[Hank]

This could be a really good conversation, and I hope this thread remains vibrant.



Most of Kingston's heavy industry closed a while back (Alcan, Northern Telecom, plus cutbacks at DuPont/Invista) and a lot of the employment has long been based on the institutions (Ontario government decentralized offices, the hospitals, Queen's, RMC, St. Lawrence College, Canadian Forces, Corrections Canada, most of which are going anywhere, Kingston Pen closure notwithstanding). Plus there's always more students than ever. Regional tourism hasn't been especially hit either, since much of it is regional, rather than international. Or maybe I'm missing something.

The city does have a very nice diversity of restaurants and bars and still has good retail. But I was looking at Streetview just now of Princess Street (April 2012) and yeah, there are quite a few vacancies.

Perhaps rents have gone up? It's too bad Indigo pulled out but mostly because of its anchor status and the fact that it likely made downtown lose an independent bookstore back in the 1990s. (I'm not a fan of Indigo or Heather Reisman.)

Funny, I just checked it out on streetview as well after you mentioned that, and I'd say it looked a fair bit worse when I was there recently than it even does in those pictures. I usually go down every year or two for a weekend in the summer just to stroll around, and I don't remember thinking that it looked any worse until this most recent visit. The games store is still there, thankfully, as are more of the restaurants and stores that I actually remember visiting before (although Turk's was closed down...that place was always fun to explore).

 

[UserNameToronto]

I guess they're thinking of more "quaint" smaller places. Have not yet been to Perth or Paris.

Paris' downtown is quite special. Lovely Victorian (perhaps Georgian?) terraces and the shops seem to be doing well too. The main commercial area is unique, intact, and charming: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paris,_Ontario

The original list seems to have a typo though: Paris was settled in 1829, not 1929.

 

[nrb]

The list is somewhat accurate but I think quite boring.. in terms of interesting retail and nightlife in small town ontario I'd have to give Peterborough my vote. Much more active downtown than most of these on this list with some very nice old buildings mixed in with interesting small scale modernist building that you don't find in many small towns thanks to Eb Zeidler. For historic value, it's hard to beat as a downtown that people actually still use as a downtown like they would before the car. Many of the bars date back to the turn of the century and are still operating.

I find cobourg, stratford and kingston's downtowns are very tourist oriented and lack livability. Kingston's nightlife is oriented around queens and not downtown. Overall I feel this is a list my grandmother would love..

 

[christiesplits]

I would put Brockville on the list. I was amazed by the quality and quantity of heritage buildings in downtown.

 

[W. K. Lis]

How about old downtowns that got adsorbed into surrounding cities. The former city of West Toronto had its downtown near Keele Street and Dundas Street West. Streetsville had a good downtown, until Streetsville Plaza came around and wrecked it, as well as becoming part of Mississauga (better downtown than Square One and surroundings).

 

[ShonTron]

The list is somewhat accurate but I think quite boring.. in terms of interesting retail and nightlife in small town ontario I'd have to give Peterborough my vote. Much more active downtown than most of these on this list with some very nice old buildings mixed in with interesting small scale modernist building that you don't find in many small towns thanks to Eb Zeidler. For historic value, it's hard to beat as a downtown that people actually still use as a downtown like they would before the car. Many of the bars date back to the turn of the century and are still operating.

Peterborough has a decent downtown, true and more vibrant than those of other cities its size. It was ruined a bit thanks to the Peterborough Square development, which was one of several misguided downtown redevelopments in struggling downtowns in a partnership between Eaton's and the Ontario and muncipal governments. Of course Eaton's is long gone and much of the 1980s mall is vacant.

I'd compare it with Guelph, which has maintained a decent downtown despite malls and big-boxes in the suburbs. It helps that a university is close by and downtown has remained the important transportation centre.

I find cobourg, stratford and kingston's downtowns are very tourist oriented and lack livability. Kingston's nightlife is oriented around queens and not downtown. Overall I feel this is a list my grandmother would love..

Still, there are plenty of major chain stores that opt to be on Princess Street, and I still think all three above serve local functions well while also attracting tourists. Niagara-on-the-Lake is one downtown that certainly does not serve the first function all that well yet is charming and vibrant from May to October (and around Christmas/New Year's).

 

[MisterF]

I agree that although it's not a picture postcard downtown like others on this list, Peterborough's downtown has dimensions that are missing in smaller towns like Cobourg. I've lived in both and Cobourg's 3 bars and 4 restaurants get old fast (I'm only slightly exaggerating). Peterborough Square did some damage but not as much as a lot of other downtown malls. No surface parking, no skywalks, and a genuine attempt to fit into the existing streetscape. Plus the fact that the mall is dead doesn't seem to have affected the surrounding downtown. It could have been worse.

