[crs1026]

True - if the rails remain intact, the track circuit won't be broken. But anything that breaks the continuity of the rail will trip the signals.

Signalling Gravenhurst to North Bay would be at least $10M, probably twice that - I imagine we would see that cost in the business case if it were being considered.

- Paul

 

[lenaitch]

ONR did have an Automatic Block System on at least part of its territory but I have no idea when it went in or when it was abandoned. Regardless, it would have to be completely re-built to be of any use. There was no CTC for the original Northlander and I suspect there will be none for this version. If anything, they will probably settle for MOW patrols.

Edit: Looking at Pauls' post, installing it on only part of the route (the part they don't own) seems to make little sense.

 

[Krypto98]

OpenRailwayMap indicates there is a siding at Zephyr at present, so perhaps it is to be lengthened, or the switch type changed to a higher speed geometry.

I feel like moving pefferlaw(mp55) or extending smail (mp85) either southward or northward would also be a good option. Extending Zephyr southward to Queensville Sideroad would fit approximately 8800 feet (I'm talking about oversiding freight trains that currently only fit in Medora).

 

[lenaitch]

I feel like moving pefferlaw(mp55) or extending smail (mp85) either southward or northward would also be a good option. Extending Zephyr southward to Queensville Sideroad would fit approximately 8800 feet (I'm talking about oversiding freight trains that currently only fit in Medora).

The business case specifically mentions Zephyr.

 

[Krypto98]

The business case specifically mentions Zephyr.

I would probably extend it southwards rather than northwards has a bridge and crossing directly next to each other. The large oversiding sidings Medora and Brechin East on the Bala are maximum 25 mph while the other sidings are 10-15 mph sidings.

 

[micheal_can]

Why not just double track the Bala Sub south of Washago. Problem solved.

 

[crs1026]

Zephyr has two level crossings already, it's a fairly small 6500 feet. I would be moving the whole siding south of Queensville Side road where there is much more length without road crossings.

More likely, it will be the passenger train, and not the freights, that will be using the siding. And it's long enough already for that.

I do suspect that the mods are simply higher turnout speeds and maybe signalling the siding track - can't remember if the sidings on the Bala are even signalled.

- Paul

 

[Bordercollie]

I have been told it is Starlink. Who is providing the onboard wifi network is unknown.

Back in Ontera days, there was a plan to install transmit/receive points along the ROW. There is grid power to Moosonee that parallels much of the line.

ONTC was sold to Bell. There is likely a fibre optic cable that is laid along the line and it wouldn't take much for them to build a micro 5G network which they could resell. But most of the line is owned by CN so It won't be financially beneficial.

 

[lenaitch]

Why not just double track the Bala Sub south of Washago. Problem solved.

Really. For a handful of trains per week.

Zephyr has two level crossings already, it's a fairly small 6500 feet. I would be moving the whole siding south of Queensville Side road where there is much more length without road crossings.

More likely, it will be the passenger train, and not the freights, that will be using the siding. And it's long enough already for that.

I do suspect that the mods are simply higher turnout speeds and maybe signalling the siding track - can't remember if the sidings on the Bala are even signalled.

- Paul

Directly from the Updated Initial Business Case:

Rail Corridor Infrastructure​

​

The service will primarily operate on existing rail corridors that are owned and operated by Metrolinx, Ontario Northland or CN. These corridors are currently in use for existing passenger or freight rail services and are not anticipated to require significant upgrades. Minor upgrades to the corridor are proposed to allow for the operation of a safe and reliable service. The corridor infrastructure improvements proposed under each option are summarized below:​

​

• Reinstatement of track between the Newmarket Subdivision and North Bay station​

• Spot improvements of track to ensure the safety of the service, raise line speeds, and increase passenger comfort.​

• Minimal passing track construction at Zephyr (1.2 miles or 1.93 km)​

• Addition of handrails and walk-ways to bridge crossings for passenger safety in cases of emergency stops.​

ONTC was sold to Bell. There is likely a fibre optic cable that is laid along the line and it wouldn't take much for them to build a micro 5G network which they could resell. But most of the line is owned by CN so It won't be financially beneficial.

Ontera was sold to Bell Aliant (closer to 'given away'). ONTC very much still exists.

They spent millions to lay fibre along most of their mainline - just before Ontera was divested. They no longer own it. ONTC will not be getting back into the telecom business.

 

[micheal_can]

Really. For a handful of trains per week.

I am not thinking of the additional service. I am thinking of existing service.

 

[lenaitch]

I am not thinking of the additional service. I am thinking of existing service.

Seeing as the existing service is freight only with a few VIA trains per week, how does that fit into this thread topic?

What "problem" is solved? Is VIA experiencing massive delays south of Washago? Did the former Northlander experience significant delays south of Washago?

The Ontario government's business case says they will do minor track upgrades. Period.

If we want to kill this proposed service, let's make it as expensive as possible.

 

[micheal_can]

Seeing as the existing service is freight only with a few VIA trains per week, how does that fit into this thread topic?

What "problem" is solved? Is VIA experiencing massive delays south of Washago? Did the former Northlander experience significant delays south of Washago?

The Ontario government's business case says they will do minor track upgrades. Period.

If we want to kill this proposed service, let's make it as expensive as possible.

I don't see how adding a small siding that cannot fit the typical freight train is going to help the Northlander be anymore successful.

 

[lenaitch]

I don't see how adding a small siding that cannot fit the typical freight train is going to help the Northlander be anymore successful.

Beats me, but maybe the actual planners do. Spending multiple millions to double track a large stretch of subdivision is unrealistic.

 

[smallspy]

I don't see how adding a small siding that cannot fit the typical freight train is going to help the Northlander be anymore successful.

Because they are not adding a small siding. They are extending an existing one to make it more useful.

Dan

 

[micheal_can]

Because they are not adding a small siding. They are extending an existing one to make it more useful.

Dan

Will it fit oversiding trains? Cus if not, it isn't that useful.