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i don’t think it has really been framed as either/or. the cut back on the policing side is minuscule based on their total budget.

I do however, think it has been framed from a perspective of priorities that apply to the police budget as well which is s as good thing.
 
Aaron_Lloyd said:
I'd rather see EPS fully and properly staffed while also investing in needed social services. I really hate how this has been framed as either/or.
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I would say this is an either/or viewpoint.

Either they get 10mil more OR they aren't properly staffed.

Really? Or maybe there are other ways to improve operations, spending, measures of success, ROI, etc.

I say this as someone with a brother in policing.

Its a very hard job these days. Its very hard to find willing people to step into the career. So they are compensated very nicely. I dont think we've seen success elsewhere from "defunding", but I also don't think they need way more until they can prove why. Policing is one of our biggest expenses and there are numerous examples of poor spending by them (HQ, Tank, Social media managers doing dumb stuff instead of seizing the opportunity to educate, inform, and build trust....like seriously, as a genz working in the content world, EPS needs some serious training on the dos/donts of social).

The both/and is that they can receive the same funding AND do better to serve and protect our city.
 
it would also be interesting to know how much of their new building's $120M plus budget was needed to meet police requirements and how much was imposed on them by the city when it came to design and consultants, leaky roofs and all and whose budgets cover those capital and operating shortfalls.
 
That video was shot in March 2021. Since then we've elected a new mayor, new city council and a new MP, not to mention that we've had a new DBA executive director for a year now. Have any of these people made a difference yet, or is it still too early to say?
 
If there is anything wrong with that video it is filming a person asleep that appears to be homeless and broadcasting it on the internet. I doubt that guy asked for consent and I certainly don't think he would try that with a mom and her kid on the way to work.

More generally, it seems clear to me that all people need a place to go and the disorder downtown is evidence that adequate solutions have not been found.
 
How many homeless people don’t accept the help of the shelters? Also, how many criminals don’t pay for the LRT or buses? Criminals are often caught breaking minor laws.
 
The_Cat said:
How many homeless people don’t accept the help of the shelters? Also, how many criminals don’t pay for the LRT or buses? Criminals are often caught breaking minor laws.
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i highly doubt that poor soul with no better alternative to sleep someplace warm and no better place to relieve himself is on anyone’s “most wanted” list. what’s criminal is his ending up there with no better options and people implying that maybe it’s his fault for not accepting the help of shelters.

in no way an i suggesting that what was captured in the video is acceptable but i’m pretty sure that’s not what his mother wanted for him when he was born or where he wanted to end up as a child. i don’t have all the answers but just kicking him off the lrt and back on the street isn’t one of them.
 
The_Cat said:
How many homeless people don’t accept the help of the shelters? Also, how many criminals don’t pay for the LRT or buses? Criminals are often caught breaking minor laws.
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Many do not use shelter services for a variety of reasons but the main being that Hope Mission does not allow people who are intoxicated on drugs or alcohol, so many of those folks look for other places to be - LRT stations, pedways, parks, etc. Scott McKeen brought up in 2013 the need for a 24/7 'wet' shelter, so has the Bear Clan Patrol, so far nothing. Opening of Expo Centre during winter will help alleviate some of the problems, there isn't enough day shelter/night shelter space in general.

I fear the issues Downtown are a symptom of lack of wrap-around services, but also EPS using Downtown as a pawn in their budget negotiations, as well as City privatizing security in transit stations hasn't worked in my observations.
 
IanO said:
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And what is your point?

Middle of the pandemic during the cold weather season combined with more people on the street without property housing lead to situations like that, which are the same experience in many other large municipalities with rapid transit systems. Thankfully, our new Council seems to be taking the right steps to address these concerns
 
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