[sixrings]

It's not just Milton. It also effects trips to neighbouring Mississauga! And I thought also on other routes.

As a Mississauga resident I feel Milton’s pain. Don’t worry we’re getting a lrt so we’re not going to complain. We can go back and forth to Brampton. That’s great.

 

[T3G]

I'm not sure I buy that.

I might buy this "Most people don't trust our current political and bureaucratic leaders to make good use of any additional funds raised and actually deliver the promised outcome'"

I think if you posed a question this way to voters " would you support raising a tax 'x' (hypothetically the sales tax by 1%) IF it resulted in universal prescription drugcare and your ability to get diagnostic imaging in under 30 days and elective
surgery in under 60 days" I think you would get a 'yes'.

But people would have to believe that everyone involved was accountable and would actually deliver the promised outcome. A lot of people currently don't, and regrettably, with good reason.

My opinion is that both of you are right. It's true that many people rightfully don't trust the clowns in charge with delivering any worthwhile public good and are weary of any attempts to come after their money, but there is also a significant demographic of selfish people, the sort who balk at any attempts to suggest we make our society more like Norway or Switzerland because of their high taxes, that have adopted a "fuck you, I got mine" sort of attitude that wouldn't agree to any additional taxes to fund any kind of worthwhile good even if they personally got a chance to follow every single dollar of theirs along their entire journey.

In all I think we live in a very sick society and I feel more than slightly helpless at the thought.

 

[turbanplanner]

People care far more about tax cuts and subsidies (to themselves - all deserved, of course. Nobody else should get these handouts though!) than about good public services.

If you ask most people if they're in favour of childcare, better hospitals, transit, schools, and roads, they'll say yes. Nobody wants to pay to fund these things.

I think it's more nobody feels that the money will actually lead to meaningful change?

 

[turbanplanner]

My opinion is that both of you are right. It's true that many people rightfully don't trust the clowns in charge with delivering any worthwhile public good and are weary of any attempts to come after their money, but there is also a significant demographic of selfish people, the sort who balk at any attempts to suggest we make our society more like Norway or Switzerland because of their high taxes, that have adopted a "fuck you, I got mine" sort of attitude that wouldn't agree to any additional taxes to fund any kind of worthwhile good even if they personally got a chance to follow every single dollar of theirs along their entire journey.

In all I think we live in a very sick society and I feel more than slightly helpless at the thought.

Even the most fuck you I got mine people are mostly in that boat since they believe funds won't be spent properly.

I've told people I know their property tax is too low (who really understands the cost of infrastructure?) and it's been passed onto the younger gen in the form of development charges. Not one person believed me

 

[ARG1]

My opinion is that both of you are right. It's true that many people rightfully don't trust the clowns in charge with delivering any worthwhile public good and are weary of any attempts to come after their money, but there is also a significant demographic of selfish people, the sort who balk at any attempts to suggest we make our society more like Norway or Switzerland because of their high taxes, that have adopted a "fuck you, I got mine" sort of attitude that wouldn't agree to any additional taxes to fund any kind of worthwhile good even if they personally got a chance to follow every single dollar of theirs along their entire journey.

In all I think we live in a very sick society and I feel more than slightly helpless at the thought.

While I'm not denying that those types of selfish people exist, I think the amount of people in that boat are a lot lower than you might believe.

 

[Krypto98]

After all the crowding last year, I'm really surprised not to see a 4th round trip.

Not enough staff

But let's not hire railroaders from CP and CN rail... with 3+ years on

 

[Willybru21]

Not enough staff

But let's not hire railroaders from CP and CN rail... with 3+ years on

Oh they have enough right now, there’s over 25 crews on the spareboard

 

[anb]

GO stopped a direct bus to Union due to downtown traffic jams. The impact has been ‘just disastrous’ on GTA commuters

Service cuts add up to an hour each way between Milton, Mississauga and Union Station.

www.thestar.com

After having an experience with all 3 detours made to the 21, I can say that it isn't all too bad... if you look at it as a regional thing and don't commute to and from Toronto. The execution to all this was terrible especially on Milton's side. If they left in the old 21B route that went from Milton and on Derry to Meadowvale then express to Union, and changed everything else, at least this would make everything on the entire corridor still connect in between no matter where you're going. That's what an overall line should do, no matter if its executed by train or bus.

 

[ShonTron]

The 21A to Milton should be treated as a stand-alone route with peak-direction service for Sheridan College Oakville and the connections to the 407 buses to Hamilton/York Region.

For Milton and Meadowvale, might be better to send some of the buses to Bramalea instead too, connecting to the Kitchener trains via the 407.

 

[T3G]

Hard disagree on peak direction service. Both ways all day, as the 20 was, would be much more useful.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I said this would go over like a pile of rocks in the ocean. Metrolinx should change the schedule back in June.

 

[ShonTron]

Hard disagree on peak direction service. Both ways all day, as the 20 was, would be much more useful.

I meant it should have peak direction service as a stand-alone route. As a “train-bus” supplement to the Milton Line trains, it doesn’t.

 

[T3G]

I meant it should have peak direction service as a stand-alone route. As a “train-bus” supplement to the Milton Line trains, it doesn’t.

My apologies, I misread.

In that case you are absolutely bang on; even with the pitiful 2 hour frequencies of the old 20 we are still far away from the glory days.

 

[LairdOfTheNorth]

The 21A to Milton should be treated as a stand-alone route with peak-direction service for Sheridan College Oakville and the connections to the 407 buses to Hamilton/York Region.

For Milton and Meadowvale, might be better to send some of the buses to Bramalea instead too, connecting to the Kitchener trains via the 407.

I wonder if there would have been a plan to connect buses to Milton/Meadowvale from Mount Dennis if that line was completed.

It seems that would be much quicker route than the current 21 bus route to Milton through Oakville.

 

[Metroscapes]

It boggled my mind that GO hadn't used the Mississauga Transitway between Square One and the 427, it was a Metrolinx project for crying out loud. I had urged GO to use it for a 21 bus branch direct from Union, but still seems they're resistant to it.

Digging deeper, I now see that the 29 (Guelph/Mississauga) uses the transitway, providing a one-seat ride from Kipling to Guelph. That's huge! Back when I was in university, I'd miss the transfer between the 21 and the 29 half the time, adding an hour to my trip each time. Now that's still requiring TTC to Kipling with no co-fare, instead of a direct ride form Union. But we know the construction downtown is a factor. It's a step in the right direction though, and big for anyone who needs to go between west-central / south Etobicoke and Guelph. However, they did not give the same treatment to the 25 (Waterloo/Mississauga).

Pre-downtown construction, a direct bus between Union and Renforth would be 15 minutes on a good evening, 45 minutes during rush hour. The 29 schedule suggests another 15 minutes between Renforth and Square One. Relying on the TTC to/from Kipling is about 35 minutes, and assuming 5 minutes of waiting, the 29 schedule suggests 10-12 minutes. That compares with the 21 that would go along the Gardiner, stop at Cooksville, and take the long loop around Square One before getting to the main terminal. In summary, by my (old) previous experience / calculations:

• 30-60 minutes: GO Bus express Union to Renforth, via Transitway to Square One
• 65-67 minutes: TTC Union to Kipling, GO Bus via 427 and Transitway to Square One
• 45-90 minutes: GO Bus 21P Union via Gardiner and Hurontario, looping at Cooksville and Square One

Not really applicable now with Hazel Line and Ontario Line construction. But all that just to say I think there was an easy time saver in routing the 21 along the Transitway, the transit corridor Metrolinx built themselves.