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anb said:
This is why the Chinguacousy Zum (504) should go down to CCTT just like the current day 502 as it'll parallel the exact same routing from Sandalwood-CCTT while also serving Derry and the Heartland area which can grow.

Don't understand why its painfully being another Steeles branch going all the way to Bramalea when this is a clear full potential routing for the 504. You already have a Zum route on Steeles as well as the local 4/11/51 and Miway 57/61 routes assisting service to Sheridan/Shoppers World anyway.

With it being this way this already makes an express service on Mavis, and gives a chance for the 61 to stay on grid to go down to Dundas or Cooksville.GO.

Brampton and Mississauga already have N-S routes that assist each other, some going surprisingly deep into the other's city limits aside from the 502. Not sure why they wouldn't just give the 185 entirely to Miway as route wise it makes way more sense.
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the 504 Chinguacousy-Steeles route is being turned into such an L shape for the basic reason that that demand past Bramalea GO is so high that in the morning full buses going eastbound are bypassing stops before Bramalea because traffic is bound towards Etobicoke, and in the evening people are being left behind heading westbound before Bramalea GO because the bus is crammed with people heading from Etobicoke towards Gateway Terminal. Once we make progress on fixing congestion on the Steeles Corridor, we will be able to consider rerouting the 504 to CCTT. The other issue with having the 504 go to CCTT is that it will undermine ridership on the Hurontario LRT by offering people in Western Brampton an alternate route to CCTT with fewer transfers. It is essential that we funnel as much traffic as possible onto the LRT to ensure the ridership numbers look good, riders be damned. One plus side of the 11/504/511 interlining is it will make it easier to justify bus lanes, with the combined bus headway below 4 minutes.
drum118 said:
The biggest problem for CCTT, it was built for a city of 250,000 and seeing 25,000 a day back in 1990's.

I have called for a new terminal next to Hurontario that will handle 150,000 for over 10 years. It would have an underground station for the Transitway buses,
another level below it for future GO/Subway/LRT line. The Hurontario line would stay on Hurontario over the 403 and service the new terminal.

Hurontario will only be 2 lanes compare to the 3 lanes before construction started on the LRT.

I have yet to hear what Brampton will do when the LRT opens in 2025, but Mississauga will be running bus service to service stops between the LRT stations. The 502 may still run to CCTT or terminate At Steeles.

As for the 61, again being calling for it to run to the Cooksville GO Station by Dundas. This give riders that use Dundas to do one less transfer and become a grid line route with a branch off to CCTT as well. More service is needed with staff calling for an express bus on it.

The thinking is planning has been out to lunch for the past 20 years and have got various routes change with better service

As for the 504, where do you put it at CCTT when none on BT buses use CCTT in the first place other than on the street??
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Brampton will terminate the 502 at Steeles and be reallocating buses from the 502 to the 504, that is why the 504 was delayed from 2022 to 2024, and now 2025
 
DKsan said:
I mean, no one should be speeding in school zones, never mind municipal employees driving city vehicles?
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No one should speed through a school zone. But everybody goes 60km/h on a 50km/h road. Nothing wrong with a driver going a little faster than the speed limit. Especially when they're in a dedicated bus lane. I'm sure the riders appreciate it. I know I did when I used to take the bus.
If buses can't compete with automobiles, people will stay in their cars. Got to respect the passenger's time. Installing a device in buses that forces them to slow down seems counter-productive to encouraging more people to take the bus.
 
January 8, 2024 service changes

8 Cawthra

  • New weekday southbound trips from City Centre at 725a and 231p.
9 Rathburn-Thomas

  • All weekday trips will service Erindale GO Station. Additional early morning and late evening trips on all service days to match route 20 span of service.
13 Glen Erin

  • New weekday northbound trip from Clarkson GO at 212p.
18 McLaughlin-Derry

  • Route revised to no longer service stop inside Sheridan College, insetad servicing layby on McLaughlin Road at Sheridan College Drive along with route 57.
20 Rathburn

  • Route revised to only operate between City Centre and Kipling Terminal, no longer providing service to Erindale GO. Route 20 will serve platform O at City Centre and loop via Duke of York and City Centre Drive.
  • Frequencies will remain similar as the current levels at most times, with the following exceptions: weekday late evening improved from 47 to 37 minutes, Saturday early AM frequency improved from 33 to 26 minutes, Saturday late evening improved from 33 to 28 minutes, Sunday all day improved from 38 to 30 minutes.
  • Due to shorter routing, 1 less bus in service during Weekday peak, midday, evening and Saturday daytime.
35 Eglinton

