[Leo_Chan]

In today's TTC Board Meeting, there was a lot of talk about DRT having a bay at STC before the SSE gets built with the new bus terminal. However, it seems very unlikely to happen in the short term as the station is over capacity, so either a new bus bay or a on-street stops for DRT will have to be made.

There was a presentation that proposed to have DRT stop at the current Lawrence East SRT Station, since it is running under capacity and it is a connection to the TTC network. This seems like an amazing idea at the start, but to me it would be a lot better for DRT to stop at McCowan SRT Station. I know there isn't a bus bay at that station, but there is an on-street taxi stand for 3 taxis, which can be converted to a bus bay.

Does anyone else think that DRT should have a "connection" to STC as soon as possible and would that connection be at Scarborough Centre Station, Lawrence East Station, or McCowan Station. Scarborough Centre is the most ideal but over capacity, Lawrence East is good but isolated and far, McCowan is great and can be converted and is the closest.

 

[Rainforest]

^ IMO, it should end either at STC or at McCowan. On-street connection is OK until the new station and new bus terminal is built.

The idea to terminate Durham BRT at the Lawrence East station is exceedingly odd. The BRT won't even run on Lawrence, it will on Ellesmere. Lawrence East station is nowhere near any point of interest for the BRT riders. If they are expected to transfer to SRT, then to subway at Kennedy, and head to downtown, they would be much better off using Lakeshore East GO. If they are expected to take SRT back to STC, then what's the point; the bus could take them straight to STC much faster.

 

[Allandale25]

"The initial business case for the planned Durham-Scarborough BRT is now on our site. The project will be moving forward to a Preliminary Design Business Case, with public consultations taking place later this year. bit.ly/2JLQOe4"

Tweet today by Metrolinx.

 

[Northern Light]

"The initial business case for the planned Durham-Scarborough BRT is now on our site. The project will be moving forward to a Preliminary Design Business Case, with public consultations taking place later this year. bit.ly/2JLQOe4"

Tweet today by Metrolinx.

This is what can drive any transit advocate or anyone concerned with efficient government nuts.

Already done an initial business case, so why not do a preliminary one, presumably followed by an intermediate one, then maybe a penultimate one, followed by a final one, maybe.

It does look like the consultant enrichment industry at work.

This is not a complex project.

Either the numbers of potential riders warrant it, when considering the cost or not.

This could be done in-house and decided fairly quickly.

Detailed design is a different matter, and one could always revisit aspects of the project if the cost projections ballooned.

But at its heart, this a commitment to run more of what is in place now, with some additional dedicated lanes, and other transit priority measures.

This is not planning the Panama Canal and can be done somewhat more expeditiously than Metrolinx would appear to believe.

 

[muller877]

"The initial business case for the planned Durham-Scarborough BRT is now on our site. The project will be moving forward to a Preliminary Design Business Case, with public consultations taking place later this year. bit.ly/2JLQOe4"

Tweet today by Metrolinx.

Looking at the pictures it looks like it does not connect to any GO Transit. Big mistake. Would be good for it to loop around Pickering Town Centre (staying North of the 401) to have a stop at Pickering GO (at the walkway across the 401). Its only a few hundred meters but I think there would be a lot of demand.

 

[Leo_Chan]

@OneCity Those are some late likes

 

[OneCity]

@OneCity Those are some late likes

Never too late for like. Have another

 

[SaugeenJunction]

New RQQ up (request to qualify and quote) on MERX, and further in the RQQ is is described as Consultant’s Services for the Preliminary Design and EA/TPAP for the Durham-Scarborough Bus Rapid Transit Corridor.

Consultant’s Services Preliminary Design and EA/TPAP

 

[Northern Light]

This appears to be the DRT catch-all thread.

They have their proposals up for public comment for 2020 service changes.

The actual survey will go live on their website on April 1st.

https://www.durhamregiontransit.com/en/routes-and-schedules/resources/PICs-2019/PIC_Location_maps.pdf

Several route changes proposed.

I think the most critical is establishing a through service on Bayly-Victoria-Bloor; though they have 2 different routing options through Oshawa, which I would leave to others more familiar with the area to comment on.

Far too many of their services continue to have strange little side jaunts instead of being grid-based.

Some of that may not be alterable unless Durham Region invests in intelligently linking some roads together. But much of it is a choice.

While they've boosted service frequency substantially in recent years, they continue to have far too many routes that are hourly or don't even have a full span of service.

That said, they do have a good package of improvements this year in terms of more frequent service.

https://www.durhamregiontransit.com/en/routes-and-schedules/resources/DRT_South_Durham_Full_System_web1.pdf

 

[Allandale25]

New RQQ up (request to qualify and quote) on MERX, and further in the RQQ is is described as Consultant’s Services for the Preliminary Design and EA/TPAP for the Durham-Scarborough Bus Rapid Transit Corridor.

