[UD2]

Hopefully when the King transit mall becomes "permanent", they'll replace those temporary streetcar stops with bumpouts like on Roncesvalles Avenue.

I actually hope they create permanent curbs at street car stops fully protected with barriers and planters (with trees). The ramp is because passengers need to walk across a bike lane, which on King street doesn't exist. Everytime you create a ramp there is a chance someone would drive/ride onto it creating danger for the passengers.

We have a chance to make King St into almost an LRT with this initiative.

 

[DSC]

I actually hope they create permanent curbs at street car stops fully protected with barriers and planters (with trees). The ramp is because passengers need to walk across a bike lane, which on King street doesn't exist. Everytime you create a ramp there is a chance someone would drive/ride onto it creating danger for the passengers.

We have a chance to make King St into almost an LRT with this initiative.

If, or I hope, when the pilot is over they WILL fix the street, widen sidewalks etc. Remember, its a PILOT.

 

[soundmuseum]

It's only the first day, but I think the 504 was running a lot faster without all the cars normally there blocking the way. During rush hour, I went westbound from King and Parliament over to Bathurst in about 15 minutes!
Of course there needs to be some time for people to get used to it. At King and Yonge heading eastbound, people were standing in front of the regular stop on the southwest corner waiting while the streetcars passed.
There was no one from the TTC guiding them to the new stop on the southeast side in front of the Shoppers.

 

[wopchop]

People don't notice new signage. A "no right" sign was installed in my area to stop cars turning onto a side street, and every morning I watched so many people turning right. The police had someone stationed there for the first few months, and they pulled over car after car and handed out tickets. I am sure they made that turn because there were used to doing so, and they simply did not see the new signage (despite all the bright "new" signs).

Signs that prohibit turns are meaningless to a lot of drivers. Go stand at the exit from 427 southbound to the Queensway, and watch how many cars turn right on red. Nearly every car.

And it's not just Toronto. Come to Oakville, and take North Service Rd eastbound to Trafalgar, and witness how many cars ignore the 'No Right on Red' signs.

 

[MetroMan]

Signs that prohibit turns are meaningless to a lot of drivers. Go stand at the exit from 427 southbound to the Queensway, and watch how many cars turn right on red. Nearly every car.

And it's not just Toronto. Come to Oakville, and take North Service Rd eastbound to Trafalgar, and witness how many cars ignore the 'No Right on Red' signs.

I can’t wait until self driving cars go mainstream. From that point, getting and keeping a manual driving license should be exceedingly strict.

 

[MetroMan]

I wonder what happened to the drop off zones, taxi stands, pedestrian areas and streetcar stop road designs. They’re there in signage but the curb lane just looks wide open and many cars are just driving in them.

They need to paint the curb lanes with a colour code and add more planters and lane separators.

 

[steveintoronto]

I wonder what happened to the drop off zones, taxi stands, pedestrian areas and streetcar stop road designs. They’re there in signage but the curb lane just looks wide open and many cars are just driving in them.

They need to paint the curb lanes with a colour code and add more planters and lane separators.

They also need to get the street signs figured out. This is still up, eastbound, King and John:

Steve Munro has an excellent article up on the King Project @ Torontoist:
https://torontoist.com/2017/11/king-street-transit-pilot-launches-quietly/

I had long talks with some TTC and Cops, many ideas and observations exchanged, but further to my claims of "Bike Boxes" and a lot of cycling infrastructure being outside of the HTA, a discussion on the HTA itself ensued.

I'd queried:

Another question: Does anyone know if using the opposing lane to pass a stopped streetcar is legal? This brings into question the single solid white/yellow line v double solid white/yellow line debate. It's an important point, because sure as hell some impatient motorist is going to try this, and it turns to grief. The actual meaning of a solid white/yellow line remains ambiguous under even the HTA. (careful when answering that, as it has huge implications for cyclists and cycle lanes, let alone motorists crossing them to turn, as discussed in the HTA but not comprehensively).

Answer from the cops was truly chilling:
(gist) "The reason you can't find a definitive answer in the HTA is because there isn't one. Even if a motorist passed a streetcar by crossing a double yellow line, that in itself is not a chargeable offence, it's only if it results in an accident that they could then be charged with a related offence."