One thing Peterborough has that's almost unique in Ontario - a large downtown cinema. Not even Ottawa has that.

Also agree that even our best downtowns pale in comparison to run of the mill towns all over Europe. It's a shame.

 

[Copper1212]

Only 4 restaurants in downtown Cobourg is more than a slight exaggeration. I can think of 10-15+ downtown depending on your definition. And no I'm not counting something like a Subway, Pizza Pizza, etc. Maybe you haven't lived here in awhile.

 

[jamincan]

I don't think Owen Sound will win any awards with it's downtown; it's certainly not as picturesque as many of the others on this list. It is definitely very well used by the population though, something I was very impressed by when I was there for a short time.

 

[FrancescoIgnagn]

New-market's Old Town Hall

 

[Hipster Duck]

I agree that although it's not a picture postcard downtown like others on this list, Peterborough's downtown has dimensions that are missing in smaller towns like Cobourg. I've lived in both and Cobourg's 3 bars and 4 restaurants get old fast (I'm only slightly exaggerating). Peterborough Square did some damage but not as much as a lot of other downtown malls. No surface parking, no skywalks, and a genuine attempt to fit into the existing streetscape. Plus the fact that the mall is dead doesn't seem to have affected the surrounding downtown. It could have been worse.

One thing Peterborough has that's almost unique in Ontario - a large downtown cinema. Not even Ottawa has that.

Also agree that even our best downtowns pale in comparison to run of the mill towns all over Europe. It's a shame.

Agreed. Not to make us sound like homers, but Peterborough really does have the best all-around downtown for a city of its size. Maybe my hometown pride causes me to exaggerate, but the type of stores and architecture in downtown Peterborough make it feel like a mini Ossington Ave. or Brooklyn. It also helps that downtown Peterborough spans multiple commercial streets.

Kingston is equally good, although it is a bit larger than Peterborough and has the luck of a bigger, more central university and a longer history.

Stratford is great. If only they would convert the parking lot of their market square into a public square (like Kingston did), it would almost feel like a Flemish town.

 

[gabe]

I will add Guelph the quirky-hippy town to the list. They have done a fabulous job rejuvenating their downtown the last 5 to 10 years. They may not have a large theatre downtown but they do have a small indie theatre that has been operating for over 20 years. When it comes to food. Guelph's downtown has some hidden gems, It's not just pretentious coffee shops and university bars. The past few years they added some Italian and French bistros into the mix, and they still got a few old English pubs that been around as long as i can remember. Guelph is a great day trip from Toronto during the summer months.
Guelph and nearby Fergus/Elora have so many impressive stone facades downtown.

 

[innsertnamehere]

To ShonTron: I find Port Perry to be much nicer than Lindsay. Lindsay is larger but the lack of a waterfront and the relatively rundown storefronts sort of ruin it. Port Perry has some interesting stores, a beautiful waterfront, and a grocery store. mind you its very small, essentially only one or two blocks.


What towns have down-town cinemas? I can only think of Uxbridge and Peterborough. (mind you I haven't been to a large portion of Ontario Towns)


I found Peterborough to be underwhelming last time I was there. (Admittingly it was night and I was driving in from lindsay to see a movie, and only briefly got a look at the town) I found Kingston to be much nicer.

heres a question: what town has the worst downtown? I nominate Stouffville, I find it an extremely unattractive and underused downtown.

 

[ShonTron]

What towns have down-town cinemas? I can only think of Uxbridge and Peterborough. (mind you I haven't been to a large portion of Ontario Towns)

Picton does (the Regent), Woodstock (Gallery Cinemas). In larger cities, London (Rainbow), Hamilton has a discount cinema in Jackson Square.

heres a question: what town has the worst downtown? I nominate Stouffville, I find it an extremely unattractive and underused downtown.

Stouffville isn't that bad, especially for a bedroom community with big boxes on the periphery. It certainly isn't the most unattractive. Stouffville has a few good bars and restaurants and the GO Station.

Brantford's is bad (the long neglected and then clearcut Colborne Block), Welland's is worse (except a few attractive civic buildings). Niagara Falls, Ontario.

Belleville's downtown is somewhat attractive, but doesn't have anything to draw you there.

 

[innsertnamehere]

Brantford isn't horrid, it's improved a lot in the last couple of years. Ripping down that block is bad no matter what way you put it though.