[AlvinofDiaspar]

Jonny:

Don't get me started on the "charity panhandlers", who now cover every corner and are from agency I knew and did not know existed.

Interesting how nobody mentioned the annoying individuals shoving their wares on behalf of the private sector to ensure the products get maximum exposure - at the cost of pedestrian flow. Y&D is pretty bad, and I came across a case of what, RBC (or some other bank, BMO?) setting up booths in the public skywalk between Yorkdale subway station and the mall - on the busiest week, blocking half the route?

AoD

 

[Admiral Beez]

One day in the foreseeable we will enter a cashless, or at least coinless economy. Unless the beggars take debit, credit cards, or whatever electronic substitute we have for coins and paper money, they'll be SOL.

 

[buildup]

How about those young pre-med students raising money for Sick Kids. Since the money goes to research, and most research costs are salary to researchers - this amounts to panhandling.

 

[Admiral Beez]

- this amounts to panhandling.

I wish this term "panhandling" would cease to be used. No one is handling a pan. It's begging, by beggars obviously, so let's refer to it by what it is.

 

[tkip]

Hold on....

I was under the impression that donations from fundraising could not be used for salaries? New equipment and new buildings, yes but people's salaries aren't being paid this way. I think....

 

[pilinha]

How about those young pre-med students raising money for Sick Kids. Since the money goes to research, and most research costs are salary to researchers - this amounts to panhandling.

Yes, but the money is going to a great cause - not to someone's smoking, drinking or drug habit.

The homeless in Toronto are well-fed, no one is starving.

 

[tkip]

Really....

The homeless in Toronto are well-fed, no one is starving.

Really?

Where's you evidence that proves that the homeless are well fed and content with the food they have to get by on? From what I see of most homeless, and I'm talking the truly homeless, they don't look particularily healthy and well fed to my eyes. Are you actually aware of the life expentancy of people living on the streets?

I think this remark does a huge disservice to people in need and living on the streets. This is just more typical bashing of people who are poor.

 

[pilinha]

Really?
Are you actually aware of the life expentancy of people living on the streets?

Yes, I am. And there is plenty of evidence out there that points to the reasons, and none of them have to do with adequate or nutritious food.

Most die of illnesses attributable to alcohol and smoking-related diseases and to violence and injuries, much of which are related to substance abuse.

The number you speak of also includes excess deaths related to mental disorders and suicides.

 

[tkip]

Proof...

Yes, I am. And there is plenty of evidence out there that points to the reasons, and none of them have to do with adequate or nutritious food. Most die of illnesses attributable to alcohol and smoking-related diseases and to violence and injuries, much of which are related to substance abuse. The number you speak of also includes excess deaths related to mental disorders and suicides.

You must be talking about a stat showing deaths and what people died from while homeless but you didn't provide any info.

I'm not convinced that poor diet while living on the street is not a contributing factor to shorten lifespans for the homeless. If you live on the streets you are simply not getting the proper nutritional value from foods unless someone is feeding you on a daily basis, some good quality meals.

The bad habits such as drinking, smoking and drugs probably just accelerate the person's health faster to a breaking point.

I keep hearing of studies showing that poor people in general suffer from a much greater incidence of health problems compared to the rest of the population because they have little money to buy proper, healthy food. I don't know why the same wouldn't also apply to a homeless person.

You made a remark that seemed to suggest the food isn't really a issue for someone living on the street and I question this. How does one not having a income and thus no access to proper food and nutrition, not suffer health issues over a period of time while living on the streets?

It has to be a factor.

 

[drewp]

it really has nothing to do with whether they are not eating properly. Most people on the streets do have plenty of access to food and shelter......the key is if they want it.

As someone who has worked with the homeless population for 3 years i can tell you that the proof is most people on the streets have concurrent disorders which means they have mental health and a drug/substance abuse problem. This is the key contributer to there lower life expectancy, as well as many do not have access to a family doctor and benefits. Most homeless people neglect there health when there sick becuase it isn't as important which can seriously damage or kill them.

 

[Second_in_pie]

it really has nothing to do with whether they are not eating properly. Most people on the streets do have plenty of access to food and shelter......the key is if they want it.

That's hitting the nail on the head. It's not a question of food or shelter, but their psychological profile. Many homeless people live on the streets because they want to live there, or at least they don't want to live in a shelter or under care of the government. Some want to be independent, and others have worse conditions that makes them fearful of other people having control like that. It just ends up spiraling down into a pretty dreadful situation. The only real way to help these people is to go out and reach out to them, give them people to relate to and doctors and psychologists to treat them.

 

[drone]

I've had much experience with the shelter system,mental health system and legal. There are 3 types of homeless

1. A person(with no mental illness) who lost their job, and is unable to pay rent and ends up homeless. Makes use of homeless services. Gets an apartment and that's it. (VERY RARE CASE)

2. A person with a major mental illness whom due to symptoms often gets evicted due to being unable to manage their home (pay rent, clean, pay bills ). Or they act out in their apartment (yelling, barricading themselves, harrassing others in the building) They typically lose housing, then use homeless services and get another apartment and do the same thing over and over and over again. (common)

3. The hard to house..usually an individual with an addiction issue, mental health issues, whom has had a violent history, fire setting, etc...no long term homes will accept them as they endanger the other residents. Those are the people whom I'd refer to as "aggressive street people" whom only shelters like Seaton house will accept. (most common)

Example. I was given the task of finding housing for a gentleman whom had lived in a home with other at risk men. (physical and mental). He emptied all fire extinguishers, assaulted a wheel chair bound man. Administered meds to an individual whom is unable to speak or move. He set fire to the third floor. Stole money from other residents. He drinks anything, lately, hand sanitizer. He uses crack in his room, and will not leave his crack pipe even to go to the bathroom. He will defecate in a bag, and throw it in the hall and urinate in his room. He has been given ticket after ticket after ticket for aggressive panhandling. He suffers from a major mental illness.

Do you want him as a neighbour??

where does someone like this live???

In my opinion, you want less aggressive homeless people

tighten up mental health and justice laws

there are PLENTY of homes for people. It's often their inability to behave and act accordingly while living with others which leads to them being street people.

 

[kettal]

Drone, thanks for the insight. Do you consider canada's problem stems from our unwillingness towards institutionalisation? For some time now it has been considered evil in our society to "lock" up the ill.

 

[drone]

nobody belongs in an institution. It's about creating homes that are tolerant to the sorts of behaviours that make people unfit for what is considered normal housing.

 

[spider]

It's about creating homes that are tolerant to the sorts of behaviours that make people unfit for what is considered normal housing.

I think you just defined an Institution.