[AlvinofDiaspar]

The section east of Jarvis. It's going to be two lanes in each direction instead of the current four.

Anyways, I know I'm not going to get through to you, but Barcelona has two freeways around their city core - one on each side. That's why it's acceptable for those freeways to have a smaller footprint. Toronto planned a freeway on the north side of downtown but it was never built.

B-20 is literally at the periphery of the city - and let's not forget the differential in urban density either. And where did you get the impression the Gardiner east of Jarvis will be narrowed to four lanes instead of 2?

AoD

 

[innsertnamehere]

^every document about the Gardiner East? I thought it was fairly well known on these boards that the Gardiner is going to be reduced significantly in scale in its rebuild. The existing 8 lane configuration is because the scarborough expressway was supposed to connect into and result in much higher traffic levels, this obviously never happened so 8 lanes is way overkill. AADT is 120,000, which is more so on the upper range of 4 lanes.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The section east of Jarvis. It's going to be two lanes in each direction instead of the current four.

Anyways, I know I'm not going to get through to you, but Barcelona has two freeways around their city core - one on each side. That's why it's acceptable for those freeways to have a smaller footprint. Toronto planned a freeway on the north side of downtown but it was never built.

Are you talking about the Crosstown Expressway?

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

^every document about the Gardiner East? I thought it was fairly well known on these boards that the Gardiner is going to be reduced significantly in scale in its rebuild. The existing 8 lane configuration is because the scarborough expressway was supposed to connect into and result in much higher traffic levels, this obviously never happened so 8 lanes is way overkill. AADT is 120,000, which is more so on the upper range of 4 lanes.

The lane reduction wasn't communicated in the EA - if it is that well known, it should be easy to cite.

From the EA Final Report, Chapter 5 Design Alternatives

http://www.gardinereast.ca/sites/default/files//documents/Gardiner EA Report - CH 5 FINAL.pdf

AoD

 

[TheTigerMaster]

The lane reduction wasn't communicated in the EA - if it is that well known, it should be easy to cite.

From the EA Final Report, Chapter 5 Design Alternatives

http://www.gardinereast.ca/sites/default/files//documents/Gardiner EA Report - CH 5 FINAL.pdf

View attachment 118764

View attachment 118765

AoD

http://www.gardinereast.ca/sites/de... EA Report - CH 4 FINAL April 2017 update.pdf

You can see a diagram of the two-lane configuration on Page 26 (4-23)

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

http://www.gardinereast.ca/sites/default/files//documents/Gardiner EA Report - CH 4 FINAL April 2017 update.pdf

You can see a diagram of the two-lane configuration on Page 26 (4-23)

That's replace - which isn't the option selected by council. And I don't think we selected "improve" either in the first four choices (maintain/improve/rebuild/remove) offered in the original EA. What council have chosen is basically maintain plus hybrid east of Cherry. Section 4.4.3.2 Hybrid Alternative (p. 96) offers no indication of changes west of Cherry either.

AoD

 

[darth_freeman]

Hmmmm...so do we actually know what Gardiner East Hybrid means? Or is it still up to future council decisions/reports?

Anyways, a 4 lane European freeway is really equivalent to a North American 6 lane freeway, given Euro's propensity for public transit, trains, etc.

 

[Tuscani01]

It is my understanding also that the replacement Gardiner is going to be 4 lanes (2+2). The replacement option is the one council went with. "Hybrid", which is now the option is really just the replacement option re-aligned. Ie. Hybrid 2.0.

 

[Tuscani01]

Also, the DVP south of Eastern, narrows to 4 lanes (save for the lane that opens up Southbound as an off-ramp to lakeshore, and the on-ramp/merge lane from lakeshore to the Northbound DVP)

They would need to widen the DVP to 3 lanes each way in this section, or have a merge lane on the new ramp to/from the Gardiner to DVP, which would make no sense.

 

[44 North]

Maybe it's to be 2+2, but designed to be expandable at a later date? Somewhat related, but wonder if there's public realm merit by having the entire elevated section east of Jarvis become two separate sections instead of one. In other words have a narrow open gap between the e/b and w/b sections. This would allow more light to reach below.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

It is my understanding also that the replacement Gardiner is going to be 4 lanes (2+2). The replacement option is the one council went with. "Hybrid", which is now the option is really just the replacement option re-aligned. Ie. Hybrid 2.0.

Council did not go with replace. Hybrid is basically just the section between Cherry and DVP. As much as I would like to, I can't find a single reference to a change to 2/2 in any reports.

AoD

 

[Tuscani01]

I did a quick google search and found this on the EA website showing only 2 lanes each way.

http://www.gardinereast.ca/sites/default/files//documents/Appendix T - Construction Staging Report 2016-09-27_0.pdf

I also remember seeing renderings from meetings showing only 2 lanes in each direction.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

I did a quick google search and found this on the EA website showing only 2 lanes each way.
I also remember seeing renderings from meetings showing only 2 lanes in each direction.

I have seen that too - the ramp from DVP to Gardiner is two lane - it's silent on the section past Cherry. Plus this still have to accommodate ramps to/from Lakeshore.

AoD

 

[W. K. Lis]

I have seen that too - the ramp from DVP to Gardiner is two lane - it's silent on the section past Cherry. Plus this still have to accommodate ramps to/from Lakeshore.

AoD

...and breakdown lanes. Something that was missing when the original elevated Gardiner was built.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

From the WT May DRP:

https://waterfrontoronto.ca/nbe/wcm...GardinerPublicRealmDRP_May_WM.pdf?MOD=AJPERES

AoD