the lemur
Senior Member
Seems like a step in the right direction. I hope it doesn't devolve into victim-blaming as some other papers are prone to doing.
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- Thread starter rp07
- Start date
Seems like a step in the right direction. I hope it doesn't devolve into victim-blaming as some other papers are prone to doing.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
A map would help.
But if this is the same railway track in the Don Valley I believe you're talking about then, it's already been considered,.... it was offered for sale to the city, to be considered for railway track to linear trail conversion,.... city examined it, but due to cost, linking it with existing cycling network - remember 5% incline slope for multi-use trails (topography-elevation is way higher but amazing view!),... with limited cycling budget and an endless to-do list,.... the feasibility wasn't justified here.
ShonTron
Moderator
I don't understand what you just said.
Railways have no more than a 1% slope in most cases, 2% is the maximum. A rail trail along the CP alignment would be expensive, yes, but would have great views and would connect nicely to the trails behind the Brickworks.
The reason is that besides the expense, the loss of the rail corridor would preclude future GO service on the CP line, or the long-talked about resumption of passenger rail service to Peterborough.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
That part of the railway track is significantly higher in elevation than the current cycling infrastructure in the area,.... the multi-use trail linkage needed between the two will be difficult to build within the 5% incline slope guidelines. Building cycling infrastructure where one has to drag their bikes up stairs doesn't fit city guidelines especially accessibility guidelines for wheelchair users.
Besides, even if the railway bridge become useful for future railway usage, a hanging cycling structure could be engineered to utilize that railway bridge without interfering with railway trains,.... then it becomes an issue of even higher cost,....
steveintoronto
Superstar
I'll take it even further than that: We should be pushing for more 'bike cops' because they really understand our situation...and an old saw-horse of mine: know when and how to crack-down on some of the ridiculous things people on bikes do. (I won't call them 'cyclists' as it demeans the title). I actually avoid stretches of bike lanes on the weekend it's become so dangerous and ridiculous.
steveintoronto
Superstar
I think I read the one in the TorStar earlier today, thought "hey, this looks interesting"...but they didn't name the intersections!
the lemur
Senior Member
Cops on bikes can also respond to some things a lot faster in a certain areas. If you're sitting even moderately high in the saddle you can see everything drivers are distracting themselves with. Also easier to approach 'problem' cyclists and anything involving pedestrians.
MisterF
Senior Member
A while ago I started using Google Map Maker to add some missing links in the bike network in my hometown of Peterborough. My dad has been wanting to get back into cycling so I've been showing him around the trail system, which is pretty great for a city that size. Eventually I started mapping other cities I've lived and worked in until it's slowly morphed into an unhealthy obsession with mapping all the missing bike infrastructure I can find. I guess I could be doing worse things with my idle time.
I've noticed a few things about the bike networks in Ontario. While downtown Toronto has a fairly decent network, the inner suburbs of Scarborough, North York and Etobicoke (aka Ford Nation) have gaping holes in the network. Very few major streets have bike infrastructure of any kind. The outer suburbs, OTOH, are a lot better. Towns like Ajax, Milton and Brampton have bike networks that put Toronto to shame. Almost every arterial road in some suburbs have either bike lanes or a separate multi-use path. Sure, you're still biking on huge, windswept regional roads, but the infrastructure is there. Outside the immediate suburbs, cities like Kingston, Kitchener, and St. Catharines have excellent bike networks while Oshawa and Barrie are mostly barren. And we all know that Ottawa has been building an extensive system for a long time. An odd thing that I noticed is that some cities have very active residents who have mapped every bike lane and trail while other cities seem to have nobody interested. Milton is a curious combination of having a huge network of trails and bike lanes but nobody mapping them. I think that reveals a lot about what makes these places tick.
I've noticed a few things about the bike networks in Ontario. While downtown Toronto has a fairly decent network, the inner suburbs of Scarborough, North York and Etobicoke (aka Ford Nation) have gaping holes in the network. Very few major streets have bike infrastructure of any kind. The outer suburbs, OTOH, are a lot better. Towns like Ajax, Milton and Brampton have bike networks that put Toronto to shame. Almost every arterial road in some suburbs have either bike lanes or a separate multi-use path. Sure, you're still biking on huge, windswept regional roads, but the infrastructure is there. Outside the immediate suburbs, cities like Kingston, Kitchener, and St. Catharines have excellent bike networks while Oshawa and Barrie are mostly barren. And we all know that Ottawa has been building an extensive system for a long time. An odd thing that I noticed is that some cities have very active residents who have mapped every bike lane and trail while other cities seem to have nobody interested. Milton is a curious combination of having a huge network of trails and bike lanes but nobody mapping them. I think that reveals a lot about what makes these places tick.
steveintoronto
Superstar
ShonTron in this forum is probably the most aware of available cycling trails in Southern Ontario, he cued me to some excellent ones, including the ones that converge on Brantford and some of the many excellent trails into Hamilton. (Caledonia being one)
You're absolutely right on some cities being duds (Guelph, for all her "Green" bluster, is a dud) and other cities do a magnificent job. I'm *very* interested in what you can link on Peterborough, considered as a "cycling capital", now I'm back in Toronto, I'm dying to do Uxbridge to Peterborough, and beyond on the rail-trails. I used to cycle from Toronto past Rice Lake on back roads years back to get to a cottage just past Colborne on Lake Ontario, you have to go a fair way north to clear the busy roads, and down through the Northumberland forest there's some excellent windy ones, but now I'm in late middle-age, Rail Trails are my thing. I still do the distance, but don't chance taking un-assumed roads through the woods like I used to, albeit I discovered some excellent cross-county links that way.
