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Euphoria
Active Member
I don't dispute the potential of the Spit. It wouldn't take much intervention to improve the experience for cyclists and pedestrians, but the observable broken concrete and rebar really detracts from this notion of the Spit as a place of naturalization and raw beauty, and evokes gangster body dumping and industrial toxic effluent. It's always approaching this stretch of the marathon that I start to lose steam because of the incessantly forlorn streets and paths. In terms of a last available bastion of open land that could give us that large-scale park close to the downtown and watercourses, this is it, but it needs major remediation. Yes, the stalwart urban explorers, bird watchers, and fitness freaks will see beauty in the herons, terns, reeds, empty peninsula, etc., but I'm not bringing visitors to the city or my grandma within a mile of that wasteland.
aquateam
Active Member
What kind of uses of the ravines do you think is inappropriate? How would you like to see them improved?
Just curious. For the PanAm games I heard about the "Pan Am Path" through some ravines but I'm not sure what was done for that and if it was a major improvement.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
DVP for one. Rail and hydro corridor another. The way it was used basically isolated the space even more and made integration difficult - not to say anything about disruption to the ecology.
As to how - that's the billion dollar question - it's patently impossible to move the uses out of the space, even attempts to reduce the footprints are barely on the radar due to feasibility and cost. We're stuck with incremental improvements around the edges.
AoD
rbt
Senior Member
Yeah. I agree. Physical distances are different.
You get the point I'm saying don't you? That most people don't typically walk long distances now? So physical distances are a little more flexible than they were in 1850?
I'm trying (poorly apparently) to say that Rouge Park is actually much more accessible to the the population of Toronto at the time it was designated a park than Central Park was to New Yorkers at the time Central Park was officially made a park. The same applies to Downsview Park too.
You didn't simply visit Central Park on your way to work in 1850. It took a couple hours to get there and a couple more to get home.
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Tulse
Senior Member
Although arguably anything that makes the ravines more "integrated", if you mean allowing access to more people, adds to the disruption of the ecology. (And as much as I visually don't like a hydro corridor in the ravines, they are relatively benign to the environment there.)
old boy
Senior Member
As for " the disruption of the ecology ", invasive species such as Norway Maple and Dog Strangling Vine, to name just two of the most obvious examples have made increasingly large inroads into the ecology of the ravines, crowding out native species, and threatening fauna that depend upon them This is a man-made degradation just as much as the found industrial litter. It's been said that once we become aware of the invasives, it's already too late. It's not all doom and gloom however as there are many performing stewardship in the ravines. And , The City of Toronto appears to be listening at last.
leopetr
Active Member
They put in some missing links in the Humber trail as well as along Queen's Quay and in Scarborough. I'm not sure whether the Eglinton side of the road trail was part of it, but it may have been. Some necessary things that were planned for it still haven't been built, like a proper connection between the Don trail and the Gatineau hydro corridor trail.
Unfortunately, I can't find any maps distinguishing what was built specifically for the PanAm Path from what already existed. Here's a map of the path:
http://panampath.org/downloads/Toronto_PanAm_Line.pdf
Northern Light
Superstar
On invasives, one good piece of news may be in the offing. Tests are underway near Ottawa on introducing the moth that eats Dog Strangling Vine in its native habitat. (Eastern Europe)
Obviously bio-measures can be quite dangerous, however a similar move was made to contain purple loostrife a few years ago and seems to have been broadly successful.
And extensive testing has been done to confirm that the moth will only eat DSV.
The trials underway are to establish effectiveness, range and over-wintering of the moths.
http://bcinvasives.ca/news-events/r...ses-moth-to-eat-invasive-dog-strangling-vine/
Northern Light
Superstar
The East Don River to Gatineau Corridor trail connection has its EA conclude just over a year ago.
Subject to budget, I believe that portion of the trail is due for construction next year.
Northern Light
Superstar
In terms of what is being done; The Gatineau Corridor from the Rouge to the Don is funded for naturalization with low colonizing shrubs and native wildflowers. A portion of this, east of McCowan Road has already been completed.
The species choice specifically allows for once or twice annual mowing to prevent large trees from bothering Hydro One's pylons, while simultaneously benefiting local the local ecology and saving on more routine mowing costs.
Burying the corridor is perfectly feasible, but prohibitively expensive. However, universal conversion to the more modern streamlined pylons should allow for some large trees in newly created openings.
**
I'm afraid the DVP will be with us for some time to come; however, as move towards hybrid and electric vehicles impacts from air and noise pollution will decline materially.
There is room for more than incremental improvement in many spaces, but it requires public engagement, and political and bureaucratic will.
As an example, several of the privately owned golf courses, including Flemingdon and Donalda sit partially on publicly owned lands; these could be reclaimed and result in massive natural heritage restoration that would be of substantial value, instead of contributing (arguably subsidizing) a comparative few.
steveintoronto
Superstar
Ahead by a century...
steveintoronto
Superstar
Central Park and how it came to be: It was outcropping of Scheist, (lol! Typo...*Schist*!) they couldn't build high-rise on it, Manhattan is far from being an homogeneous soil strata. The lower part of the island had soil depth, and allowed the skyscapers to be built. It also heavily impacted tunneling...
Btw folks, NYC is light years ahead of Toronto in many facets of parks and close by wild life areas. We do OK, but we could do a hell of a lot better...NYC has some incredible areas up the Hudson to cycle, hike and camp.
I just got in from doing another near 100km trail jaunt, believe me, I'm very aware of the difficulties of getting in and out of this city to areas to cycle. London spoiled me in that regard, some 18 rail lines out to areas to cycle, many on the Oyster Card (no extra charge beyond the outer fare zones)....
Don't get me started...many US cities, let alone European ones, are 'ahead by a century' on mixing bikes with distance...not to overlook some Aussie cities, all with incredible rail systems.
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steveintoronto
Superstar
I'd missed that! Just looked it up:
https://trca.ca/conservation/green-infrastructure/east-don-trail-environmental-assessment/
Another link that ostensibly is 'in the works' is to connect the water-edge trail from the Rouge River through to Bluffers Park, there's a segment missing below Guild Park.
Coming into the city down White's Rd from just south of Steele's used to be an excellent way in, did it coming down from Cannington (via Uxbridge) a few days back, and White's has become dangerously busy since last doing it almost a decade back, looking for an alternative, but Petticoat Creek Park very bicycle friendly and an excellent segue to attaining the Rouge.
There's quite a few corridors that could be linked to make cycling in and out of the city to much farther destinations possible. The Humber West Trail is an example of that, albeit not too sure of how far Brampton has extended their connections to it. Getting caught in Brampton and/or Whitby can be a real nightmare when you want to be beyond them. GO is excellent for that, but it shouldn't have to be that way.
muller877
Senior Member
I could not find the rental agreements for these golf courses so I will take it at face value. And fyi...there are 10 privately owned golf courses most who own their land. There are 9 publically owned golf courses (city, TRCA, etc).
Golf courses provide another outdoor activity for citizens. I don't understand the dislike of it by the narrow minded politicians in the city.
Golf courses provide green spaces for animals. Not totally natural but a lot better than any other privately owned use of land. Golf courses need a certain amount of land to be viable. If you eliminate one hole on a golf course, the entire course shuts down. And then what? The course is sold to a private developer and the land not on floodplain will be converted to condos.
So you've "saved" 20 acres or so that is currently in grass to pave over the other 100 acres. Smart move.