[Gavin]

Not true. FCG complaining on UT or some Sun whiners are just the complainers. There are also lots of volunteers, spectators, and other genuinely enjoying the runs.

While you're right about the complainers, the support for runs in Toronto pales in comparison to elsewhere. Like, barely a fraction.

 

[salsa]

Not true. FCG complaining on UT or some Sun whiners are just the complainers.

Don't forget mayor John Tory, who caused this discussion in the first place.

 

[JWBF]

The fact that this is incorrect is irrelevant (Canada is a secular state).

Sorry, I mistyped, at the time of the institution of the stops, before CanCon, there was a state religion and it was "Christian" based. However, Canada is not a secular nation, it promotes "religious pluralism"; we don't separate, we embrace what we believe.

If you want argue this further please create a topic, I'm not going to sideline on this further.

The point is that maintaining a stop to service any specific building that basically nobody uses is stupid. Streetcar routes have enough delay problems from inept management that it seems plainly irresponsible to not remove them. A perfect example I encounter every sunday on the 504 westbound is the stop in front of the church at Close ave, which is less than 100m from the Jameson stop. People pull the stop cord thinking they are getting off at Jameson, but he stops at Close because it's a Sunday stop. No one ever gets off and goes to the church, and this was a needless delay in what is already a route seriously plagued by delays.

Again, problems ensue when people don't plan for contingencies. If the people taking this route on a regular basis they should be aware of the "Sunday Stop" or they should take the time to look at the stop indicator at the front of the 'car, their causing the problem. If "responsibility" is to be used to produce blame then it should, like any law, concern all.

But while I'm sure the TTC will one day eliminate these glaringly stupid Sunday stops, don't expect Tory to show up for presser on that one...Mr Conservative won't want to be seen as anti-god for his religious base. I can see the headlines now...."TTC snubs god...takes away his streetcar stops"

You should write for The Sun or The SNN.

 

[animatronic]

Can everyone please shut up about the marathons? FFS start a new thread.

 

[LNahid2000]

Can everyone please shut up about the marathons? FFS start a new thread.

Well that added nothing to this thread. Which of John Tory's ideas are we allowed to talk about in this thread?

 

[animatronic]

Well that added nothing to this thread. Which of John Tory's ideas are we allowed to talk about in this thread?

Everyone's had a chance to make their points over the last 110 posts. Maybe it's time to move on.

 

[Juan_Lennon416]

Can everyone please shut up about the marathons? FFS start a new thread.

You beat me to it

 

[prosperegal]

That reminds me, I was poking around underground a few times recently, trying to find the entrance to the western end of the Yonge (Line 2) platform. I always kept ending up at the main entrance near the Bay.

The other day I tried just going outside onto the west side of Yonge, just north of Bloor. And right there is the missing entrance I could never find. Walking down the stairs, it's clear there's no entrance into the underground mall.

But was it always that way? I could have sworn there was 20 or so years ago. Is my memory failing me?

Odd that there is nothing but an outside entrance, given where it is.

Which entrance are you talking about? The Yonge side of the CIBC doors?

 

[freshcutgrass]

Sorry, I mistyped, at the time of the institution of the stops, before CanCon, there was a state religion and it was "Christian" based.

Canada has never had an official state religion...you obviously don't know what you're talking about. It's also, as I previously pointed out.... irrelevant. Whether or not there was just cause to put streetcar stops in front of churches at the time they were implemented (the 1920's), it's certainly hasn't been the case for a very long time. They are redundant.

My interest is in improving public transit service. What is your argument in favour of retaining redundant streetcar stops?

Jan 30, 2014
TOinTRANSIT: TTC re-thinking Sunday streetcar stops
Beach Mirror


The TTC is considering removing all “Sunday” streetcar stops to prevent stop-and-go-service and bunching.

A new report to be presented at this week’s board meeting also recommends placing all streetcar stops 300-400 metres apart, which it states would help service efficiency while also keeping the stops within a reasonable walking distance.

Removing all 39 Sunday stops, which were first employed in the 1920s as a way to reduce the walking distance for churchgoers, would have a beneficial effect on downtown traffic flows since they’re lightly used, the study finds.

An expanded report on bus and streetcar stop placement is expected to be presented to the board in late February.

 

[Palma]

The fact that this is incorrect is irrelevant (Canada is a secular state). The point is that maintaining a stop to service any specific building that basically nobody uses is stupid. Streetcar routes have enough delay problems from inept management that it seems plainly irresponsible to not remove them. A perfect example I encounter every sunday on the 504 westbound is the stop in front of the church at Close ave, which is less than 100m from the Jameson stop. People pull the stop cord thinking they are getting off at Jameson, but he stops at Close because it's a Sunday stop. No one ever gets off and goes to the church, and this was a needless delay in what is already a route seriously plagued by delays.

