[ShonTron]

Anecdotally, I rode the Peterborough and Waterloo buses the first week of service. I was surprised by the quick uptake of ridership (it takes weeks, months to build ridership normally) - the bus from Waterloo, the first full day of service, was half full. I was shocked.

I wouldn't be surprised that now, in the new winter term, that ridership on both routes has skyrocketed to the extent that some trips (you aren't going to get even a majority of trips packed with a peak-flow type service), are closed-door full. It takes time for service planning to react.

 

[vegeta_skyline]

Word is GO has finalized the purchase of a portion of the Oakville sub/Lakeshore west line from the start of the Union Station Rail Corridor limits, mile 1.3 to appox. mile 8 / Campa which is located between Mimico & Long Branch. Only makes perfect sense as this stretch of track is the most costly in terms of the wheelage fee's GO has to pay to CN because it sees by far the most train movements (over a 100 per day, most of which are non-revenue equipment moves to/from Willowbrook yard).
I'd peg the cost at 200 mil as this section contains over 30 miles of signaled main track vs the Weston sub which has less than 20 and cost 160 mil, but the overall land size is smaller.

 

[dunkalunk]

I can vouch for Waterloo, especially at UW. Its a very well-used service by students. GO has also committed to adding buses (IIRC, 2 additional trips, plus replacing some trips with double-deckers) to route 25 to deal with demand. I don't have the numbers in front of me and won't find them as it is 3am, but the demand is there.

I can't say anything for Peterborough however.

@DHLawrence: I could bike to Guelph faster than I could take a GO bus there currently

 

[GTS]

I live in Scarborough and I know that a lot of the GO track are grade seperated from the local streets here in my neigborhood but am wondering what GO is planning to do with some of the crossings. Just west of the Danforth Rd and Midland intersection is where a single lane of GO tracks crosses this busy street. If this GO corridor increases its service in the future it would make sense to grade seperate the tracks from the street. The same line crosses Progress Ave. just west of Midland as well and I think it would be safer and more efficient if these two level crossings were grade seperated.

I don't know who would fund these seperations, the City of Toronto or Metrolinx, but I would like to see more of this done to both increase safety and efficiency for the GO network.

 

[vegeta_skyline]

It would make sense to grade separate those crossings in the future, however currently there are no plans to do so. When determining the need for a grade separation the Road/Rail Exposure Index is used. This number is the average daily number of vehicles multiplied by the number of daily trains passing over the crossing. When this number exceeds 200,000, a grade separation is considered warranted. 21500 vehicles pass over this section of Danforth ave. and 18000 vehicles pass over the Progress ave. level crossings (according to the city of Toronto in 2005, no doubt the numbers have slightly increased by then but likely not by too much). 10 daily trains use the crossing, 5 GO trains going south in the morning and 5 going north in the evening. There is also the occasional road switcher which services the few industries on the line but it only appears a couple of times per week and when you divided it by 7 days the number is less then 1 so it is not a significant factor. The exposure indexs for Danforth is 215,000 and for Progress 180,000. Only Danforth would warrant a grade separations (though Progress may have exceeded 200,000 as of 2010) but only just barely. The exposure index for Sheppard ave is over 300,000 and a grade separation is being built for it, though the main reason why it was pushed forward is because of the transit city light rail line being built along Sheppard. In comparison there are several level crossings on the lakeshore corridor where the exposure index exceeds 1,000,000! Kerrs street in Oakville, for which a grade seperation is planned for, exceeds 1.6 million! (http://www.oakville.ca/Media_Files/engconst/KerrStreetCNR-PIC1PresMaterial.pdf pg13)

The main issue is of course money, and municipalities don't have much of that going around these days. Danforth would be a particularly expensive endeavor because of the location of the Danforth and Midland intersection just 100ft east of the crossing. Both roads would have to be raised or lowered to allow for the intersection to exist, and I don't think the city would have it any other way. So basically I wouldn't hold my breath, as unfortunately it'll likely be many year,s probably a decade or so before you see those level crossings separated.