  • Sunday all day frequency improved from 35 to 28 minutes. 1 bus added to route
  • Weekday peak service rescheduled with 1 bus added to avoid loss of existing frequency.
38 Creditview/39 Britannia

  • To accomodate articulated buses on 39 Britannia, routes 38 and 39 will swap platforms at Meadowvale Town Centre.
44 Mississauga Road

  • New weekday trips from Meadowvale Town Centre at 745a and 922a; new weekday trips from UTM at 831a and 413p.
61 Mavis

  • Will be allocated additional articulated buses, reassigned due to route 66 service increase.
66 McLaughlin

  • Weekday frequency increases as follows: 15 to 10 minutes midday (+3 buses), 11 to 8 minutes PM peak (+3 buses). No changes to AM peak or evening frequencies. Some blocks will use 40 foot buses rather than articulated buses.


Route runtime changes - Several routes will have additional runtime added to improve reliability. In most cases, frequencies will decrease slightly to accommodate the additional runtime.

  • 1 Dundas (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 3 Bloor (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 10 Bristol‐Britannia (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 15 Drew (Weekday)
  • 18 McLaughlin‐Derry (Weekday)
  • 28 Confederation (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 34 Credit Valley (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 35 Eglinton (Weekday)
  • 42 Derry (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 43 Matheson‐Argentia (Weekday)
  • 45 Winston Churchill (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 48 Erin Mills (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 57 Courtneypark (Weekday)
  • 66 McLaughlin (Weekday)
  • 71 Sheridan‐Subway (Weekday)
  • 87 Meadowvale‐Skymark (Weekday)
  • 90 Terragar‐Copenhagen Loop (Weekday)
  • 101 Dundas Express (Weekday)
 
MiExpress said:
January 8, 2024 service changes

8 Cawthra

  • New weekday southbound trips from City Centre at 725a and 231p.
9 Rathburn-Thomas

  • All weekday trips will service Erindale GO Station. Additional early morning and late evening trips on all service days to match route 20 span of service.
13 Glen Erin

  • New weekday northbound trip from Clarkson GO at 212p.
18 McLaughlin-Derry

  • Route revised to no longer service stop inside Sheridan College, insetad servicing layby on McLaughlin Road at Sheridan College Drive along with route 57.
20 Rathburn

  • Route revised to only operate between City Centre and Kipling Terminal, no longer providing service to Erindale GO. Route 20 will serve platform O at City Centre and loop via Duke of York and City Centre Drive.
  • Frequencies will remain similar as the current levels at most times, with the following exceptions: weekday late evening improved from 47 to 37 minutes, Saturday early AM frequency improved from 33 to 26 minutes, Saturday late evening improved from 33 to 28 minutes, Sunday all day improved from 38 to 30 minutes.
  • Due to shorter routing, 1 less bus in service during Weekday peak, midday, evening and Saturday daytime.
35 Eglinton

  • Sunday all day frequency improved from 35 to 28 minutes. 1 bus added to route
  • Weekday peak service rescheduled with 1 bus added to avoid loss of existing frequency.
38 Creditview/39 Britannia

  • To accomodate articulated buses on 39 Britannia, routes 38 and 39 will swap platforms at Meadowvale Town Centre.
44 Mississauga Road

  • New weekday trips from Meadowvale Town Centre at 745a and 922a; new weekday trips from UTM at 831a and 413p.
61 Mavis

  • Will be allocated additional articulated buses, reassigned due to route 66 service increase.
66 McLaughlin

  • Weekday frequency increases as follows: 15 to 10 minutes midday (+3 buses), 11 to 8 minutes PM peak (+3 buses). No changes to AM peak or evening frequencies. Some blocks will use 40 foot buses rather than articulated buses.


Route runtime changes - Several routes will have additional runtime added to improve reliability. In most cases, frequencies will decrease slightly to accommodate the additional runtime.

  • 1 Dundas (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 3 Bloor (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 10 Bristol‐Britannia (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 15 Drew (Weekday)
  • 18 McLaughlin‐Derry (Weekday)
  • 28 Confederation (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 34 Credit Valley (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 35 Eglinton (Weekday)
  • 42 Derry (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 43 Matheson‐Argentia (Weekday)
  • 45 Winston Churchill (Saturday, Sunday)
  • 48 Erin Mills (Weekday, Saturday, Sunday)
  • 57 Courtneypark (Weekday)
  • 66 McLaughlin (Weekday)
  • 71 Sheridan‐Subway (Weekday)
  • 87 Meadowvale‐Skymark (Weekday)
  • 90 Terragar‐Copenhagen Loop (Weekday)
  • 101 Dundas Express (Weekday)
Click to expand...

