[FraudNation]

Did I read here that Robbie, Flarehty and Harper were on a (literal) fishing trip in the last few years? Would it be possible for RoF to not indulge in a few lines? If he didn't, it would be an "itchy weekend" as Woodhouse says...

Also, could RoF have actually behaved? Or would he have been doing naked drunken cannonballs off the dock after passing the mirror/pipe around?

 

[euler]

I am not sure why people are being so deferential to JF. Yes, he has passed on, but he left Canada a much worse place than he found it.

He gave us TFSAs. He's cool in my books.

 

[W. K. Lis]

I think the problem with people who want to run for Mayor without experience in either politics or industry, is that they're seen as wanting to jump the queue and achieve the highest elected office possible (outside of party politics) without putting in the work and paying their dues as, say, a Councillor. It sort of smells of hubris and irrationality, and I think it's pretty natural that people are unwilling to toss their support behind people who want to go from zero to Mayor overnight.

With 52+ candidates for Mayor, and only 1 (incumbent) for Councillor in my ward, so far, guess who could be a winner? Not 51.

 

[BurlOak]

He gave us TFSAs. He's cool in my books.

Also RDSP's.

 

[BurlOak]

I am not sure why people are being so deferential to JF. Yes, he has passed on, but he left Canada a much worse place than he found it.

In inflation-adjusted terms, Canada’s economy has outperformed the G-7 average in all but one year under Flaherty.

Canada’s economy grew 56 percent in U.S. dollar terms between 2005 and 2012, equal to $655 billion in additional annual production, compared with an average 28 percent among 35 advanced economies tracked by the International Monetary Fund, and 23 percent for the other six G-7 countries.

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-...fiscal-conservatism-with-mischievousness.html

For those with no concept of Canada's position in the world and the events of the past 7 years - maybe Flaherty was not a star. But to others, be did a very good job.

 

[Silence&Motion]

There is a small silver lining to this ridiculous decision - it seems to be recruiting people to the RFMG camp. From the comments on that article:

"...This is a hand-over-fist cash grab, with corrupt politicians backing it all the way. If I was neutral on Rob Ford and his cronies before (hey,we all a few skeletons in our closet) I'm STRONGLY opposed to them now."

"...This should be looked into and reversed as anyone with an iq over 50 can see it for what it is, complete BS.Quite frankly my support for this admin just dropped 25% [...]"

This makes me so sick. It's much worse that the mayor smoking crack. From Doug Ford's waterfront plan, to the garbage contract, to the secret meetings with developers over the Sheppard Subway, the Ford brothers have stunk of crony capitalism ever since they came into office. I wish that right-wing "anti-government" politicians would actually have the guts to be consistent in their ideology (not that the Fords have the mental capacity to hold anything that we would consider an ideology). They want the government out of people's lives, except when it means fixing the market to benefit their wealthy donors.

This is a perfect example of why Ford's sleazy "personal" life is influencing his public role as mayor. How many free drinks and other benefits has Starkovski given to Ford outside the thousands of dollars that his family has donated to the 2010 campaign?

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

This makes me so sick. It's much worse that the mayor smoking crack. From Doug Ford's waterfront plan, to the garbage contract, to the secret meetings with developers over the Sheppard Subway, the Ford brothers have stunk of crony capitalism ever since they came into office. I wish that right-wing "anti-government" politicians would actually have the guts to be consistent in their ideology (not that the Fords have the mental capacity to hold anything that we would consider an ideology). They want the government out of people's lives, except when it means fixing the market to benefit their wealthy donors.

This is a perfect example of why Ford's sleazy "personal" life is influencing his public role as mayor. How many free drinks and other benefits has Starkovski given to Ford outside the thousands of dollars that his family has donated to the 2010 campaign?

Yeah, but when the Fords do it, it's OK because their friends are all stand-up guys. ;-)

If the Muzik stuff is what takes the shine off Ford for his followers, I'm all for it. But... REALLY??? THAT'S what gets you all hot & bothered about this Mayor? Not the insane transit non-policy? The interference in the Portlands? The crack smoking at the office? What bugs Ford-ites is 'but where will the kids be able to hold their raves'?? This is why I am fascinated by politics. I can NEVER predict what will be a hot-button issue, particularly in Toronto.

