[nfitz]

Really? Do you have data about the operating speeds of the two trains?

Sure, check the TTC service summary.

YUS line ranges from 30.6 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak.
Bloor-Danforth ranges from 31.2 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak
Sheppard is always 29.8 km/hr

And the SRT ranges from 34.9 km/hr off-peak to 36.6 km/hr peak.

 

[jks]

Isn't the DRL the perfect opportunity to have each station designed by a different architect. I mean more people are going to use it that the VCC extension.

 

[Whoaccio]

Sure, check the TTC service summary.

YUS line ranges from 30.6 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak.
Bloor-Danforth ranges from 31.2 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak
Sheppard is always 29.8 km/hr

And the SRT ranges from 34.9 km/hr off-peak to 36.6 km/hr peak.

Why is Sheppard the slowest line? It must have some of the widest stop spacing in the system, and uses the same rolling stock as other routes. Does it have to do with its relatively short length, resulting in proportionately more turnbacks?

 

[nfitz]

Why is Sheppard the slowest line? It must have some of the widest stop spacing in the system, and uses the same rolling stock as other routes. Does it have to do with its relatively short length, resulting in proportionately more turnbacks?

I was wondering that when I was typing the numbers. But you know, it always seems a bit slow when you are on it. It does seem to me it should be the fastest. Perhaps there is a particularly long dwell time in the terminals that's included in the calculation ...

 

[299 bloor call control.]

nfitz is correct - there is a long dwell time at the terminal stations

 

[andomano]

It may travel at the slowest speed overall, but it does run like clockwork.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

Sheppard's long dwell is really annoying...it serves no purpose other than to periodically cause crush loads on Sheppard trains when multiple Yonge trains arrive during the dwell.

 

[junctionist]

Isn't the DRL the perfect opportunity to have each station designed by a different architect. I mean more people are going to use it that the VCC extension.

That's true. In the case of the DRL, people may be so desperate for a new downtown line that anyone who suggests such investment will be derided by fearmongers as asking too much and potentially ruining the deal. Beware of this.

 

[nfitz]

It may travel at the slowest speed overall, but it does run like clockwork.

It does. Though based on my observations, and comments here, it does seem time to increase the frequency a bit. Say 6 trainsets during peak?

 

[scarberiankhatru]

You wouldn't need additional trainsets on Sheppard to increase the frequency, just cut the dwell by a minute on each end. It only takes like 8 minutes to go from Yonge to Don Mills, anyway, so slashing a couple of minutes can free up more than enough vehicle-time to permit higher frequencies.

It's really quite unnecessary for Sheppard to leave people behind on the platform during rush hour, but it's happened to me a few times.

That's true. In the case of the DRL, people may be so desperate for a new downtown line that anyone who suggests such investment will be derided by fearmongers as asking too much and potentially ruining the deal. Beware of this.

It's really not true...some Spadina extension stations will be very well used (like York U and Keele & Finch) but a great many DRL riders (particularly is it just goes from Danforth to Yonge) aren't going to be using the stations along the way and there's limited opportunity for splashy investments at the interchange stations. Spadina extension stations will also have more room...would something like Downsview station even fit around, say, Gerrard?

 

[junctionist]

It's really not true...some Spadina extension stations will be very well used (like York U and Keele & Finch) but a great many DRL riders (particularly is it just goes from Danforth to Yonge) aren't going to be using the stations along the way and there's limited opportunity for splashy investments at the interchange stations. Spadina extension stations will also have more room...would something like Downsview station even fit around, say, Gerrard?

It's still appropriate to hire architects, though not the pricey internationally renowned architects if certain stations won't be as heavily used. It's downtown and the DRL supposedly passes through some high density neighbourhoods plus receives passengers from the streetcar lines, so I'd imagine that it wouldn't exactly be a few new Ellesmeres. Downsview's high ceiling concept can work anywhere, it's just about digging slightly deeper. That openness of the high ceiling is very valuable.

 

[golodhendil]

LRT can be just as fast as subway; the SRT (which I guess isn't true LRT) runs faster than the subway.

Sure, check the TTC service summary.

YUS line ranges from 30.6 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak.
Bloor-Danforth ranges from 31.2 km/hr peak to 32.4 km/hr off-peak
Sheppard is always 29.8 km/hr

And the SRT ranges from 34.9 km/hr off-peak to 36.6 km/hr peak.

I was wondering that when I was typing the numbers. But you know, it always seems a bit slow when you are on it. It does seem to me it should be the fastest. Perhaps there is a particularly long dwell time in the terminals that's included in the calculation ...

Thank you, you just answered your own question / contradicted your own position.

Those values given in the report are average speeds, which take into account station interval, number of stations, and dwell time. The heavy rail subway lines have both more stations and closer station spacing on average (notably except for the outer stations of YUS, which skew the average slightly but still give a smaller average overall). I don't know the average dwell time per station, but it is reasonable to assume that the higher passenger load would lead to longer time needed to load and unload. When these three factors are taken into account, the average speeds of the subway lines are bound to be lower than the RT, unless they are at least twice or thrice faster (by rough calculations) than the latter.
In short, the average speeds tell nothing about the operating speed, and I am reasonably sure that the subway runs faster than the RT.

 

[Railization]

It's really not true...some Spadina extension stations will be very well used (like York U and Keele & Finch) but a great many DRL riders (particularly is it just goes from Danforth to Yonge) aren't going to be using the stations along the way and there's limited opportunity for splashy investments at the interchange stations. Spadina extension stations will also have more room...would something like Downsview station even fit around, say, Gerrard?

A station at Gerrard wouldn't be the most heavily used station, but it wouldn't be a poor performer either. I think it would have a level of use comparable to Main Street, which is pretty good. A station at Queen would get higher use. Cherry would probably be the most heavily used station on the east side before Yonge, as it would effectively be the Distillery and Portlands gateway. If the line is built soon, it could integrate with the West Don Lands project, and that could yeild it a significant amount of space to work with.

 

[golodhendil]

I thought it had more to do with the decceleration being done before the station is entered - partially because the trains are so short.

Actually I just noticed something wrong with this statement too. Precisely because the trains are shorter, they take less energy and time to decelerate (even assuming they are running at the same speed), so they don't need to decelerate as early as a long heavy rail train, and can probably decelerate further "in" to the station than heavy rail. But, the point remains that they run slower and have less momentum.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

A station at Gerrard wouldn't be the most heavily used station, but it wouldn't be a poor performer either. I think it would have a level of use comparable to Main Street, which is pretty good. A station at Queen would get higher use. Cherry would probably be the most heavily used station on the east side before Yonge, as it would effectively be the Distillery and Portlands gateway. If the line is built soon, it could integrate with the West Don Lands project, and that could yeild it a significant amount of space to work with.

I never said there'd be poor performers on the DRL. I was responding to the stupid comments people make about Spadina extension stations being unused and, therefore, not worth a higher design budget, or that downtown deserves better than the suburbs. We don't yet know where stations on the DRL will be located, or how gold-plated the line might be, but we can be more or less sure that few opportunities for building Downsview-esque stations will present themselves (not that the stations should be Downsview-scaled). A Cherry stop could be an exception.