank stares and attitudes of indifference when I mentioned the DRL. It's infuriating, so if anyone is put off by my attitude in this forum it's been affected greatly by this experience and my disappointment that CodeRedTO is focusing on Transit City rather than the DRL, which I believe is essential to our subway network.

This part I think I can agree with. I think the subways are the backbone of the system and should be built first. Transit City would look a lot more appealing if the DRL was already there.

I am aware that Jack Layton was opposed to the 1980's version of the DRL - not so much the alignment, but the philosophy that it will encourage growth downtown and it should occur in the boroughs instead. It could be that his influence still exists on the downtown Councilors.

 

[mskashmoney]

This part I think I can agree with. I think the subways are the backbone of the system and should be built first. Transit City would look a lot more appealing if the DRL was already there.

I am aware that Jack Layton was opposed to the 1980's version of the DRL - not so much the alignment, but the philosophy that it will encourage growth downtown and it should occur in the boroughs instead. It could be that his influence still exists on the downtown Councilors.

You said it. Thanks!

The politics at city hall are unbearable. Take a look at the current TTC board and the wards they represent. For a while I was wishing the private sector would come in and save us. My thinking was that they would "cherry-pick" the downtown lines and improve service, but that is up for debate. They did it in London, and the results were good (according to some people).

 

[BurlOak]

You said it. Thanks!

The politics at city hall are unbearable. Take a look at the current TTC board and the wards they represent. For a while I was wishing the private sector would come in and save us. My thinking was that they would "cherry-pick" the downtown lines and improve service, but that is up for debate. They did it in London, and the results were good (according to some people).

With the current GO plans, Jack was probably correct in not supporting the 1980's DRL plan. I am sure there are a lot of other political ideologies that are interfering with proper transit planning. Not just Ford - at least he was open about it and campaigned on it.

 

[mskashmoney]

With the current GO plans, Jack was probably correct in not supporting the 1980's DRL plan. I am sure there are a lot of other political ideologies that are interfering with proper transit planning. Not just Ford - at least he was open about it and campaigned on it.

I'm convinced that Ford (the person) had nothing to do with killing Transit City. It is my theory that the province, transportation planners and Metrolinx killed it because it was a bad idea. That's only my theory though...

According to discourse by Steve Munro, Layton and Co. were vehemently against the DRL in the 80's because it would intensify the downtown core.

Well...whether they like it or not, it happened, and now we don't have the transit to support it. So having said that, let's talk about LRT's in the middle of nowhere...

 

[11th]

I am aware that Jack Layton was opposed to the 1980's version of the DRL - not so much the alignment, but the philosophy that it will encourage growth downtown and it should occur in the boroughs instead. It could be that his influence still exists on the downtown Councilors.

Keep in mind one of the perks of living downtown is that you can live in a semi-detached house/townhouse yet be minutes away (by foot) from shops and restaurants on a busy throughfare. I don't think many of those living with that currently are prepared for their neighbourhood to be turned into "NYCC version 2".

 

[Hipster Duck]

I'm convinced that Ford (the person) had nothing to do with killing Transit City. It is my theory that the province, transportation planners and Metrolinx killed it because it was a bad idea. That's only my theory though...

Yay! A theory that isn't backed up by any evidence!

 

[Rainforest]

I went to several offices of downtown councillors and was greeted with blank stares and attitudes of indifference when I mentioned the DRL.

As counter-intuitive as it may sound, downtown councillors may not be the best place to seek support for DRL. Many of their voters would be wary of intensification that comes with subway stations, as well as of construction pains.

On the contrary, DRL should be marketed as a city-wide project, beneficial to transit riders from all wards (by making Yonge, University, and BD subway trains less congested).

It's infuriating, so if anyone is put off by my attitude in this forum it's been affected greatly by this experience and my disappointment that CodeRedTO is focusing on Transit City rather than the DRL, which I believe is essential to our subway network.

I too believe that DRL is essential. But note that the real goal of the CodeRedTO efforts is redirecting some of the money from Eglinton LRT (where Ford wants to use them to put the whole line underground) back to other corridors for which they were designated originally (for example, Finch West).

That goal does not compete with DRL. There is no practical way to take those money off Eglinton and store them as a downpayment for DRL; an attempt to do so would results in those money going back to the general pool with no guarantee of transit investments.

And responding to your other comment: Finch West is not a line to nowhere; it is a very busy bus corridor.

 

[Electrify]

mskashmoney, have you ever been to Montreal? While I don't agree with how inflammatory your approach has been to posting, I think we can all agree that this city has a knack for making wrong decisions, which we get to enjoy dealing with for decades to come. When I was in Montreal, I was impressed with how many things they have done right. Spend a weekend there over the summer, I think you will enjoy it there.

 

[Dan416]

It's a shame the DRL has no champion.

 

[nfitz]

When I was in Montreal, I was impressed with how many things they have done right.

It seems every time I drive through Montreal of late, there are emergency highway, bridge, and tunnel closures, because the highway system is falling to pieces, structure weren't built how they should be, and maintenance has been deficient for years.

At the same time, in the last quarter-century, with announcement after announcement of Metro expansion, they've only managed to add 4 km and 3 stations to the system, with nothing else in construction, or even in detailed design.

If Montreal did indeed do many things right, it doesn't seem to have happened since Jean Drapeau left office.

 

[BurlOak]

I'm convinced that Ford (the person) had nothing to do with killing Transit City. It is my theory that the province, transportation planners and Metrolinx killed it because it was a bad idea. That's only my theory though...

Ford campaigned for no streetcars on suburban streets. I think he wanted Transit City killed. However, probably others did as well.

 

[Justin10000]

It seems every time I drive through Montreal of late, there are emergency highway, bridge, and tunnel closures, because the highway system is falling to pieces, structure weren't built how they should be, and maintenance has been deficient for years.

At the same time, in the last quarter-century, with announcement after announcement of Metro expansion, they've only managed to add 4 km and 3 stations to the system, with nothing else in construction, or even in detailed design.

If Montreal did indeed do many things right, it doesn't seem to have happened since Jean Drapeau left office.

Isn't Montreal pursuing a LRT plan similar to Transit City?

 

[nfitz]

Isn't Montreal pursuing a LRT plan similar to Transit City?

There seems to be endless plans in Montreal for all sorts of things. Very few come to fruition. I don't believe anything is actually funded.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

It seems every time I drive through Montreal of late, there are emergency highway, bridge, and tunnel closures, because the highway system is falling to pieces, structure weren't built how they should be, and maintenance has been deficient for years.

At the same time, in the last quarter-century, with announcement after announcement of Metro expansion, they've only managed to add 4 km and 3 stations to the system, with nothing else in construction, or even in detailed design.

If Montreal did indeed do many things right, it doesn't seem to have happened since Jean Drapeau left office.

Unlike Toronto, you can get around without driving. Based on Transit in the city only, Montreal > Toronto

 

[nfitz]

Unlike Toronto, you can get around without driving? Based on Transit in the city only, Montreal > Toronto

What are you talking about. You can get around Toronto without transit. And like Toronto it takes forever to get from some parts of Montreal to others on transit. I grew up in Montreal - I remember some hellishly long transit rides to Montreal-Est, Beaconsfield, Montreal-Nord, Beloeil, L'Assumption ...