Consultant’s Services Preliminary Design and EA/TPAP

Just received this via email.

You are invited to attend Public Information Centre (PIC) #1 for the Durham-Scarborough Bus Rapid Transit project.

We are working to propose transit infrastructure in the form of dedicated bus lanes along Highway 2 and Ellesmere Road connecting Scarborough to downtown Oshawa in Durham Region. This project builds on the Initial Business Case (completed 2018) and will include a Preliminary Design Business Case and follow the Transit Project Assessment Process (TPAP). As part of this process, the project team is currently in the early stages of pre-planning activities, consultations and technical studies.

We invite you to attend the upcoming public meeting to learn more about the project, as well as the constrained areas of the corridor we are analyzing. The format will be a drop-in session where project team members will be available to answer questions and collect feedback. More information about the event can be found in the attached Notice.

The meeting will be held on Thursday, September 26, at the University of Toronto Scarborough Campus at The Meeting Place in the Science Wing, from 3:30 - 5:30 p.m. and 6:30 - 8:30 p.m.

The project team hosted PICs in Oshawa, Whitby, Ajax and Pickering in June 2019. The information available at the September PIC will be the same information presented in June 2019 and is available on the project website: https://www.metrolinxengage.com/dsbrt

The Durham-Scarborough BRT Project Team

dsbrt@metrolinx.com

www.metrolinxengage.com/dsbrt

 

[Bureaucromancer]

Am I imagining it or is this scoped fairly oddly in being tied to Ellesmere from the start while not discussing the role of of GO Oshawa/Yorkdale service or usability of the infrastructure by the TTC?

 

[APTA-2048]

Am I imagining it or is this scoped fairly oddly in being tied to Ellesmere from the start while not discussing the role of of GO Oshawa/Yorkdale service or usability of the infrastructure by the TTC?

I felt the same way. The existing GO buses like the 92 and 96 make use of the 401 and make limited stops. Travel times to STC are pretty good. Staying on Highway 2 and Ellesmere and going through UTSC, it's much slower by comparison on the GO route 51 and DRT Pulse based on my experience.

 

[doady]

Pulse gets 10,344 riders per weekday. GO 92 and 96 get only 2,631 and 1,425 per weekday, less than half combined. That's why they think about Ellesmere instead of 401. It might also be difficult to build transitways and stations down the middle of 401.

Highway 2 in terms of service level and ridership is already where 19 Hurontario was 15-20 years ago. How much more they can grow with BRT? They also need to think about Simcoe too.

Durham Region's ridership is abnormally low for its size, and somehow the ridership in this corridor is already so high. Don't count on the ridership remaining abnormally low. Population will continue to grow as well. The population of Pickering, Ajax, Whitby, Oshawa is not far behind Mississauga. It's similar to Waterloo Region which is also building LRT.

If you look this corridor it is mostly lined with commercial, directly connecting Scarborough Centre, and the downtowns of Pickering, Whitby and Oshawa. Even just considering development potential, it should already be LRT rather than BRT. Better fit for LRT than Finch, Eglinton and most other corridors in the GTA.

 

[smallspy]

Pulse gets 10,344 riders per weekday. GO 92 and 96 get only 2,631 and 1,425 per weekday, less than half combined. That's why they think about Ellesmere instead of 401. It might also be difficult to build transitways and stations down the middle of 401.

Total ridership is only half of the equation though. Where is that ridership happening?

It may be that the 92 and 96 carry more people into Toronto than Pulse does.

Dan

 

[doady]

Total ridership is only half of the equation though. Where is that ridership happening?

It may be that the 92 and 96 carry more people into Toronto than Pulse does.

Dan

Well, 92 and 96 go much further into Toronto so I think it's safe to assume they carry more people into Toronto.

Since this BRT would serve Ellesmere, maybe it better to compare GO's 92 and 96 to TTC's 95 and 995...

Honestly, I just find it baffling that people think Highway 401 is a more fitting corridor for BRT than Ellesmere. And they will need to think about conversion to LRT as well, for the reasons I mentioned above. BRT is already shortsighted enough, BRT along the 401 would be even mroe shortsighted.

I've always thought Wilson Ave is the #1 candidate for LRT in the city of Toronto. If there is Ellesmere LRT and Wilson LRT, there might as well be York Mills LRT.

BRT and LRT are for transit corridors. Highwa 2 is a transit corridor. Ellesmere is a transit corridor. The 401 is not a transit corridor. People can't walk to the 401 and board a bus there. So just forget about the 401.