But while I'm sure the TTC will one day eliminate these glaringly stupid Sunday stops, don't expect Tory to show up for presser on that one...Mr Conservative won't want to be seen as anti-god for his religious base. I can see the headlines now...."TTC snubs god...takes away his streetcar stops"

Well what about that ridiculous stop in front of Loblaws on St Clair, just to service the neighbourhood to the south? That stop is a short walk from the stop at Bathurst and St Clair

 

[rbt]

I fail to see what the problem is many of the runners 'not even' being from Toronto. Major marathons in other cities draw runners from elsewhere - they rely on that, in fact.

Indeed. That's where the hotel/restaurant/etc. profits come from.

The big numbers associated with Pride, Caribanna, and TIFF are the same. Torontonian's don't spend much more during events; folks from outside the city visit and drop a bunch while they are here. Pulling revenue from outside sources is exactly why the city can financially justify holding these kinds of events.


That said, if we had a long/wide well-maintained waterfront trail that ran for tens of km that would probably be the best place to hold the smaller running events; and I wouldn't object to funding such a thing.

 

[The Golem]

The actual marathon only has 2,500 runners: http://www.torontomarathon.com/races/marathon.html

It just seems ridiculous to close down the city so these people can feel better about themselves, many of them not even from Toronto. The whole "marathon industry" is a big joke.

You didn't keep reading. In addition to those 2500 runners, the half-marathon has 6,000 participants. And the 5k run (hardly even worth writing about it's so short LOL) pulls in another 2000 people.
The joke is on you, not people who are active and involved. And as the saying goes, What's so bad about feeling good? I mean, what's wrong about people training for months to complete a run and feel good about their accomplishment!
Not only is it a great feeling, the routes are an amazing opportunity to see a lot of the city's neighbourhoods from a vantage point few get to experience.

 

[pw20]

You didn't keep reading. In addition to those 2500 runners, the half-marathon has 6,000 participants. And the 5k run (hardly even worth writing about it's so short LOL) pulls in another 2000 people.
The joke is on you, not people who are active and involved. And as the saying goes, What's so bad about feeling good? I mean, what's wrong about people training for months to complete a run and feel good about their accomplishment!
Not only is it a great feeling, the routes are an amazing opportunity to see a lot of the city's neighbourhoods from a vantage point few get to experience.

I have been a loyal Urban Toronto reader since this forum was created... but this thread has really tried my patience. John Tory never threatened to cancel the marathon, or move the marathon. Yet this forum has now spent pages and countless posts calling John Tory "out of touch" "against physical fitness" "pandering to drivers" and "old" simply because he suggested that some (NOT ALL) events should find alternative locations instead of the DVP or Gardiner.

Toronto has amazing events which shut down major arteries the Santa Clause Parade (which I believe is one of the largest in the world and broadcast internationally), Pride, heck - I'll even throw in the marathon even though size wise - with 10,000 runners or 20,000 runners pales in comparison to the other two events, Caribana, and others. These events help make Toronto great, they bring in tourist dollars and make up the fabric of our city. We should continue to shut down city streets for marquee events.

However, does EVERY event or ride or fundraiser need to close down the DVP or Gardiner? I don't know. Do we need two different marathons?. I personally don't think so. As with any decision there should be a set of criteria applied to approving such permits (is it international in scope?, does it attract external funding?, is there an alternative route?, is it a tourist event? etc...). This is all John Tory has said - that not every event should close a major city street. Toronto needs a balance; ca c'est tout.

Instead of spending time talking about other JT initiatives such as rear door boarding on the King car, or bringing visa/debit to the TTC (which is real f'ing progress) people on this thread have nit-picked and have blown out of proportion this - its disheartening, it does not elevate the discourse in TOpoli and concentrates on a chimeric negative that actually was never raised. The marathon sky isn't falling folks [sic] so come back from the brink.

 

[pman]

You didn't keep reading. In addition to those 2500 runners, the half-marathon has 6,000 participants. And the 5k run (hardly even worth writing about it's so short LOL) pulls in another 2000 people.
The joke is on you, not people who are active and involved. And as the saying goes, What's so bad about feeling good? I mean, what's wrong about people training for months to complete a run and feel good about their accomplishment!
Not only is it a great feeling, the routes are an amazing opportunity to see a lot of the city's neighbourhoods from a vantage point few get to experience.

Nothing's wrong about people feeling good about their marathon accomplishments. But getting around this city is so often an absolute and complete soul-destroying misery that it would be nice for marathon organizers to have some sensitivity for the vast majority of the population who don't compete and simply want to go about their business.

 

[LNahid2000]

Nothing's wrong about people feeling good about their marathon accomplishments. But getting around this city is so often an absolute and complete soul-destroying misery that it would be nice for marathon organizers to have some sensitivity for the vast majority of the population who don't compete and simply want to go about their business.

It's Sunday morning. I'd never describe getting around on a Sunday morning as 'soul-destroying misery'.