Allandale25
Senior Member
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- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
denfromoakvillemilton
Senior Member
Getting this done before march would be amazing. Good to see.
reaperexpress
Senior Member
All of those things sound like they're due to the related signal upgrades, not the passing track itself.
crs1026
Superstar
Quite true - no direct impact on the service plan, but quite helpful to the people operating and dispatching the current trains.
- Paul
smallspy
Senior Member
To a degree.
The ability to route trains into the face of another really only has a benefit if you have a place for them to meet and pass. Which they now do with the double track.
Dan
crs1026
Superstar
In this case, the trains don't even need to ever approach or pass each other (yet). The new signal spacing with a control point or two (the siding) in the middle allows movements to be given "headroom" for switching or through movement at both Kitchener (eastwards) and Guelph (westwards) at the same time. The old CTC allowed only one train to hold the main in one direction between the two points. And, the cheesy old signalling required manual blocking of fleeted trains. That is no longer required. Less waiting time, less paperwork, and less distraction for crews and RTC's
- Paul
lenaitch
Senior Member
crs1026
Superstar
A fleet = two or more trains following each other on fairly close headways, such that spacing is a consideration. In this case the peak GO trains running every 15-30 minutes. The old CTC on the Guelph Sub didn't completely automate the function that kept train B from catching up and running into the previous Train A, manual intervention was required. Now this is properly automated.
- Paul
reaperexpress
Senior Member
Yes, once there are other passing tracks in service to enable a bidirectional service pattern this segment will certainly be useful. But the question I was answering was "what is the utility of the Breslau passing track the meantime until those other segements are brought into service". I explained the one specific bidirectional service pattern that is now theoretically possible and also explained why it's unlikely that service pattern would actually be implemented.
SkylineHorizons
Active Member
They don't care enough about crews to give them lunch breaks lol. Not a single job has an offical lunch break built into it. There's down times where crews change ends or trains but even then they're officially supposed to still be monitoring the radio and its not offically a lunch break.
Agreed, its about the stupidest thing I ever did see. It's completely ass backwards to force every single train to slow down to 45 when they would otherwise have been doing 70mph (in both directions) through there normally.
Litterally no reason why they couldn't have made it like the passing track up by Unionville. Trains can enter the south track on both ends through a turnout that allows for a speed of 45mph while trains not going though a turnout continue at track speed on the main track(which becomes the north track in the double track section). Only there the track speed is 50mph so having to drop to 45 is not a big deal, but going from 70 to 45 is a complete waste of fuel and time.
For sure, but that has nothing to do with the way the passing track was designed it's simply because the RTC now has control signals much closer together between Kitchener and Guelph so he can route trains much further than before. That benefit would exist even if the passing track switches were designed in the same way as a they are up on the Uxbridge. There should also be a light at the enterance to the yard so that trains don't have to perform a time consuming hundred+ year old procedure just to get on the damn main line.
Allandale25
Senior Member
^ if they now have this slow down, has that impacted the travel time and therefore caused changes to the schedule for various stops?
SkylineHorizons
Active Member
It hasn't because the schedule is already well padded, also there's many been slow orders around that area for a while including one right now for exactly 45 at one of the turnouts.
The idea they seem to be going for is that a future schedule will have two trains meet up at the exact middle of the double track section and presumably if they both are traveling at 45mph that will give the system/RTC enough time to give both trains a light at both ends so that no one has to stop. Well they could have tried doing the exact same thing with one train doing 70 and the other doing 45 on the second track anyways, the timing window is smaller but still possible. There was also a lot of space to extend the 2nd track further on the west end before the next crossing since the bridge over fountain st is wide enough for multiple tracks, there was about another km not sure why they didn't make use of that. In any case the problem is that trains do not meet at the same spot on pretty consistent basis anyways so I can see there being frequent slow downs and delays at that short double track section.
smallspy
Senior Member
As I understand from the people in Metrolinx, the main point of this section of double-track is more for service reliability for the time being. It allows for more places for trains to meet when they are running late - which will be especially important in the coming year when the second track at Kitchener Station gets removed from service in order to build the new station. They couldn't do that until this stretch was done.
It was also needed in the long-term as well for whatever service plans they seem to be coming up with, but this interim requirement made it the most pressing of all of the projects on the line.
Dan
crs1026
Superstar
I recall that there is a "Phase II" task to extend the double track eastwards from Shantz Crossing. How far it's going I don't know, but possibly the east end switch will not be there forever.
A 45 mph switch at the west end near the new Breslau station is not the end of the world, as trains will be slowing in that region anyways. But slowing them in the middle of the straight shot from there east to Guelph is pretty limiting.
- Paul
A 45 mph switch at the west end near the new Breslau station is not the end of the world, as trains will be slowing in that region anyways. But slowing them in the middle of the straight shot from there east to Guelph is pretty limiting.
- Paul
reaperexpress
Senior Member
Yes, but even if they align the new east-end switch to match the one they just built at the west end of the second track, that would make the thru route the north track, which is the track where the Breslau Station platform will be located. Meanwhile the station bypass track would be the one requiring a 45 mph limit.
Not all trains will stop at Breslau station. Obviously Via and CN trains won't stop, but even GO's own service can't all stop there given that neither Breslau nor Acton are planned to have platforms on the second track. The train meets that happen need to be between an express train and a local train. But instead of setting the switches up such that the local train that needs to stop anyway is the one that switches tracks, they set it up such that it's the express train that needs to slow down to 45 mph and switch tracks, rather than just blasting through at full speed while the local train is sitting at the platform.
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