 

[kettal]

I really think that putting GO (an admirably run organization for its current purpose) in charge of regional rail is like putting Milton Transit in charge of running the Yonge subway. Their institutional mindset is not suited to it no matter how competent they may be.

It's a scary thought, and the growing purchase of new locomotives sounds like we're in for more of the same.

 

[ShonTron]

Check out the service "improvements"
http://gotransit.com/public/en/news/whatsnew.aspx

I love the doublespeak preamble:

GO Transit makes changes to meet increased demand

Starting April 3, 2010, GO Transit is making several system-wide train and bus service changes to meet the needs of our growing ridership and bring schedules in line with actual travel trip times. Many trips have adjusted departure and arrival times.

Georgetown: EPIC FAIL.
I just about knew for sure that the midday Bramalea trains would be cancelled and replaced by bus service. But the 9:20 train (which used to be a more convenient 9:05) still originates in Bramalea. I love how it takes 90 minutes to get from Downtown Brampton to Union Station if taking the 9:20 train from Bramalea.

But the 3:30 early run and the 6:45 late run now continue to Brampton and Mount Pleasant, the 3:30 going to Georgetown, then deadheading back.
It's crazy how Mount Pleasant and Brampton have 4 trains out, 6 trains in. Why couldn't they store a train at Mount Pleasant, and at least send the later morning train out from there?

The additional trips hardly compensate for the loss of train service, especially as the buses do not originate or end at Bramalea City Centre for the Malton-Bramalea buses.

Almost every one of the schedule "revamps" are horrible. Higher fares, less service for just about everybody (if you aren't getting less service, you are getting more schedule padding). But I love the spiel about "changes to meet the needs of our growing ridership."

The Newmarket-York U service gone by the end of April; the Yonge B bus gone (which I do understand), the Square One-Richmond Hill via Pearson cut to serve RH only (though that's okay, MCC has the MT 7!). The one-run wonder from Hamilton to Meadowvale is also gone, plus other bus trips eliminated across the system. Oriole and Old Cummer lose their Union Station buses as well.

I loved how the posted notices telling the SOL Yonge and York U-Newmarket riders said that the buses were being reassigned. Reassigned where? Why not just come out and admit it, this was a cancellation or discontinuance, pure and simple. That's practically lying to their customers.

Ok, Lakeshore East gets one more AM peak train. Big whoop. Is that what the fare increase for everyone buys you?

 

[unimaginative2]

Heh. I bet VIA (and CN, forced to take the one inbound VIA train affected) would be thrilled with a detour via the Halton/York and Newmarket Subs.

I rode the train in from Kitchener when it got detoured over the Halton and Newmarket subs. It didn't actually add much time. I don't think it would be the end of the world for a few months.

 

[Platform 27]

If they don't do it now, they're not going to do it for decades--i.e. when the new diesel rolling stock they're about to buy wears out.

The last of the GO/MPI locomotive order arrives in 2011 and tops out the fleet at 57 MP40s. As has been mentioned upthread, there's apparently now a belief that 57 MP40s won't be able to meet all the incremental service expansions in the medium term (ie out to 2016) and so there's talk of not selling/scrapping all of the F59s (as had been hoped) and instead extending their lifespans even further.

In other words, there's simply no way that GO can keep growing in the long term without adding locomotive stock beyond the 57 MP40s. They know it, we know it, and the WCC ought to know it, if only because their x00 trains per day rhetoric makes no sense without it. GO is not permanently diesel-committed, and won't be ordering any more locomotives until after the electrification study wraps.

 

[Platform 27]

I loved how the posted notices telling the SOL Yonge and York U-Newmarket riders said that the buses were being reassigned. Reassigned where?.

Georgetown?

Ok, Lakeshore East gets one more AM peak train. Big whoop.

You do realize that one train will probably carry more people on it daily than every single rider on the 62 and the 64 and then some?