So many of the above are either very minor tweaks, literally adding a single run here or there........as to be truly disappointing.

A couple are decent improvements yet betray a poverty of service both before and after

The idea that Sunday service on Eglinton is 'improved' to 28 minutes .................what can one say?

But at least there's one clear winner in the bunch:

1700696195787.png
 
Northern Light said:
So many of the above are either very minor tweaks, literally adding a single run here or there........as to be truly disappointing.

A couple are decent improvements yet betray a poverty of service both before and after

The idea that Sunday service on Eglinton is 'improved' to 28 minutes .................what can one say?

But at least there's one clear winner in the bunch:

View attachment 522337
Click to expand...
There’s no outrage. There’s acceptance. One wonders why there was so much hate for the Kitchener Waterloo lrt service and silence on this thread.
 
sixrings said:
There’s no outrage. There’s acceptance. One wonders why there was so much hate for the Kitchener Waterloo lrt service and silence on this thread.
Click to expand...

Because the post is less than an hour old? LOL
 
Northern Light said:
So many of the above are either very minor tweaks, literally adding a single run here or there........as to be truly disappointing.

A couple are decent improvements yet betray a poverty of service both before and after

The idea that Sunday service on Eglinton is 'improved' to 28 minutes .................what can one say?

But at least there's one clear winner in the bunch:

View attachment 522337
Click to expand...
Until the 2024 budget is approve, the extra 42 driver and 7 other personnel can't be hire to increase the quality of service of an extra 4% that only takes us to 2018 level..

It will take a 3-6 months to hire and to train the new personal. Even then, staff is hamstrung until the 3rd garage is built that is 5+ years away to purchased another 100 buses to improve service. There is only 400 buses availably for service as the rest is part of the 20% spare ratio as well being service.

If one look at the 2024 budget, transit continue to be cut to the bone at 16% of the City budget down from 23% over 10 years ago.
 
sixrings said:
There’s no outrage. There’s acceptance. One wonders why there was so much hate for the Kitchener Waterloo lrt service and silence on this thread.
Click to expand...
You should talk to the folks in KW about the LRT and they will tell you it was built in the wrong place and ppl will not ride it because of the routing. I agree with them and have walked every foot of the line. No issues going LRT, but needs to be in the right place.

It has no place in this thread as KW and Mississauga are 2 different cities and systems.

Very few post in this thread as they don't live in the city, ride the system nor understand it in the first place as well the city layout.

Land use is an big issue for the city starting with council as they only see density in a few areas and anything over 4-6 story is not welcome along major roads to support transit in the first place.

This system started me on my 23 years of being a transit advocate which I thought was an simple complaint at the time and turn out to be a tip of an ice berg. Over the years, the ice berg gotten smaller, but the current budget is making it larger like the past 6 years one.

Staff can only do so much with their hands tie by council that service will remain an issue until the 3rd garage is built to house another 100+ buses on day one on top of the existing fleet. $500 hundred million or more is needed to build that garage and outfitted for ebuses 100% considering it was supposed to been built over 10 years ago. To take it a step further, the Malton garage needs to be enlarge to support 250 buses from its current 100 max to the point a new one should be also be built to replace it.

The idea of moving to articulated bus fleet is moving crush load to crush load as how do you add these buses if there is no more space other than reducing the fleet? At the same time, these buses only last 12 years compare to the 15 for 40's at hundreds thousand more than a 40.

Going green is great if the money is there and council got a ticker shock when prices were coming in for the 2019-2022/23 fleet request and more so for the 2024 order. The HEV cost $300,000 more for the 2019 order and it costing another $300,000 per bus for the new fleet. Going to ebuses will be around $600,000 more per bus not including retrofitting the current garages.
 
drum118 said:
You should talk to the folks in KW about the LRT and they will tell you it was built in the wrong place and ppl will not ride it because of the routing. I agree with them and have walked every foot of the line. No issues going LRT, but needs to be in the right place.

It has no place in this thread as KW and Mississauga are 2 different cities and systems.

Very few post in this thread as they don't live in the city, ride the system nor understand it in the first place as well the city layout.

Land use is an big issue for the city starting with council as they only see density in a few areas and anything over 4-6 story is not welcome along major roads to support transit in the first place.

This system started me on my 23 years of being a transit advocate which I thought was an simple complaint at the time and turn out to be a tip of an ice berg. Over the years, the ice berg gotten smaller, but the current budget is making it larger like the past 6 years one.