 

[anne]

I think the problem with people who want to run for Mayor without experience in either politics or industry, is that they're seen as wanting to jump the queue and achieve the highest elected office possible (outside of party politics) without putting in the work and paying their dues as, say, a Councillor. It sort of smells of hubris and irrationality, and I think it's pretty natural that people are unwilling to toss their support behind people who want to go from zero to Mayor overnight.

Or..
People could learn to put their per-conceived ideas aside just long enough to learn about each candidate. Sometimes these people are dedicated citizens who get tired of hearing about corruption and political favours and think (as TOborn did) that a lack of political experience would be considered an asset for voters who are equally fed up with cronyism.

In smaller towns, it's not uncommon for people to run for Mayor without council experience. Plenty of people have done it and won. Some of them are housewives, small business owners or construction workers. There is a larger cross-section of the population in general in small town government. It's not any less dysfunctional. There is still corruption, but since voters have to choose from a pool of council members who they may already despise, or untested new candidates, often they go for the new person.

As a society, do you not think that we have got to stop assuming that people are less worthy if they don't come from specific jobs (i.e. "industry") and just learn to examine each candidate on their own merit based on the ideas and energy they bring? Based on what I've seen of this council, there isn't one who stands out in my mind as someone who would make a great future mayor.

 

[euler]

As a society, do you not think that we have got to stop assuming that people are less worthy if they don't come from specific jobs.

Dude(ette), "what do you do?" is literally the most commonly asked question in Toronto. Hung out last night with a few people and this one girl from California, and the first thing people asked her was "oh, what do you do?". I mentioned how that's "so Toronto" and she's like "yeah! Everyone here cares so much about that!" (paraphrasing). We are so career-focused in Toronto. No one asks "what do you do for fun" or "what kind of music do you like" as an opener.

That being said, in terms of the Mayor job, it does require political experience and skill ... if RoFo can be Cllr for 10 years or whatever, it's clearly not a very high bar, but you WOULD expect your Mayor to at least have SOME experience managing large operations, whether as a politician or in industry...

edit: As for who on council would be good for mayor... Adam Vaughan, in my opinion. I mostly dislike the guy, but I feel I could trust him to make reasonable decisions based on facts and expert advice (well, except on the whole airport thing). He's also a loudmouth and a jerk which would be incredibly amusing to see. I mean, not just from an entertainment point of view, but politicians are so shy usually of saying how they truly feel. A more practical example would be Krystin Wong-Tam...

 

[Bebop17]

If the Muzik stuff is what takes the shine off Ford for his followers, I'm all for it. But... REALLY??? THAT'S what gets you all hot & bothered about this Mayor? Not the insane transit non-policy? The interference in the Portlands? The crack smoking at the office? What bugs Ford-ites is 'but where will the kids be able to hold their raves'?? This is why I am fascinated by politics. I can NEVER predict what will be a hot-button issue, particularly in Toronto.

I don't know if it's so much "where will the kids be able to hold their raves", as the fact that it's hitting Ford in the middle of his core message, the gravy train thing. The timing, especially, makes the optics terrible. A week ago, Ford made the news for ducking into Muzik late at night, after a call from the owner. This, when he had "escaped" to his office, where a strange burning rubber smell was detected, instead of attending a planned event with Di Giorgio in his ward. Plus, the news has been filled this week with reminders of the sketchy details of the contributions made by Muzik to FordFests. Finally, the decision will cost the city a ton of revenue. I think those are the types of elements that are making FordNation question this.

Can someone explain the relationship between the CNE Board and Council? Is there one? I read that one of the councillors (Perks maybe?) is hoping to get this issue revisited by Council. I sincerely hope it can be done, so that (a) this stupid decision can be overturned, and (b) the door would open for the public, the media, and other candidates to hold Ford's feet to the fire about it.

 

[Expatriot]

Dude(ette), "what do you do?" is literally the most commonly asked question in Toronto. Hung out last night with a few people and this one girl from California, and the first thing people asked her was "oh, what do you do?". I mentioned how that's "so Toronto" and she's like "yeah! Everyone here cares so much about that!" (paraphrasing). We are so career-focused in Toronto. No one asks "what do you do for fun" or "what kind of music do you like" as an opener.