Agreed that the train movements on the Georgetown line are... puzzling. They can't overnight a train at Mt. Pleasant, though, without a "plug"

 

[hwy7]

I just read the "service" update for the Georgetown line and nearly passed out. Apparently, I have chosen the best possible time to move to Toronto.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

The exposure indexs for Danforth is 215,000 and for Progress 180,000. Only Danforth would warrant a grade separations (though Progress may have exceeded 200,000 as of 2010) but only just barely. The exposure index for Sheppard ave is over 300,000 and a grade separation is being built for it, though the main reason why it was pushed forward is because of the transit city light rail line being built along Sheppard. In comparison there are several level crossings on the lakeshore corridor where the exposure index exceeds 1,000,000! Kerrs street in Oakville, for which a grade seperation is planned for, exceeds 1.6 million! (http://www.oakville.ca/Media_Files/engconst/KerrStreetCNR-PIC1PresMaterial.pdf pg13)

Is there a list of exposure indices floating around the internet? Progress is just a drop in the bucket as far as the Stouffville line is concerned. Finch, Steeles, Hwy 7, Kennedy (twice!), McNicoll, McCowan, Denison, Markham, 16th, and on and on. Surely there's more major level crossings on this stretch of the line than any other GO line...with only moderate service increases, there'd be a long string of >1 millions.

 

[unimaginative2]

Honestly grade separations are pretty low down in terms of priorities for me. They tend to cost a fortune and relatively short and fast passenger trains aren't really all that disruptive. For really major streets and really busy lines, they do make sense, but I think that high quality four point gates and flashers should be more than enough to keep idiots off the right-of-way when a train is coming.

 

[canarob]

First of all, that was a great post, vegeta_skyline. The number of at-grade crossings on the Stouffville line has always seemed like a big obstacle to expansion for me, and I had always thought of it as a "separate them all or nothing" situation, but using the index to separate where needed is certainly a more logical approach. Is GO ever responsible for some of the costs of separation, or is it always the municipality?

The exposure index for Sheppard ave is over 300,000 and a grade separation is being built for it, though the main reason why it was pushed forward is because of the transit city light rail line being built along Sheppard.

I was wondering what was happening there. It's too bad the auto dealership that had the quotations, sayings, etc., got torn down, but this is obviously an improvement.

I wouldn't hold my breath, as unfortunately it'll likely be many years, probably a decade or so before you see those level crossings separated.

If GO is serious about all-day, two-way service, and is undertaking an EA to examine twinning the tracks, I would assume that the Road/Rail Exposure Index would start to rise fairly significantly with the added trains. Although I suppose this might just mean the major arteries would get separated and the minor roads get left as is.

Check out the service "improvements"
http://gotransit.com/public/en/news/whatsnew.aspx

"All southbound trains from Stouffville will arrive into Union three minutes later."

This wasn't quite what I was looking for... :-(

This is probably due to the ridiculous new loading restrictions at Markham GO.

 

[TOareaFan]

Purely on a personal level....I am pleased. My use of GO Transit will increase dramatically now. I am a guy who works downtown and does not use the train every day simply cause most days I can't get away until past 6....so the 5:45 end of train service was annoying to the point I did rejected the system. Now that I can rely on the 6:45 going to Brampton, I can rely on the service more. Most nights that is late enough......on the few a month where it is not I am late enough that the 10 pm via train works just fine.

That is on a personal level. On a more general level, cutting back the number of trains and going backwards to buses is hardly the way to build ridership.....yes the reason may be the construction (although neither the email I got nor the web page mentioned anything of this) but they could have adjusted the schedules rather than cancel the trains.....this will be viewed, generally, as a massive step backwards and will make the introduction of all day service once the construction is done (if that is still the plan) will be even harder in the face of the ridership decline that will follow this move.

It is simply a case of someone saying "hey a lot of those mid day Bramalea trains aren't very full" then I think there needs to be real examination of what determines if a service continues.....I drive beside a lot of (near)empty lakeshore off peak trains too.

So, funnily enough, this is a very large improvement for me personally but a shocking backward step for the line in general.