I asked about how Planning goes about doing a project like this. "Do they consult you before doing it?" The answer, after the two cops looked at each other, bit their tongues and rolled their eyes was: (gist) "They give us forms to submit *after the fact*, and even there, who knows if they read them or not?"

I asked about the cycling lanes and the HTA. The senior cop remarked (gist) "Man, you're hitting the sore points we've been discussing. Again, there is no answer in the HTA, and no, unless there's an offence under the HTA or the Criminal Code, we can't enforce the by-laws for the bike lanes. You're up on this, you have to pursue this with City Hall and Queen's Park...someone has to."

I didn't mention my already trying to get the attention of Planning, two Councillors, and the most prominent cycling org in Toronto by written requests for clarification. Not one reply from any of them.

The cops don't fare much better evidently...

I'd pointed out the need for the illuminated LED "No Left Turn" signs a few posts back, and posted the link to the company that makes them and the City's own testing of them and their now using them at 40 locations in the city.

Munro states same:

[...]
One immediately obvious problem is that a “no through traffic” restriction is quite rare in Toronto, and motorists assume that a green signal means they can go straight ahead, even if not in any other direction. Much more prominent, preferably illuminated signs are needed to grab drivers’ attention just as the city already does with “no left turn” arrows at key intersections.

Active direction of traffic will be key at the entrance points to the pilot. On a drizzly Monday morning, a traffic constable at Bathurst gave no quarter, and waved off every vehicle that attempted a move banned under the new rules. This will be fine as long as it lasts, but the moment this type of hands-on management disappears, scofflaws will reappear in droves. This really is a job for TTC staff or Mayor Tory’s recently announced traffic wardens.[...]

https://torontoist.com/2017/11/king-street-transit-pilot-launches-quietly/

BlogTO reports on the Project here:
http://www.blogto.com/city/2017/11/drivers-ignoring-new-signs-king-street-pilot/

 

[am29]

I can’t wait until self driving cars go mainstream. From that point, getting and keeping a manual driving license should be exceedingly strict.

30 years from now enter Blade Runner 2047

 

[salsa]

I would also be interested to know if the new restrictions have been captured on google maps, apple navigation, waze, and other route-planning apps yet.

 

[kotsy]

Are cars really allowed to travel from University to Peter without turning? I thought they were only allowed on block.

 

[Megaton327]

Are cars really allowed to travel from University to Peter without turning? I thought they were only allowed on block.

Yes, they are allowed to go that far. No, it doesn't make any sense.

 

[steveintoronto]

Are cars really allowed to travel from University to Peter without turning? I thought they were only allowed on block.

There's a really long stretch headed east too, at least one. I got distracted talking to cops on other huge compromises (and their frustrations at it all) but it was in the western end somewhere west of John, and maybe continuing further east from there. The reason I noticed is that I was snapping pics of the signs and intersections, many of which were misleading and downright ambiguous, and went for blocks only to realize that some of the signs I was looking weren't there, because long stretches were being permitted.

Here's a shot of terrible quality, apologies, but this is at York or Bay IIRC looking east. I was fascinated by the directions offering no choice but to go straight through the lights during evening rush hour. Not quite the intent of what was touted as the cause d'etre of the Project, is it?

Note the lack of detail for exceptions for the left turn...unless there are no exceptions at this intersection. But that is illustrative of much of the exercise.There's little logic or consistency to much of it.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

So the “real test” begun today, as many have pointed out.

Thus far there is no traffic on King, and still no congestion at Bathurst or Jarvis. It’s working.

 

[DSC]

So the “real test” begun today, as many have pointed out.

Thus far there is no traffic on King, and still no congestion at Bathurst or Jarvis. It’s working.

Yes, my better half has just reported the same having taken streetcar from Jarvis to University. I still think the lights and signs need to be improved but ....

 

[innsertnamehere]

You can drive from University to Yonge without being forced off - It'll be useful to remember the "blocks" as King will be a great traffic free shortcut across a few blocks if you are trying to avoid some things.