Maybe she just liked talking to you. I live in California and people ask that same question all the time down here too.

 

[euler]

Maybe she just liked talking to you.

I should hope so, she was really cute!

It is a Toronto stereotype that everyone is very career-oriented though. I'm somewhat well-travelled and other than NYC I don't think I've heard people be so interested in what you do for money anywhere else, but might just be confirmation bias, and anecdotal evidence is not statistical evidence etc.

 

[Silence&Motion]

If the Muzik stuff is what takes the shine off Ford for his followers, I'm all for it. But... REALLY??? THAT'S what gets you all hot & bothered about this Mayor? Not the insane transit non-policy? The interference in the Portlands? The crack smoking at the office? What bugs Ford-ites is 'but where will the kids be able to hold their raves'?? This is why I am fascinated by politics. I can NEVER predict what will be a hot-button issue, particularly in Toronto.

I never said that this issue is worse than the transit anti-policy or the other terrible ideas Ford has tried to pass. I said this is worse than the crack smoking. In some ways the crack smoking is the least of our Ford-caused problems. I think the cronyism of the Fords is tied to many of their stupid policy ideas from Muzik to the portlands.

I'm convinced that at the municipal level, the right is much more likely to be involved in cronyism than the left (this does not necessarily hold for the province or the feds). There is a culture of wheeling and dealing among Toronto's right wing politicians that just does not exist among the left who come from the more anti-growth NYMBY culture. The people who have the ear of the right are private business owners. The people who have the ear of the left are academics and NGOs.

I really hope that this gets overturned at council.

 

[Greg Banks]

I don't know if it's so much "where will the kids be able to hold their raves", as the fact that it's hitting Ford in the middle of his core message, the gravy train thing. The timing, especially, makes the optics terrible. A week ago, Ford made the news for ducking into Muzik late at night, after a call from the owner. This, when he had "escaped" to his office, where a strange burning rubber smell was detected, instead of attending a planned event with Di Giorgio in his ward. Plus, the news has been filled this week with reminders of the sketchy details of the contributions made by Muzik to FordFests. Finally, the decision will cost the city a ton of revenue. I think those are the types of elements that are making FordNation question this.

Can someone explain the relationship between the CNE Board and Council? Is there one? I read that one of the councillors (Perks maybe?) is hoping to get this issue revisited by Council. I sincerely hope it can be done, so that (a) this stupid decision can be overturned, and (b) the door would open for the public, the media, and other candidates to hold Ford's feet to the fire about it.

I would think that the board's decision could be overturned as examples note ...Council had to approve the Coca Cola/CNE sponsorship back in April 2013 (which they did approve)....Council had to approve the Hotel X development after the CNE board it (which they did)...I therefore see no reason why council could not overturn the latest EDM decision at the CNE if it was brought forth as a CC motion or a member's motion....

 

[Kat_YYZ]

I have no idea what this has to do with Rob Ford, but Frank magazine for some time has been insinuating that Jim Flaherty had a drinking problem, offering as evidence:
-anonymous sources
-suspicious deletions from hotel bills (minibar raids?)
-this video of him speaking while allegedly 'overrefreshed'
-missing meetings at the recent G20
-emotional response to questions about Ford's crack-up

this can all just as easily be attributed to the medications he was taking.

My feelings too. If there is any possible connection to RoFo at all, it would be the unsubstantiated rumour mentioned up thread about JF's alleged fondness for escorts. But even that would be a stretch, I just can't see JF partying with RoFo at Musik, for example.

JF was close with the Ford family. That's the connection. Even if that bond was formed by going out drinking with Doug Ford Sr after work during their days in the Harris government, it's still a personal friendship; doesn't mean he's going to be buddies with every other drinker. I don't think politicians who drink hard and pay for escorts are in some secret fraternity where if you're at a hotel and see another pol stumbling out of a room with an escort, you think to yourself: "hey, he's one of us! I must rush to his defense if he's ever in trouble!" You still have to have some kind of actual personal friendship.