I'd love to see your stuff! I can't urge people enough to use the trails. It's excellent in many ways, great people you meet, incredible scenery, you pretty much know what to expect, no motor-vehicles...oh man...I'm off on a fantasy just thinking about. If the trails aren't used, funding will slowly dry-up too.
I've got to do Uxbridge to Peterborough before Solstice! Keep posting F!
LNahid2000
Senior Member
Really? I sometimes bike from Brampton to downtown Toronto and there's no way to bike downtown without using arterial roads without any sort of bike infrastructure.
MisterF
Senior Member
In Peterborough the main link I wanted to add was the Trans Canada Trail between Lansdowne Street East and the city limits. That missing link is now complete.
If you look in Google Map Maker you can find my edits, most of which are pending review. I did all the unmapped trails and lanes along the major streets in Milton, and there are no doubt lots of smaller streets there that haven't been done too. Ajax is similar. The rest is bits and pieces all over southern Ontario.
I haven't biked there so I don't know firsthand. But if you turn on the Google Maps bike layer and look around the GTA, Brampton has one of the denser networks.
44 North
Senior Member
Uxbridge to Peterborough you say, and possibly rail-trails involved? You've piqued my interest. We've got a cottage 45mins drive NE of Peterborough and I've never imagined biking there. I've done long distance like to KW before, but if there's rail-trails and infrastructure to facilitate a smooth ride up to Peterborough I'd be interested in checking it out. Take the GO to Lincolnville or the 'Shwa, then head'er out to the beyond of south central Ontario. Love getting off the highways to get a true feel for parts of the province not normally traveled. That's the great thing about biking and how it compares to driving. With bikes you want to avoid car-friendly roads at all costs, so in way the journey is just as important as the destination. With driving it's almost always the opposite.
steveintoronto
Superstar
I think we may be mixing municipal bike paths with trails. I too am unaware of any trails capable of doing distance on in Brampton, but I might stand corrected on it once viewing a map. I hope I'm wrong! But I'm really glad we're on the subject of describing trails. I've been toying with opening a string on just that. One way I'm aware of coming into Toronto from *Malton* (Haven't finessed this from Brampton) is to get up to the Claireville Reservoir through the local park trails and quiet roads, and then take the West Humber Trail all the way to the mouth of the Humber, and then the Lakeshore Trail from there. I'll see if I can post a map on that as an edit later. It's an excellent trail, and discussed a few pages back in this thread. Very few people use it, especially the section north of Lawrence. Excellent way to test potential distance partners before biting off a real distance one. It builds confidence in Newbies too to realize if the pace is right, you don't get exhausted. That confidence is crucial once out in the open country.
It looks supreme!
http://spacing.ca/toronto/2014/08/03/revisiting-uxbridge-peterborough-rail-trails/
Hopefully ShonTron or Mister F can update us on intersecting trails. Peterborough and area have been sprouting them. Let's keep this subject thread alive. Solstice is here in less than a week, and before you know it, Summer is on the wane again. Looks like we've hit a motherlode of interest on the railtrails. I did Port Dover to Brantford to Cambridge and then back-roads to Guelph last Summer...in 6 1/2 hours. Two glitches, missed my turn in Simcoe, wasted half an hour at least, stumbled through Brantford (a map is essential getting through Brantford)(I have a shortcut I can describe) and getting across Cambridge is a known nightmare! Best to go around it in some manner. Once north of the 401, back roads to Guelph are excellent via Hespeler. Fine details on how I'd do that again given the opportunity I'll gladly share if anyone is interested. Never feel like you've failed getting a lift or taking GO to the beginning or end of Rail Trails. Russian Road Roulette should never be part of the game, and a lot of those arterial roads are suicide. At best, they're no fun.
I'm not religious, but after 50 K or so on a Rail Trail, it's me and God! Just remember, pace is everything, don't let distance scare you. If you can walk all day, you can cycle all day, in fact, you're sitting down for it! And sacrifice the performance tires and wheels for slightly heavier ones, most of the distance will be on crushed limestone, and rolling and air resistance is actually less on slightly wider tires, not to mention ride comfort. They can still be road tires, but 23-28c is a great compromise of size to comfort to grip to performance. And a good saddle is absolutely crucial. If you're not comfortable, you're not going to do the miles.
Looking forward to continuing this conversation, I'm sure others with have anecdotes to add!
pdf map of Brampton here: http://www.brampton.ca/EN/residents/parks/documents/brampton_trailsmap.pdf
Here's excellent master map with links to sections for 44 North. Note section up to Lakefield:
http://www.toronto-algonquingreenway.ca/11-tag-zones/
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MisterF
Senior Member
You'd be better off taking a GO bus to Uxbridge and then going from there (I have no idea which bus number or the schedule). The trail goes through Lindsay on the way to Peterborough. From there it goes east towards Belleville and Ottawa. Another rail trail goes north from the Marmora area to Bancroft.
https://www.google.ca/maps/@44.57664,-77.9839226,9.04z/data=!5m1!1e3?hl=en
As for highways, you might be surprised. Some recently built highways and regional roads have very wide shoulders designed for cyclists. They're not as nice as a rail trail because traffic is zooming past you, but it gives cyclists a safe way to use busy roads. Highway 7 between Markham and Brooklin is a good example.
Google Maps differentiates between bike lanes, trails (paved and non-paved), and bike-friendly roads. Municipal bike paths are shown the same way as rail trails.
LNahid2000
Senior Member
Just because it looks nice on a map doesn't mean it's useful in any way. I'm not a fan of the multiuse paths next to streets since I usually bike at 30km/h+ and those paths are very dangerous at intersections when going at those speeds. When riding from Northwest Brampton, I usually end up just using Kennedy and then Matheson to get into Toronto.