[nfitz]

I just don't see how one can not be thrilled with funding being cut to that. It's like christmas coming early or something.

I guess if your not in favour of public transit, then a funding cut to rapid transit in Toronto is a good thing. But if you are not in favour of public transit, then I don't know why you'd be here.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I guess if your not in favour of public transit, then a funding cut to rapid transit in Toronto is a good thing. But if you are not in favour of public transit, then I don't know why you'd be here.

I'd like a rapid transit line direct from my doorstep to my job please. If you are against funding this line than you are against public transit.

C'mon nfitz, such blanket statements only do a disservice to everyone. One can be pro public transit and question public transit decision making as well. We shouldn't be blindly accepting what the transit authorities, and politicians give us.

 

[GraphicMatt]

One cannot be pro-public transit and also really happy about a transit funding cut. It's just short-sighted. If there are elements of Transit City that you disagree with, push for change within the greater TC framework.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

One cannot be pro-public transit and also really happy about a transit funding cut. It's just short-sighted. If there are elements of Transit City that you disagree with, push for change within the greater TC framework.

Well if one believes that the entire plan, or portions of it, is flawed than one would be happy that said plan is not moving forward. Correct? Sure maybe Laz is being a little over zealous with his happines of the funding cut to TC, but he has openly questioned the plan (I haven't followed his posts enough to know if he's presented alternatives though).

To draw an analogy. Say a subway (or HRT) line were proposed for some insiginificant street (Christe, Kingsway, Pharmacy), an area that would be completely inappropriate for such a technology. If funding then got cut, should we not be pleased that such a mistake was stopped? Or should we continue to say "any transit is good transit"?

To say that nobody has been proposing changes absolutley ignores the pages and pages of threads on this board that discussed the TC plan and transit in general in the rest of the city. It has been discussed ad nauseum so don't act like nobody has spoken up.

 

[nfitz]

C'mon nfitz, such blanket statements only do a disservice to everyone. One can be pro public transit and question public transit decision making as well. We shouldn't be blindly accepting what the transit authorities, and politicians give us.

I don't see how your endorsement of the delay to the subway under Eglinton does a service to anyone.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I don't see how your endorsement of the delay to the subway under Eglinton does a service to anyone.

Yes I agree on that, it's a shame the Eglinton West subway was scrapped and the station filled in.

 

[nfitz]

Yes I agree on that, it's a shame the Eglinton West subway was scrapped and the station filled in.

How can you think that is a shame, but you celebrate the current Eglinton line being cancelled, even though it will give a subway section almost 3 times longer than that 4.5 km stubway?

 

[Dan416]

Nfitz likes to confuse things by using obtuse language.

Nfitz is referring to the Eglinton LRT as a "subway" simply because a portion of it is underground. Last I checked, in this century, "subway" refers to a certain type of transit mode that is 100% grade separated, whether it be below, at, or above grade. It might not be the original definition, but that's how most people use it now.

No one obfuscates like nfitz.

 

[nfitz]

Nfitz likes to confuse things by using obtuse language.

Nfitz is referring to the Eglinton LRT as a "subway" simply because a portion of it is underground. Last I checked, in this century, "subway" refers to a certain type of transit mode that is 100% grade separated, whether it be below, at, or above grade. It might not be the original definition, but that's how most people use it now.

No one obfuscates like nfitz.

I was quite clearly referring to the section of the Transit City LRT that is built in a subway tunnel. I believe that Woodbrige_Heights understood that and chose his words to play with them.

And while that is your understanding of the word subway, that certainly is not how it has been used in Toronto or the rest of the world. When we talked of the Queen subway back in the 1950s, it was of a line that was not 100% grade separated. And you only have to go to current-day Philadelphia to see subway lines that use streetcars, that operate both in a subway (and yes that is the word they use, even today) and on the surface in mixed traffic.

You know well that the only reason that TTC and Metrolinx are avoiding using the word subway for the Eglinton line is the situation that a subway requires a full individual EA, and an LRT line only requires a class EA.

 

[GenerationW]

How can you think that is a shame, but you celebrate the current Eglinton line being cancelled, even though it will give a subway section almost 3 times longer than that 4.5 km stubway?

Right! Just like how can anyone celebrate the Sheppard subway being neutered and doomed to being incomplete far into the future due to the Sheppard LRT, which will also add another transfer at Meadowvale (or wherever)?

You know well that the only reason that TTC and Metrolinx are avoiding using the word subway for the Eglinton line is the situation that a subway requires a full individual EA, and an LRT line only requires a class EA.

Then it's not a subway. And since the TTC isn't calling it one, it officially isn't.

Back to the video -- this P.R. exercise is nothing but a Giambrone goodbye F-U to Toronto. Thankfully this egomaniac's political career is a month away from being finished.

