[junctionist]

Indeed, in this case it's just a matter of design rather than density or pedestrian friendliness, given the size and location of the development. It's certainly not more urban, though there's potential, and not less. Actually, looking closer at that laneway, I have say that it is unusually wide, and the driveways to the garages are hardly needed either.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

How can something already not urban become less urban?

I had a friend who lived in a New Urbanist-ish development in Markham with garages in the back and after about two years of living there, I don't think she had even seen one of her immediate neighbours in the flesh, let alone had any kind of even the most banal neighbourly acquaintance with them. When a development is otherwise exactly the same and the only change is moving garages to back alleys, the fronts of the houses and the front yards become sterile showpieces and neighbourly interaction is substantially curtailed. Houses on the west side of Vessel Crescent must front onto an almost continuous width of driveways and the garages of the Port Union houses, only the garages are staggered, making them atypically oppressive.

 

[flar]

I don't think this is very urban.

For me, the number one thing that makes a neighbourhood urban is walkability. For one thing, there has to be somewhere to walk to. Is there a restaurant or a store close by? It has to be easy to get from point A to point B: no detours around fences, no dead ends and winding roads. In an urban neighbourhood you can walk 2km and it doesn't seem like you've walked that far.

Sorry to continue with negatives, but do actual architects design these things? Because many of these houses are just ugly. Unbroken siding on pillars, what?

 

[jswag]

To answer your question flar, there is a plaza at the corner of Pt. Union and Lawrence. Easily accessible with pretty much everything you need but a grocery store: a coffee shop, convenience store, bank, regular fast food joints, a japanese place, a clinic, a video rental store, a beer store AND an LCBO. The grocery store is further up Port Union at Lawson, not a bad bike ride but a bad walk.

And I'm not sure that any architect would be proud of how these turned out... they are probably watered down from their original design. I think as time goes on though, you will see people changing a lot of these facades (especially the unbroken siding on pillars, which I agree is offensive). In fact when I was taking photos someone was already planting a garden in their front yard and doing some painting.

Also, I believe they will be planting trees in the future, which will definitely soften the blow of some of these homes. With regards to the laneway, I have a question for someone who may know more than I do. Are laneways even allowed to be any smaller than the one shown above? I have a feeling fire regulations have taken over new developments with regards to street width, etc. I had heard that this is why cul-de-sacs are made so large, because the fire department wanted to be able to turn around easily.

Ideally there would have been some retail at the foot of Port Union but "traffic" is the ultimate evil out here and it would have been a tough sell.

I'm not defending these homes by any means, but living out here you get kind of jaded-- this is a small step up.

 

[Tewder]

Actually, that picture shows a fairly nicely scaled 'urban' feeling to the street which will likely be even nicer when it is more mature. I also fail to see how you could avoid contact with your neighbours in that setting, except from the point of view that even in the most urban of Toronto settings you could live for 100 years without even knowing the name of their neighbour...

 

[junctionist]

How can something already not urban become less urban?

Even suburban developments are urban to a degree, since traditional vocabulary has meant an urban/rural dichotomy. Sure, on this board this isn't urban, but it's not called "urban sprawl" without reason. Conceptualizing it through the urban/rural dichotomy, you get a reality that what's considered "urban" around here is what's very urban, and "suburban" is less urban. That's because what's considered "suburban" is fluid and relative, while the difference between urban/rural is more concrete.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

Even suburban developments are urban to a degree, since traditional vocabulary has meant an urban/rural dichotomy. Sure, on this board this isn't urban, but it's not called "urban sprawl" without reason. Conceptualizing it through the urban/rural dichotomy, you get a reality that what's considered "urban" around here is what's very urban, and "suburban" is less urban. That's because what's considered "suburban" is fluid and relative, while the difference between urban/rural is more concrete.

Yes, I know that.

What I originally said was that this development was not urban and that banishing garages to the back alley just makes it needlessly desolate, too. Taal thought I was saying the lack of cars in the front makes it less urban, but I wasn't. It's just as suburban as everything else in Scarborough.

 

[taal]

I'm not sure ... it seems better then the typical new subdivisions ... like you have going all over Newmarket and the like!

 

[taal]

Hey scarberiankhatru,

Do me a favour have a look at post #89 in the "this is your city thread"

Garages at back in some of them. I think the urban classification really stems from density and that's it for the most part. One more thing, small streets!

Yes, I know that.

What I originally said was that this development was not urban and that banishing garages to the back alley just makes it needlessly desolate, too. Taal thought I was saying the lack of cars in the front makes it less urban, but I wasn't. It's just as suburban as everything else in Scarborough.

 

[adma]

I think as time goes on though, you will see people changing a lot of these facades (especially the unbroken siding on pillars, which I agree is offensive).

Actually, to me the "unbroken siding on pillars" registers more as a remnant 70s/80s Postmodern gesture: trickle-down Venturian dumb-and-ordinariness...