Staff can only do so much with their hands tie by council that service will remain an issue until the 3rd garage is built to house another 100+ buses on day one on top of the existing fleet. $500 hundred million or more is needed to build that garage and outfitted for ebuses 100% considering it was supposed to been built over 10 years ago. To take it a step further, the Malton garage needs to be enlarge to support 250 buses from its current 100 max to the point a new one should be also be built to replace it.

The idea of moving to articulated bus fleet is moving crush load to crush load as how do you add these buses if there is no more space other than reducing the fleet? At the same time, these buses only last 12 years compare to the 15 for 40's at hundreds thousand more than a 40.

Going green is great if the money is there and council got a ticker shock when prices were coming in for the 2019-2022/23 fleet request and more so for the 2024 order. The HEV cost $300,000 more for the 2019 order and it costing another $300,000 per bus for the new fleet. Going to ebuses will be around $600,000 more per bus not including retrofitting the current garages.
Click to expand...
Right route or not the significantly less populated KW LRT thread is alive and well with the idea that their night service being reduced to 30 mins each way is almost a human rights issue. Meanwhile that’s basically the daytime service here and the thread is as dead as I thought it was going to be.
 
sixrings said:
Right route or not the significantly less populated KW LRT thread is alive and well with the idea that their night service being reduced to 30 mins each way is almost a human rights issue. Meanwhile that’s basically the daytime service here and the thread is as dead as I thought it was going to be.
Click to expand...
What is there to be outraged about? MiWay is doing the most it can with existing staffing. Council has given MiWay has much as it asked for.

The discussion ("outrage") on the KW thread is about how to allocate existing service hours on the LRT (is better peak frequency worth the reduction in late night headway), not about (further) increasing total service hours.

Is MiWay allocating resources poorly?
 
The problem not only with miWay, but with other sectors of Mississauga departments, they all have been requested to reduced both operation and capital cost at budget level for 2024 below 2023 budget, At the same time, miWay budget has fallen from 23% to 16% or the last five or so years,

4% increase of service will not cut it as it only brings us up to 2019 level. I love how the number of new drivers and personal to be hire in 2024 has change as an 3rd set of numbers were used at today budget meeting, New staff is being hire to replace drivers who are retiring which mean very few drivers will increase the quality of service in 2024,

At the same time, staff hands are tie for putting buses on the road for service with the lack of drivers to operate 400 bus daily with the other 100+ as spare and being serviced. Lack of staff to maintain the fleet is under staff as well not train to work on the HEV fleet is a major issue. Staff storage is a major issues right across NA today that some system have cancel routes as well increased headway to match what staff they have at this time,

The systems needs the 3rd bus garage that was to be built over 10 years ago to take the pressure off CP as well free up space there along buying another 50-100 buses to service the city better. My recommendation today was that the city lease space for 10 years for the 3rd garage that will require deadhead cost to service buses at CP that is done daily so buses are ready for service the next day, This gives the city some breathing room to built the 3rd garage to be 100% ready for ebuses.

The model split has only gone from 11% to 15% in 20 year when we should have been at 20% in 2020 hand heading to 30% by 2030 and to 40-50% by 2040, if not sooner. The other issue, we will see another 200,000+ cars on the existing system by 2040 that will have more impact on transit that today mess.

A comment made by my ward councilor was to have the city make a request to the province to fund the operation cost of the LRT 100% like Toronto since there is no clear view as to what Brampton and Mississauga will have to pay for operation cost of the line today.

Talking to the GM today, getting a good feeling from her she is going to make a lot of changes that are long over due. She like my idea of riding the system to get a first hand view of the system as to drivers and issues on the various routes that she pans to do for a number of routes when she has the time. That is a lot more than the retired GM who only rode route 3 and 6 to work one day a week and don't know if he was still doing it this year before he retired.

The other recommendation I fail to make was either expanding the Malton garage for 200 buses in place of 100 if the land can support it or built an new one to house 250. This requires help from the Province and the Feds to do both garages.

Other funding help is needed to go green from the Province and the Feds as its not cheap buying HEV buses or ebuses. In the past, there was a cost different between years for buses been bought that vary from $50-$20,000 per bus. The cost different between an 2019 HEV and 2023/24 buses was $300,000 and another $100,000+ for the 2024 buses which are huge spreads. Going to ebuses will be around $400-$600,000 per bus and not cover the refit of the existing garages. I have recommend that charging station be at all bus terminals to top up the buses to keep them on the road for full service hours. Should note the HEV batteries only will be lasting 5-6 years at best at this time and a huge cost for them.

My comments on KW LRT will be in that thread as that where it should be in the first place
 
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