 

[nfitz]

Right! Just like how can anyone celebrate the Sheppard subway being neutered and doomed to being incomplete far into the future due to the Sheppard LRT, which will also add another transfer at Meadowvale (or wherever)?

If anyone was willing to build a subway east on Sheppard ... perhaps ... but it is so far down the priority list, it would never happen ... not past Victoria Park at least. Nothing precludes building a subway in the future, if the demand actually is there one day.

Then it's not a subway. And since the TTC isn't calling it one, it officially isn't.

Does it matter what TTC calls it? It's a Metrolinx project; the Chair of Metrolinx has called it a subway. People will call it a subway when it is operating. TTC already calls the Scarborough RT a subway ...

Back to the video -- this P.R. exercise is nothing but a Giambrone goodbye F-U to Toronto. Thankfully this egomaniac's political career is a month away from being finished.

Giambrone has accomplished a lot more in a single term as Chair than any Chair I can think of in recent memory. And the document is a great blueprint on where to take TTC for the next 5 years.

I doubt we've seen the last of Giambrone ... if he returns to politics, I expect we will see more of him. He has accomplished great things, and I am sure no one loves this city can deny that.

 

[Woodbridge_Heights]

I was quite clearly referring to the section of the Transit City LRT that is built in a subway tunnel. I believe that Woodbrige_Heights understood that and chose his words to play with them.

*Note to self. Use less sarcasm early in the week*

I am now where near celebrating the funding cut. I simply argued that if one felt that the project was a mistake than wouldn't cancellation of said project be welcomed by that person?

Were people happy when the Sheppard Subway was cut short and the Eglinton W subway cancelled?
Were people happy when the Island airport bridge was cancelled?
Were people happy when the SNC version of the ARL fell through?
Are people happy that we are going to have to way decades before Go becomes a true regional rail system because some people demand that such a system be electrified first?

Every one of these scenarios there was some segment of the population who felt that the project was a mistake and so, yes, they were happy to see it delayed/cancelled. So as I said in my original post. One can be pro-transit but also allow yourself to question decision making of transit agencies and politicians.

And while that is your understanding of the word subway, that certainly is not how it has been used in Toronto or the rest of the world. When we talked of the Queen subway back in the 1950s, it was of a line that was not 100% grade separated. And you only have to go to current-day Philadelphia to see subway lines that use streetcars, that operate both in a subway (and yes that is the word they use, even today) and on the surface in mixed traffic.

You know well that the only reason that TTC and Metrolinx are avoiding using the word subway for the Eglinton line is the situation that a subway requires a full individual EA, and an LRT line only requires a class EA.

So you're saying that Metrolinx/TTC also played fast and loose with their definitions then. Calling it a subway when talking to the public, but LRT when it comes to legal EA documents. If you believe it's a subway call it such don't confuse things by telling one group it's one thing and another it's something else.

 

[Juan_Lennon416]

Giambrone has accomplished a lot more in a single term as Chair than any Chair I can think of in recent memory

Giambrone was lucky enough to sit as TTC Chair when a Premier actually gave a damn about the TTC. The previous TTC chairs worked with Premiers that liked seeing TTC suffer. Seriously, how successful would Giambrone be if he was TTC Chair during the Harris & Eves Government?

 

[GenerationW]

Does it matter what TTC calls it? It's a Metrolinx project; the Chair of Metrolinx has called it a subway. People will call it a subway when it is operating. TTC already calls the Scarborough RT a subway ...

Of course it matters (unless the TTC is not to be believed), and both the TTC AND Metrolinx officially do not call Eglinton a subway project. That's far more relevant than an offhand comment by a chair trying to promote a project in a newspaper.

The TTC does not call Scarborough a subway. That is reserved for Y-U-S, B-D, and Sheppard.

If Eglinton is an LRT, there's no doubt most people will call the whole thing an LRT.

Giambrone has accomplished a lot more in a single term as Chair than any Chair I can think of in recent memory. And the document is a great blueprint on where to take TTC for the next 5 years.

It's a waste of money all for the glorification of his massive ego.

I doubt we've seen the last of Giambrone ... if he returns to politics, I expect we will see more of him. He has accomplished great things, and I am sure no one loves this city can deny that.

A few days into his scandal, I predicted on this site that his political career was destroyed forever. Nothing since then has changed my mind.

He'll not be missed by all but the easily fooled.

 

[nfitz]

The TTC does not call Scarborough a subway. That is reserved for Y-U-S, B-D, and Sheppard.

You haven't read the signage at some of the RT stations I see.

A few days into his scandal, I predicted on this site that his political career was destroyed forever. Nothing since then has changed my mind.

Given how minor Giambrone's cheating on his girlfriend was, compared to all the crimes that Rob Ford has done, and is still going ... cheating on a girlfriend and lying about it seems pretty minor compared to the DUI, drugs, abuse, fraud, and bribery and fraud that Ford has arrested, convicted of, and lied about.